Jean Grey: Marvel Girl, Phoenix Appreciation 2018

[thechronic92]

The only good thing to come out of PR besides Jean returning is Jean renouncing the Phoenix. Phoenix mythos is all over the place these days, I want Jean as far away from it as possible. AvX was the final nail in the coffin for me. Jean should create her own path and have something that's only unique to her.

[mike7171]

The only good thing to come out of PR besides Jean returning is Jean renouncing the Phoenix. Phoenix mythos is all over the place these days, I want Jean as far away from it as possible. AvX was the final nail in the coffin for me. Jean should create her own path and have something that's only unique to her.

I agree, 2 things I want Jean to stay away from. The Phoenix and Cyclops.

[stwaz]

I agree, 2 things I want Jean to stay away from. The Phoenix and Cyclops.

If adult Cyclops comes back, you don't want Jean & Cyclops to get together? I can't imagine Marvel wouldn't go back to that well.

[phoenixzero23]

I saw this on Stephanie Hans' Instagram stories. She says she's got something with Jean going on. It could just be a cover, but I love her artwork, so I'm excited.
Attachment 73532

Amazing! i loved her previous cover with Jean
____PHXRES2017003-Hans-Var-FINAL.jpg

has she done more covers with her? I can't remember.

[Havok83]

Amazing! i loved her previous cover with Jean
____PHXRES2017003-Hans-Var-FINAL.jpg

has she done more covers with her? I can't remember.

What was that a cover to?

[phoenixzero23]

What was that a cover to?

It was a variant for Phoenix Resurrection #3.

[PhoenixStudies]

The only good thing to come out of PR besides Jean returning is Jean renouncing the Phoenix. Phoenix mythos is all over the place these days, I want Jean as far away from it as possible. AvX was the final nail in the coffin for me. Jean should create her own path and have something that's only unique to her.

I can understand that as well with how bad they have ruined/watered down the concept. I mean if the Phoenix Force has its own telepathy and telekinesis that it can grant to Colossus or Namor, then why did it ever need Jean Grey or Rachel Grey/Summers to begin with? If the Phoenix can create bodies for itself as per the '86 retcon, then why does it need a host either? If it can use a firefly or a sword, again why does it need any person to manifest through?

I think Teen Jean's pink psi-energy body form (tp/tk combo/psychic vampirism) is suppose to be her unique "power-up" that effectively replaces her Phoenix "power-up". I hope Adult Jean gets this ability and uses the pink raptor that sometimes comes with it.

I don't think Jean will ever be completely done with the Phoenix. There are still questions to be answered. For example, why was Teen Jean able to take control of the White Hot Room? Did Teen Jean retain the spark of the Phoenix? Why was adult Jean the "prime host" or a "White Phoenix of the Crown" anyways? Why do the most special Phoenixes seem to be red haired, green eyed, women (Jean, Rachel, Maddie, Hope, Fongi, Lady Phoenix/Cave-woman)? Why does Jean have a connection to the Phoenix across many different universes (616, Ultimate, AOA, manga, etc)? Why does the Phoenix have an affinity for the Grey lineage (and others like Rookshir/Korvus' family line)? Will Jean ever remember "playing God" with the Phoenix in the White Hot Room while she was dead?

It seems like to me that Claremont in Classic #43 and Morrison in New #154 were implying that White Phoenix was Jean's true self and that she is born/reborn as a human mutant to learn and grow and become a better Phoenix. In Classic #43, Death refers to Jean as a "baby Phoenix" (Claremont also had characters refer to Rachel in this way) and he and Jean compare her being sent back to life to "being in school" to learn hard lessons and to grow. In New #154, the Phoenix Consciousness tells Jean that she "lost concentration" and had became too emotionally engaged and forgot her true mission (as a Phoenix) while being alive. There is also a reference to being in training, if I remember correctly.

When Quentin ascended to the White Hot Room it says that he had met his parents there before he was born. Quentin-Phoenix later tells Jean-White Phoenix that they had met hundreds of times (there in the WHR?). Jean had told Bumble-Boy that we are always in the White Hot Room waiting for ourselves to arrive.

