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  1. #4681
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    Quote Originally Posted by El_Gato View Post
    Lobo and Deathstroke were never really things, just rumors upon rumors. Nightwing though is apparently on hold until Reeves establishes his Batverse (just like Batgirl is). WB might like the PR that'll come from doing a Blue Beetle film so that'll increase it's chances of being made (Marvel certainly doesn't have a counter for Jaime since their Latino character roster is so weak, so DC has that going for them).
    Miles Morales say hi.

    Marvel could take Living Lightning and make a hit movie out of him so quick DC wouldn't know what hit them. They made ANTMAN a movie hit TWICE.


    . The fact that WB has changed the ethnicity of white characters while ignoring Vixen is ridiculous. They have a character with massive potential right there but they’d rather make Black Canary black.
    Because it's EASIER to sell Black Canary merchandise than Vixen. Yes it's a black one but it still benefits the original one. Who has a TON of stuff in trade.
    Look at Legion. How may significant stories were done with all the black characters? Very little-so thus you get race changed white heroes.

    Also it FORCES the writers to use that black character in a book or series. Because most are NOT going to waste time building up or using that original black character.

    And I am sure if anyone brings up Vixen-the FAILURE of Catwoman is used to stop that conversation. Meanwhile Vixen fans have to look at the success of Moon Girl, Shuri, Riri & even Ms Marvel.

  2. #4682
    Spectacular Member The_Lurk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Kelly View Post
    I've been thinking about how the New Gods could be cast with mostly black actors--not because I had read that was going to happen, but just because it occurred to me that this is one property where that could work and I wouldn't have a problem with it. They're gods, so how they appear to us is just our perception.

    I mean instead of casting a bunch of actors with British accents to play gods--as seems to be the usual Hollywood approach to casting the gods--howabout we try casting people of colour.
    POC love this idea
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SPZV9HoZSQ8

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  4. #4684
    Astonishing Member El_Gato's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyvolt2000 View Post
    Miles Morales say hi.

    Marvel could take Living Lightning and make a hit movie out of him so quick DC wouldn't know what hit them. They made ANTMAN a movie hit TWICE.




    Because it's EASIER to sell Black Canary merchandise than Vixen. Yes it's a black one but it still benefits the original one. Who has a TON of stuff in trade.
    Look at Legion. How may significant stories were done with all the black characters? Very little-so thus you get race changed white heroes.

    Also it FORCES the writers to use that black character in a book or series. Because most are NOT going to waste time building up or using that original black character.

    And I am sure if anyone brings up Vixen-the FAILURE of Catwoman is used to stop that conversation. Meanwhile Vixen fans have to look at the success of Moon Girl, Shuri, Riri & even Ms Marvel.
    Miles is seen more as a Black character than a Latino one honestly. He didn't have the same impact on Latinos as he did on African Americans that's for sure. Jaime is also exclusively Latino, something Marvel's Latino characters lack (since they're either half White or Black).

    I stand by what I said. Marvel has a WEAK roster of Latino characters, probably why in 10+ years all the MCU has to offer is Luis, while the DCEU has El Diablo, Pedro Peña, Renee Montoya and potentially Jaime Reyes in the near future ( not to mention the potential there is with Bane and Jessica Cruz).
    Done with DC. Can't handle the constant whiplash! Time to go on a hiatus!

  5. #4685
    Extraordinary Member Holt's Avatar
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    They're right. In general Marvel doesn't really have a great roster of Latino characters outside of Miles. I mean other than Miles it's like Nova, Sunspot (who people always forget is Afro-Latino and make him look caramel instead, ugh), Rictor, Echo, Arana and maybe Living Lightning.

    Nova is the only one I realistically see them giving a movie to in coming years, so DC has them pinned down there. Make Blue Beetle, make it fun and good, and watch the money roll in.

  6. #4686
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Lurk View Post
    POC love this idea
    Good to see you agree with my suggestion. Normally, when it comes to human characters, I don't think the race-bending works that well. Because what you want with an ethnicity is to show that environment that the character came out of. So you're not just changing the skin colour, you're changing where they came from--you can't make a Kentucky coalminer into a South Asian cowminder without a huge change to the back story (but goodness knows SCTV tried).

