DC/WB Films/Worlds (No Spoilers)

[Pinsir]

spoilers:

Don't know if this counts as a spoiler but some of the Joker reviews are saying that the movie leaves things pretty open-ended in regards to whether it is a standalone or whether it is part of the DC cinematic universe. Some of them are even hinting it goes out of its way to set up some larger universe elements.

end of spoilers

There are three different Jokers in DC Comics continuity, any true fan™ of the comics knows this. Yes, Joker is part of the DCEU.

[Holt]

Joker is not part of the DCEU. It's a standalone thing. Like others have said, Phoenix is a guy who doesn't do sequels; he came very close to being cast as Doctor Strange, but balked at the commitment to crossovers and sequels because he was worried it wouldn't leave him time for smaller, personal projects.

If and when Joker shows up in Reeves' trilogy with Pattinson, it'll almost definitely be another recast (since I doubt he's using Leto).

[Pinsir]

Joker is not part of the DCEU. It's a standalone thing. Like others have said, Phoenix is a guy who doesn't do sequels; he came very close to being cast as Doctor Strange, but balked at the commitment to crossovers and sequels because he was worried it wouldn't leave him time for smaller, personal projects.

Just because it won't have a sequel doesn't mean its not part of the DCEU. It is a standalone movie, but its also part of the DCEU.

If and when Joker shows up in Reeves' trilogy with Pattinson, it'll almost definitely be another recast (since I doubt he's using Leto).

I never said he would show up in the new Batman films though. The Joker is set in the 80's. I just said it's a different Joker, like how there are multiple Jokers in the comics and in the tv show Gotham.

[Vordan]

Joker is not part of the DCEU. It's a standalone thing. Like others have said, Phoenix is a guy who doesn't do sequels; he came very close to being cast as Doctor Strange, but balked at the commitment to crossovers and sequels because he was worried it wouldn't leave him time for smaller, personal projects.

If and when Joker shows up in Reeves' trilogy with Pattinson, it'll almost definitely be another recast (since I doubt he's using Leto).

Gunn won’t be using Leto but does Reeves have the same aversion to him? If you ditched the crap tattoos and fake teeth Leto would look totally different. Not that I personally care, I’d be happy if Reeves Batman never fought the Joker, there’s so many other Bat Rogues I’d rather see.

[Frontier]

Gunn won’t be using Leto but does Reeves have the same aversion to him? If you ditched the crap tattoos and fake teeth Leto would look totally different. Not that I personally care, I’d be happy if Reeves Batman never fought the Joker, there’s so many other Bat Rogues I’d rather see.

I imagine Reeves wants a clean break. I imagine he'll address Joker at some point or in some way but it will probably be a completely different interpretation.

[Holt]

Just because it won't have a sequel doesn't mean its not part of the DCEU.

The fact that it's not in the DCEU is why it's not part of the DCEU. I don't even know why this is a discussion.

Gunn won’t be using Leto but does Reeves have the same aversion to him?

I don't know if Reeves has an aversion. I'm just thinking about it from what we've seen and heard so far. He recast Batman, he's recasting Alfred, and according to the trades like The Hollywood Reporter, he was very adamant going into negotiations that he have free reign to make this his own thing. If he uses Joker, I imagine he'll pick a new actor rather than inherit someone else's.

[Jim Kelly]

The reason I put titles in all caps is because that way people can tell the difference between JOKER, the movie, and Joker, the character. There are many Jokers, there is only one JOKER.

I used to use italics, but I found it easier to use all caps (just use the caps lock)--especially when italics or bold get taken out by different features on message boards (although even caps get taken out sometimes on this message board). And back in the old old days of DC letterpages and Direct Currents listings, they used to use upper case lettering for titles--so it's an homage .

Not to be pedantic, but it makes it a lot easier to figure out what people mean. Of course, this doesn't help me with IT (I always think that means I.T.--as in the I.T. guy from THE OFFICE--before I realize it's the title of a movie).

[Pinsir]

The fact that it's not in the DCEU is why it's not part of the DCEU. I don't even know why this is a discussion.

Confuzzled said some reviewers are interpreting the film as being part of the DCEU.