To me, Jean Grey is a human, mutant, and a Phoenix. Similar to Cassandra being a human, mutant, and a Mumundrai. Jean's White Hot Room is like the opposite of Cassandra's Black Bug Room.

Carey seemed to view the Phoenix as a category as well. He had Dark Beast say that Jean belonged to a category higher than mutant and how she had access to white fountains of cosmic energy or some such. Both Here Comes Tomorrow and End of Greys treated being a Phoenix as a part of Jean's and Rachel's mutation and family line. Rachel later dismisses this idea after the Phoenix Five fiasco, but it doesn't change that fact that there are stories that establish the Phoenix as having a genetic affinity for the Grey line and a certain Shiar family line.

I agree, 2 things I want Jean to stay away from. The Phoenix and Cyclops.

The two greatest loves of her life? I agree that she should have a break from them, but I expect them to be in her orbit again someday.

[phoenixzero23]

Jeen's pink form is underrated, is a total counter for other telepaths
I have been re-reading some old comics and she totally kicked Baby Xavier ass. If the writters don't forget about it she should easily be the most power psy on the planet and one of the most powerful in the universe (without the phoenix, with it she probably is the most powerful).


I really hope they don't forget about it. I think well used it can be great, it makes her powerfull to the point were she can punch Galactus but doesn't make her overpowered all the time. it's a nice balance.

[mike7171]

I can understand that as well with how bad they have ruined/watered down the concept. I mean if the Phoenix Force has its own telepathy and telekinesis that it can grant to Colossus or Namor, then why did it ever need Jean Grey or Rachel Grey/Summers to begin with? If the Phoenix can create bodies for itself as per the '86 retcon, then why does it need a host either? If it can use a firefly or a sword, again why does it need any person to manifest through?

I think Teen Jean's pink psi-energy body form (tp/tk combo/psychic vampirism) is suppose to be her unique "power-up" that effectively replaces her Phoenix "power-up". I hope Adult Jean gets this ability and uses the pink raptor that sometimes comes with it.

I don't think Jean will ever be completely done with the Phoenix. There are still questions to be answered. For example, why was Teen Jean able to take control of the White Hot Room? Did Teen Jean retain the spark of the Phoenix? Why was adult Jean the "prime host" or a "White Phoenix of the Crown" anyways? Why do the most special Phoenixes seem to be red haired, green eyed, women (Jean, Rachel, Maddie, Hope, Fongi, Lady Phoenix/Cave-woman)? Why does Jean have a connection to the Phoenix across many different universes (616, Ultimate, AOA, manga, etc)? Why does the Phoenix have an affinity for the Grey lineage (and others like Rookshir/Korvus' family line)? Will Jean ever remember "playing God" with the Phoenix in the White Hot Room while she was dead?

It seems like to me that Claremont in Classic #43 and Morrison in New #154 were implying that White Phoenix was Jean's true self and that she is born/reborn as a human mutant to learn and grow and become a better Phoenix. In Classic #43, Death refers to Jean as a "baby Phoenix" (Claremont also had characters refer to Rachel in this way) and he and Jean compare her being sent back to life to "being in school" to learn hard lessons and to grow. In New #154, the Phoenix Consciousness tells Jean that she "lost concentration" and had became too emotionally engaged and forgot her true mission (as a Phoenix) while being alive. There is also a reference to being in training, if I remember correctly.

When Quentin ascended to the White Hot Room it says that he had met his parents there before he was born. Quentin-Phoenix later tells Jean-White Phoenix that they had met hundreds of times (there in the WHR?). Jean had told Bumble-Boy that we are always in the White Hot Room waiting for ourselves to arrive.

To me, Jean Grey is a human, mutant, and a Phoenix. Similar to Cassandra being a human, mutant, and a Mumundrai. Jean's White Hot Room is like the opposite of Cassandra's Black Bug Room.

