Jean Grey: Marvel Girl, Phoenix Appreciation 2018

[Digifiend]

Honestly, I don't see the point to any of it if the O5 are permanently mindwiped.

I still think that the memories should be locked away more than anything.

Yeah, though that would have consequences for Beast in particular, due to his magic knowledge.

[Portsian]

I loved this weeks Red, Jean shone again. The art was amazing. But i am starting to agree with some people about the pacing..... i just wanted a bit MORE movement in the plot. But happy to revel in the art, and Jean. Jean’s way of clearing her name, and her soeach at the end just hit so close to my heart, the Xmen being there for everyone.

Red is so relevant to todays world, it is THE best team book out there, not just an X book.

I didnt like the “To me my xmen” comment. It just seemed so superfluous......... there were only 2 xmen around and they were with her anyway. It was just a waste of an iconic statement, it just seemed to come at the wrong time.

Re Jean in Uncanny, jean belongs in the original book, but anyone else thinking the art portraying Uncanny seems lacking? And im not sure about the line up. Do we know if Red is continuing, or will it be stopping for Uncanny? I just cant see Heans vision being sorted by then.....

[Gambit, King of Thieves]

Well, you have to remember that Red is taking place a while in the past.

[magenta]

I thought Red was in the future compared to X-men Gold and Blue.

[Celestialbodies]

My biggest problem with Astonishing was X influencing their personalities. I think it goes against what Taylor had been doing in Red with Jean, and was unnecessary. Maybe Rosenberg can redeem himself in Uncanny.

I don't care about her losing to Xavier at all, to be honest. Even if Jean was meant to be unquestionably better, circumstances could still see him get over on her.

I more concerned with her character portrayal, not just powerwise but characterization, moving forward. When writers get characters they don't care about and don't care to think about, there's the likelihood of bad results.

That's how we get a Jean resurrection mini with no Jean (well just enough for her to say she should be dead) and the drab, suicidal mess seen in Astonishing Annual #1.

Both of these and there in lies my fear how a character is viewed by one writer is one thing but very easily a character's personality and abilities can be supplanted by a bad portrayal. For Jean it's worst because she's just returned and only has had a handful of new writers use her most of which has been trivial. More often than not comic book characters are written OOC, she's yet to have an established voice or exactly what's she capable of to have something like this happen so soon especially by Xavier.

You make it seem like PR and this one issue of Astonishing are the totality of Jean's appearances. She's the lead character in X-men Red where she's being the best X-hero in decades. She's front and centre in the Uncanny Disassembled promo and right beside Storm on the cover for Uncanny #1.



I agree and it's why I actually hate this annual and prefer to pretend it doesn't exist.

They aren't but Rosenberg is one of the writer stirring her course, if we've learned anything in the 14 years she's been gone just because a writer likes a character or their getting push doesn't preclude them from bad writing. Having actually read the Annual, my sole issue is Jean is WAY too passive and reactive when she should be a bit more aware. She's struggled in the past in not having a strong voice especially in comparison to her peers. I cite those two example because they're the most obvious and one is her actual resurrection. Jean should not be passive in stories that directly affect her and her narrative, from his writing at this point I don't personally believe he's as invested in developing Jean as he is in developing almost everyone else around her.

Im upset Taylor isnt on Uncanny. He is the only one I trust at this point

THIS, all of it!

Yes, but don't you think telling a story of how Jean starts to deal with the world, gets over the depression, finds new hope and resolve as she connects with new kids, people, mutants and reminisces with her old friends would be a better story than a panel of "Xavier brainwashed Jean to not be depressed, so she's happy and hopeful and ready to save the world" that will likely not be referenced again?

I feel cheated. When I read the first pages of the preview, I felt Rosenbergs depressed Jean was in character for someone who just came back and sees what all her friends have been through. I was looking forward to her talking with beast, Bobby, Warren and Xavier, all of them having moments together reflecting on what they've survived and sacrificed and deciding it was worth it and that they'd do it all over again, to see them cry together, laugh together, discuss their issues, how Bobby has finally come out, talk about beasts bitterness, discuss how Warren is now an introverted jekyll Hyde she'll of himself, talk to X, question him about what he's up to, make jokes about his new body while being wary, give that air of them finally being equals and comfortable with him after so many years, talk about his failings and how their working to forgive him.

We should have gotten Bobby and Warren discussing each others lives, these two haven't had a good conversation in years, Bobby making a joke about dating angel, beast regretting not making up with Scott before he died, then Xavier trying to pool the wool over them with telepathy and Jean stopping him but not letting the others know because she doesn't want them angry at him, and he comments about how she always kept his secrets and knew the dark things about him.