It should be noted that fans and creators have entirely different language in how they talk about these films. We've seen this with Reeves's Batman, when the director said these films were going to be 'independent (or something like that) and people shouted, "They aren't going to be in the DCEU!" and we now know this is false. Terms like 'standalone' and 'independent' do not mean the same thing to creators as they do to us. We saw this with this film already, when the director was asked if this movie was based a particular story line and the director said no, which lead people to think, it wasn't based off the comics at all. Which the director had to come out and say wasn't true at all, that the film is inspired by the comics.

[Vordan]

Given that Reeves wanted a high degree of freedom, I seriously doubt he would’ve come onboard if he had to follow someone else’s interpretation. Joker is a standalone Elseworld like take, it’s not part of the DCEU. That said, there’s barely even a DCEU really. Batman is getting a complete reboot and Superman most likely will as well, so it’s all a moot argument anyway.

[Castling]

Just because it won't have a sequel doesn't mean its not part of the DCEU. It is a standalone movie, but its also part of the DCEU.



I never said he would show up in the new Batman films though. The Joker is set in the 80's. I just said it's a different Joker, like how there are multiple Jokers in the comics and in the tv show Gotham.

As others have noted, Joaquin Phoenix's Joker is not part of the DCEU. Todd Phillips has been clear that Joker was to be first in a new Black Label line for DC Films where directors and actors could give their take on the characters, free from shared universes and ten year commitments. From a business standpoint, that's what Joker is: the first in a potential new film division at WB/DC.

[Pinsir]

As others have noted, Joaquin Phoenix's Joker is not part of the DCEU. Todd Phillips has been clear that Joker was to be first in a new Black Label line for DC Films where directors and actors could give their take on the characters, free from shared universes and ten year commitments. From a business standpoint, that's what Joker is: the first in a potential new film division at WB/DC.

I'm certain the original intent of the project was a film completely independent film from the DCEU, but that doesn't mean anything when addressing the final product. We're just have to see what these nods are when we can see the movie for ourselves.

Interesting parallel, The Killing Joke was originally an out of continuity story, but it immediately became part of DC canon after being published.

[Jim Kelly]

Isn't the "DCEU"--as some people will insist on calling it--in something of an ill-defined state right now? I don't think we'll have a very good idea of what exactly constitutes a shared universe for the movies projected to come out over the next few years, until we have enough of them that we can say which ones are connected and which ones fall outside the parameters.

[KangMiRae]

Given that Reeves wanted a high degree of freedom, I seriously doubt he would’ve come onboard if he had to follow someone else’s interpretation. Joker is a standalone Elseworld like take, it’s not part of the DCEU. That said, there’s barely even a DCEU really. Batman is getting a complete reboot and Superman most likely will as well, so it’s all a moot argument anyway.

Everything that involved Ben Affleck's Batman is being washed away with Reeves' work. If there's one thing I hope stays, it's the Batman/Wonder Woman dynamic. And this is really only if Reeves' work is the beginning of the soft reboot, and possibly followed by Superman like you said.

[Frontier]

I do find it kind of ironic that Affleck and Jared Leto will be the only Batman/Joker pairing to never see a single scene with each other (Batman attacking Joker and Harley's care doesn't count).

[Nite-Wing]

Isn't the "DCEU"--as some people will insist on calling it--in something of an ill-defined state right now? I don't think we'll have a very good idea of what exactly constitutes a shared universe for the movies projected to come out over the next few years, until we have enough of them that we can say which ones are connected and which ones fall outside the parameters.

They have gone on record that most movies are going to be self contained so you won't see references to Aquaman or Shazam in Birds of Prey or any more crossovers like Justice League.
Fans are not so quick on the uptake about what this means but essentially you have a shared universe but no hope of a payoff anymore and no overarching story that any of these movies are building towards.
That's probably a big reason why the WW movies seem to be stuck in period pieces and not touching the current landscape post JL


Who knows what Reeve's Batman will be but considering he seems to be recasting all of Bruce's current supporting cast from the snyder movies it seems like its unconnected from the remaining DCEU(WW, Aquaman, Suicide Squad, Shazam, Birds of Prey, New Gods etc)

So yeah while it is sad to see that you aren't getting a lot of the comic accurate adaptations similar to what the MCU is doing that's entirely down to the powers that be wanting it to be that way.
Todd Phillips recently said that the lower the budget the more creative freedom WB gives you. allowing for a R rated Joker movie or R rated Birds of Prey
The bigger budget movies have to play it more safe and consequently be as generic as possible