Carey seemed to view the Phoenix as a category as well. He had Dark Beast say that Jean belonged to a category higher than mutant and how she had access to white fountains of cosmic energy or some such. Both Here Comes Tomorrow and End of Greys treated being a Phoenix as a part of Jean's and Rachel's mutation and family line. Rachel later dismisses this idea after the Phoenix Five fiasco, but it doesn't change that fact that there are stories that establish the Phoenix as having a genetic affinity for the Grey line and a certain Shiar family line.




The two greatest loves of her life? I agree that she should have a break from them, but I expect them to be in her orbit again someday.

I see both of them as Jean's shackles. I want them to move on and not delve in the past, lessons learned. I see this whole Cyclops/Phoenix as a vicious cycle that ends up in the same spot as where it were before. Sure thing let them be close, but to go back to what was? Nope, been there done that. Move on. Let Rogue and Gambit be the "it" couple, i like their dynamics. Cyclops being a boy scout and Jean grey being gracious, its just a boooorrring pair up. I think Cyclops and Emma has better dynamics.

[FUBAR007]

I see both of them as Jean's shackles. I want them to move on and not delve in the past, lessons learned. I see this whole Cyclops/Phoenix as a vicious cycle that ends up in the same spot as where it were before. Sure thing let them be close, but to go back to what was? Nope, been there done that. Move on.

It baffles me that "Jott fatigue" is still a thing. Scott and Jean haven't been a functional couple in 17 years.

[JeisonWolf]

It baffles me that "Jott fatigue" is still a thing. Scott and Jean haven't been a functional couple in 17 years.

It's really normal, Jean and Scott have been separated a long time. But their love has been a really important part in their story, not only that, but his story despite the bad times was characterized by being a pure and real love, a really strong love that was not based on lust if not in the friendship. Add to that Dark Phoenix saga that is the best story of the X-men and also a Jott story, also in the tv shows they are always a couple or end up being it. For these and other things it is almost impossible to imagine Jean and Scott separated, that's why when the Scemma era happened it was not wanted that Jean return because they knew that it would mean the end of Scemma.

[JeisonWolf]

Amazing! i loved her previous cover with Jean
____PHXRES2017003-Hans-Var-FINAL.jpg

has she done more covers with her? I can't remember.

This is really beautiful! I love it!

Jeen's pink form is underrated, is a total counter for other telepaths
I have been re-reading some old comics and she totally kicked Baby Xavier ass. If the writters don't forget about it she should easily be the most power psy on the planet and one of the most powerful in the universe (without the phoenix, with it she probably is the most powerful).


I really hope they don't forget about it. I think well used it can be great, it makes her powerfull to the point were she can punch Galactus but doesn't make her overpowered all the time. it's a nice balance.

You know what? I prefer Jean without the Phoenix. Is it an important part of her story? Sure. But she has never brought her anything good, the two times she had her ended in her death, Dark Phoenix is a sign of "Jean dies". If the phoenix had only had Rachel, Nate or even Scott could be well given that they are related to Jean. But there have been many others, some even who have never met her. The Phoenix is no longer exclusive to Jean and personally I prefer the pink form, it is amazing and intimidating so people stop saying that Jean is nothing without the phoenix (we know it, but there are still many fools who still believe that).

[spirit2011]

I see both of them as Jean's shackles. I want them to move on and not delve in the past, lessons learned. I see this whole Cyclops/Phoenix as a vicious cycle that ends up in the same spot as where it were before. Sure thing let them be close, but to go back to what was? Nope, been there done that. Move on. Let Rogue and Gambit be the "it" couple, i like their dynamics. Cyclops being a boy scout and Jean grey being gracious, its just a boooorrring pair up. I think Cyclops and Emma has better dynamics.

Comics are a a cycle, the stories keep repeating theirselves. So manybe without Phoenix it ill force writers another storylike that doesn't involve Jean dying again and then ressurrecting (the last ressurrection took too long)
Scott isn't different from Phoenix. We already saw it, we don't need a 3rd repeat

It baffles me that "Jott fatigue" is still a thing. Scott and Jean haven't been a functional couple in 17 years.