    However, when we're talking about aliens and gods--they aren't from our Earth at all. They are already exotic beings--and the colour of skin shouldn't be such a big deal. Therefore you should be able to colourblind cast Darth Vader, Thanos, Mongul, Darkseid, Brainiac or Zod--because they are not supposed to represent an Earth-based group.

    Now, if it's an established character that everyone has seen played by a white actor, it might be hard to recast Superman or Mr. Spock with a Japanese or a Turk actor--but even then, because of the alien nature of these characters, audiences will likely accept that. And when you have characters that hardly anybody but comic book fans know about, it's a lot easier to bring in the best actors to play those aliens and gods.

    And, other than Darkseid, there aren't any New Gods that have become established in the public arena. So casting should be more flexible. Jack Kirby himself was trying to be more up to date with his Fourth World, responding to the flower children, the civil rights movement and the Vietnam War. He was stretching himself and being inclusive. So with Mister Miracle, he made Shilo Norman the next in line for the job. Of course, Kirby was a bit clumsy with his inclusiveness. The movies should try to go further, now that we're in the 21st century.
    celebrating 50 years of 4 beatles crossing a zebra

  7. #4687
    Extraordinary Member Lightning Rider's Avatar
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    Race-bending discussions and debates get hairy pretty quickly, but I think there’s bending, and there’s potentially breaking. White-to-Black race lifts can be jarring. Momoa’s Aquaman preserved enough of a comic-accurate look, as does Garth on Titans. Shazam
    Could have been played by an Arab or Latino, as Ross tends to depict him. Dick being Roma allows for ambiguity. I could easily see an Asian, Middle Eastern, Caribbean Big Barda. That list of examples may seem to exclude blacks, but DC has so many underserved black characters that they should push those instead. Context for these characters and their overall profile is what can make it work.

    As for the New Gods, it does help for them to be larger than life divine beings. The furies, Darkseid’s elite, New Genesis all have potential to be diverse.

  8. #4688
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    I think with Aquaman you could have made a similar argument to Disney's Little Mermaid. The orginal Disney movie has a certain Caribbean flavour, so it makes sense to update the mer-people as Caribbean type folks for the new movie, even though the Hans Christian Andersen story might have been about North Atlantic mer-people.

    The underwater people of Atlantis in DC's version could have been in the South Pacific, so they could have looked like Jason Momoa--but the movie didn't go in that direction and went for making the Atlanteans look like Nordic people--leaving Arthur the odd man out.

    But I also think that if he wanted to and that's what the movie wanted, Jason Momoa could have made himself look exactly like the comic book version--he could have shaved his beard and gone blond--but that's not what Zack Snyder wanted when he cast him. Momoa was cast against type.
    celebrating 50 years of 4 beatles crossing a zebra

  9. #4689
    Spectacular Member The_Lurk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Kelly View Post
    Good to see you agree with my suggestion. Normally, when it comes to human characters, I don't think the race-bending works that well. Because what you want with an ethnicity is to show that environment that the character came out of. So you're not just changing the skin colour, you're changing where they came from--you can't make a Kentucky coalminer into a South Asian cowminder without a huge change to the back story (but goodness knows SCTV tried).

    However, when we're talking about aliens and gods--they aren't from our Earth at all. They are already exotic beings--and the colour of skin shouldn't be such a big deal. Therefore you should be able to colourblind cast Darth Vader, Thanos, Mongul, Darkseid, Brainiac or Zod--because they are not supposed to represent an Earth-based group.

    Now, if it's an established character that everyone has seen played by a white actor, it might be hard to recast Superman or Mr. Spock with a Japanese or a Turk actor--but even then, because of the alien nature of these characters, audiences will likely accept that. And when you have characters that hardly anybody but comic book fans know about, it's a lot easier to bring in the best actors to play those aliens and gods.