The story should have been about the O5 and Xavier Connecting.
We didn't need more reason for them to distrust him like brainwashing them or setting up for Lucifer's death in a way that they would automatically blame him
We didn't need pages of Bobby being an idiot,eating a giant burger and complaining about it
We didn't need a pointless villain plot that didn't really add anything in the end


There are so many better ways that Xavier could have shown them and convinced them about what the world would be like if they didn't fight and give them resolve. The way Rosenberg did it casts a shadow on the Xavier and O5 relationship and leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

Thank you, for articulating what I meant in such a better way, I personally am tired of Jean being window dressing in stories that should directly involve her in more than commenting on what's happening versus affecting it. All of this is much better and the kind of nuance Jean is going to need, yes Marvel is pushing her now compare that to anyone else they've pushed in the past, decade. Doesn't always mean a good thing, and I won't lie it sucks that someone like Taylor who understands the character on a deeper level than all the superficial and untrue characteristics most writers think of her. She isn't some somber, defeatist, cynic that requires "X" to remove her sorrow before she can move forward. She's met death before and faced it many times she should be more worldly and not easily affected yet, here again we have Rosenberg spouting about how "DEAD" Jean should be.

[PowerPlay25]

But Jean's ENTIRE family is dead. Everyone that ever loved her and a good many people that she loved, are gone and she didn't get to say goodbye, she woke up and they are no longer around. Her previous resurrection allowed her to wake up and reconnect with the Grey's but that isn't an option. Her marriage went belly up before she died. And what does she have to show for all of this? I think there should be some bitterness and cynicism to her character. If she weren't effected by all the loss she's endured, she would be the robot and Mary Sue, so many of the haters like to call her. I thought she played a very active part in the conclusion of Resurrection. As for her role in Astonishing Annual, she had the right to be depressed and angry, would she have eventually made her way past the anger and depression? Probably. But Xavier didn't want to wait to find out.

The last time we saw her, I don't count White Hot Room nonsense, she was being hurled into the sun, crying and asking Logan if Scott said anything about her. Scott was going to put an end to the triangle, all Jean did in the HCT arc, was die. Rosenberg and Taylor are LEAGUES ahead of GM in terms of doing good for the Jean Grey character.

And I really liked this weeks Red. I can agree that I wish it shipped twice a month but, I guess good things are worth waiting for.

[Disciple of Redd]

She didn't just die. She brought exactly what she didn't want to happen to full fruition in order to save the Earth. It was waaay more agency than anything Rosenberg has given her in 6 issues.

It's down to Kelly Thompson to save her.

[Gambit, King of Thieves]

What do you mean Kelly Thompson has to save her?

[spirit2011]

She didn't just die. She brought exactly what she didn't want to happen to full fruition in order to save the Earth. It was waaay more agency than anything Rosenberg has given her in 6 issues.

It's down to Kelly Thompson to save her.

So we are screwed

[thechronic92]

At this point, I also trust KT more than Rosenberg.

[PowerPlay25]

So we are screwed

LMAO. Amazing. Some think Kelly "I want to write a Emma/Scott Ongoing" Thompson is going to be good news for Jean. The writer has made her feelings towards Jean perfectly clear. I swear Fandom baffles me. But then again, there are plenty of Jean fans who FLOVE Morrisons work and that man is the reason she was shown the door for the past 14 years. lol.

She didn't just die. She brought exactly what she didn't want to happen to full fruition in order to save the Earth. It was waaay more agency than anything Rosenberg has given her in 6 issues.

Really? I remember her arc consisting of her having limited panel time. I think it was just the last issue where she hatched from an egg, LMAO, held the universe in her hand and cleared the board for Scott and Emma. I don't think that storyline was meant to do a thing for Jean accept make her as inhuman as possible and removed from the month to month comics so that Scott and Emma could move forward. Here Comes Tomorrow indeed. Rosenberg's Jean feels like a person to me. Whether she is deeply insightful (PR #5) or justifiably resentful (Astonishing Annual).

The New X-Men as written by GM had the personality of an uncooked carrot, but credit where it's due, she was a wonderful plot device for Scott and Emma to make their way past.

[Soulsword323]

The annual wasn't what I was hoping for, but I'm still cautiously optimist with Rosenberg's Jean. He is a fan of the character, and has said things that I think are promising regarding the character. Like wanting Jean to get focus as an individual as opposed to her old love connections (I'm paraphrasing here). I'm not worried about KT. She's working with two other writers and I don't think her dislike runs that deep. I'm not sure how Ed feels about Jean, but with her being used in Extermination, it should give us some kind of gauge as to how he'll handle her in Uncanny.

[Harpsikord]

I'm literally tired of people bitching about KT just because Jean isn't her favorite character. She's still a good, professional writer that has expressed the fact that she is - likely to her surprise - enjoying writing the character.

[Gambit, King of Thieves]

I love Kelly. She's nailing Mr. & Mrs. X, Jessica Jones is good, Rogue & Gambit was excellent, Hawkeye had good writing with "meh" art, and I haven't been able to read West Coast Avengers yet but I'm really looking forwards to it.

And on a semi-related note: What's everybody's problem with PR? I thought it was good.

[Havok83]

A new issue of Red is out and people are still complaining about the AXM annual