Jean was dead all those years. It doesn't really count that way

[ThePhoenix]

I agree, 2 things I want Jean to stay away from. The Phoenix and Cyclops.

I on the other hand completely disagree.

I can understand that as well with how bad they have ruined/watered down the concept. I mean if the Phoenix Force has its own telepathy and telekinesis that it can grant to Colossus or Namor, then why did it ever need Jean Grey or Rachel Grey/Summers to begin with? If the Phoenix can create bodies for itself as per the '86 retcon, then why does it need a host either? If it can use a firefly or a sword, again why does it need any person to manifest through?

I think Teen Jean's pink psi-energy body form (tp/tk combo/psychic vampirism) is suppose to be her unique "power-up" that effectively replaces her Phoenix "power-up". I hope Adult Jean gets this ability and uses the pink raptor that sometimes comes with it.

I don't think Jean will ever be completely done with the Phoenix. There are still questions to be answered. For example, why was Teen Jean able to take control of the White Hot Room? Did Teen Jean retain the spark of the Phoenix? Why was adult Jean the "prime host" or a "White Phoenix of the Crown" anyways? Why do the most special Phoenixes seem to be red haired, green eyed, women (Jean, Rachel, Maddie, Hope, Fongi, Lady Phoenix/Cave-woman)? Why does Jean have a connection to the Phoenix across many different universes (616, Ultimate, AOA, manga, etc)? Why does the Phoenix have an affinity for the Grey lineage (and others like Rookshir/Korvus' family line)? Will Jean ever remember "playing God" with the Phoenix in the White Hot Room while she was dead?

It seems like to me that Claremont in Classic #43 and Morrison in New #154 were implying that White Phoenix was Jean's true self and that she is born/reborn as a human mutant to learn and grow and become a better Phoenix. In Classic #43, Death refers to Jean as a "baby Phoenix" (Claremont also had characters refer to Rachel in this way) and he and Jean compare her being sent back to life to "being in school" to learn hard lessons and to grow. In New #154, the Phoenix Consciousness tells Jean that she "lost concentration" and had became too emotionally engaged and forgot her true mission (as a Phoenix) while being alive. There is also a reference to being in training, if I remember correctly.

When Quentin ascended to the White Hot Room it says that he had met his parents there before he was born. Quentin-Phoenix later tells Jean-White Phoenix that they had met hundreds of times (there in the WHR?). Jean had told Bumble-Boy that we are always in the White Hot Room waiting for ourselves to arrive.

To me, Jean Grey is a human, mutant, and a Phoenix. Similar to Cassandra being a human, mutant, and a Mumundrai. Jean's White Hot Room is like the opposite of Cassandra's Black Bug Room.

Carey seemed to view the Phoenix as a category as well. He had Dark Beast say that Jean belonged to a category higher than mutant and how she had access to white fountains of cosmic energy or some such. Both Here Comes Tomorrow and End of Greys treated being a Phoenix as a part of Jean's and Rachel's mutation and family line. Rachel later dismisses this idea after the Phoenix Five fiasco, but it doesn't change that fact that there are stories that establish the Phoenix as having a genetic affinity for the Grey line and a certain Shiar family line.

The thing is Jean as Phoenix is Unique. She not just a White Phoenix but she is THE White Phoenix of The Crown. A title unique to her only. She is not just a host. Phoenix said to Xavier in the New X-Men that Jean is the house the Force lives. Many like Death you mentioned have described their special bond. That Jean and Phoenix are kindred spirits and Jean was made from the same cloth as Phoenix.

Also for me Jott now can be more interesting because Cyclops has been Phoenix too and knows how Jean felt back then.

[Disciple of Redd]

If anything, keep the Phoenix and get rid of Jott.

Despite all the nonsense and yet also because of the nonsense, Jean's relationship to her familiar is far more interesting than that milquetoast, characterless ship.