    And, other than Darkseid, there aren't any New Gods that have become established in the public arena. So casting should be more flexible. Jack Kirby himself was trying to be more up to date with his Fourth World, responding to the flower children, the civil rights movement and the Vietnam War. He was stretching himself and being inclusive. So with Mister Miracle, he made Shilo Norman the next in line for the job. Of course, Kirby was a bit clumsy with his inclusiveness. The movies should try to go further, now that we're in the 21st century.
    Well... you either ignored or willfully misunderstood the clip I attached. The man in there is really, really angry and feels disrespected by what he calls "lazy sloppy second tokenizations" (like upcoming Black Canary & probably Big Barda) instead of finally getting one or more of the magnitude of actual original POC characters. Sure, his examples is for MCU; but that does not matter in the context. These swaps are for ppl that don't care to begin with which shows me also how much the directors care about the property that have the luxury of making a movie of. Not much. Thats sad

    All WB is showing here is disrespect. If they would actually care for diversification we already would had a Cyborg movie; STEEL now has a real chance since the DCEU had a death of Superman Event and Vixen would join the BoP (...and Huntress would actually be a POC). They don't. All they do is p*** off fans and brag about it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Kelly View Post
    I think with Aquaman you could have made a similar argument to Disney's Little Mermaid. The orginal Disney movie has a certain Caribbean flavour, so it makes sense to update the mer-people as Caribbean type folks for the new movie, even though the Hans Christian Andersen story might have been about North Atlantic mer-people.

    The underwater people of Atlantis in DC's version could have been in the South Pacific, so they could have looked like Jason Momoa--but the movie didn't go in that direction and went for making the Atlanteans look like Nordic people--leaving Arthur the odd man out.

    But I also think that if he wanted to and that's what the movie wanted, Jason Momoa could have made himself look exactly like the comic book version--he could have shaved his beard and gone blond--but that's not what Zack Snyder wanted when he cast him. Momoa was cast against type.
    Only against the short hair type. He did had the bearded wild man look for a long time in comics (and some of the Animated shows IIRC) and currently does so again (I do guess this time its because of the movies success though).

    Momoas AQM is not the spot on representation of a specific AQM; but hes a really great amalgamation of several of them IMO.
    Last edited by The_Lurk; 08-25-2019 at 09:22 AM.

  10. #4690
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    I kind of like Momoa’s more Surfer-esque Aquaman even if he’s nothing like his comic book counterpart in terms of personality.
    "I love mankind...it's people I can't stand!!"

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  11. #4691
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amadeus Arkham View Post
    I kind of like Momoa’s more Surfer-esque Aquaman even if he’s nothing like his comic book counterpart in terms of personality.

    He always reminds me of the 90s Version. Replace his hand with a hook and it would be spot on^^

  12. #4692
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amadeus Arkham View Post
    I kind of like Momoa’s more Surfer-esque Aquaman even if he’s nothing like his comic book counterpart in terms of personality.
    Momoa's take works for what it is and plays to his strengths, even if I felt they could have used a little less low-brow humor and developed him into becoming a king more.

    I just hope DC in general doesn't make a big push to make him match Momoa's Aquaman. Bad enough comic Aquaman is running around shirtless with tattoos...
    Quote Originally Posted by lowfyr View Post
    He always reminds me of the 90s Version. Replace his hand with a hook and it would be spot on^^
    He reminds me more of Brave and the Bold Aquaman.

    I was disappointed he did not say "Outrageous" once in the movie.

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  14. #4694
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    I wonder if he's playing one of the villains...

  15. #4695
    Extraordinary Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amadeus Arkham View Post
    I kind of like Momoa’s more Surfer-esque Aquaman even if he’s nothing like his comic book counterpart in terms of personality.
    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    Momoa's take works for what it is and plays to his strengths, even if I felt they could have used a little less low-brow humor and developed him into becoming a king more.

    I just hope DC in general doesn't make a big push to make him match Momoa's Aquaman. Bad enough comic Aquaman is running around shirtless with tattoos...
    Arthur strikes me as the least well defined of the big 6 in terms of consistent personality, so I think basing the character around Momoa actually worked in ways it might not have for the other characters.

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