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  1. #12151
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pinsir View Post
    Its more about mainstreaming Wonder Woman's mythology and there is some simplifying to it as well. The clay origin has never actually been the reason for Wonder Woman's super powers (in the Golden Age, she got her powers through amazon training), but having her be a demi-god does explain her powers. The mainstream culture also gets the idea of a demi-god and most 'Greek mythology' media features them.

    Its part of a similar trend we see elsewhere; In the Golden Age, Aphrodite (referred to as the Goddess of Love) was the only patron to the Amazons, but in the wider culture Aphrodite is a minor, support goddess, so she got replaced by Athena. Hercules is a bad guy in the original stories, but in pop culture, he's a good guy so he is often depicted in a lot of WW as a good guy too. Zeus as a character didn't even appear until the final issue of WW Vol #1, during Crisis of Infinite Earths, yet now, in Post-Crisis he was kind of a major supporting character.
    About this...

    Anyone remember the two Hercules movies we got in 2014? One of which starred The Rock? Remember how bad and forgettable they were?

    Hercules might be known in pop culture but he hasn't been a big deal since the Disney movie from the 90s. I bet if you made a WW movie with him as a villain, most people wouldn't even blink. Superman might still be a big enough deal that it matters when he or pastiches of him are made villains but I don't think the same can be said of Hercules.

  2. #12152
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gitagon View Post
    Some online vitriol compared to people who are dying and have had their land stolen from them? This is just some internet heat. Gadot is a Zionist and she always finds times like these to make these pro-Israel statements.

    I've never forgotten her post in 2014 right after those kids got bombed while playing on a Beach. It was sickening that she could even make a post like that especially when holding her own kid.

    Being roasted online and getting your feelings hurt that people don't like you for supporting an Apartheid state can never be compared to the actual suffering happening on the ground.

    Personally, I'm just hoping she gets recast after WW3. So far Momoa and Cavill were like the only dudes without issues in JL and now Cavill is gone.

    Affleck - sexual assault. Protecting rap*st brother.

    Heard - I don't comment on the Depp issue since people always get heated on who is innocent or guilty but she had another battery case with her ex-girlfriend that she got arrested for.

    Leto - p*do allegations, even from prominent celebrities.

    Miller - assault on camera

    These guys are playing the JL and I'm not asking for them to be as virtuous as the actual JL but they shouldn't have issues like this.
    Wasn't the accusations of Heard assaulting her girlfriend said to be a lie or misrepresentation? I recall said girlfriend defending Heard when the Depp allegations came out?

  3. #12153
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    Quote Originally Posted by Samm View Post
    The Snyderverse actors really are full of controversy huh? I think only Cavil and Mamoa, so far, have escaped the controversy. Honestly though, I don’t see anything wrong with what Gal said. I would have worded it more harshly, attack someone with rockets, expect retaliation!
    Zachary Levi is also still in the public’s good graces so far. Along with Amy Adams.
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  4. #12154
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    Quote Originally Posted by I'm a Fish View Post
    As for what Gal said...It’s all very, very complicated, and something I myself do not want to get to far into due to the awareness of my own ignorance on the subject.

    But, I believe the biggest point on controversy in her message was referring to the Palestinians as “neighbors” as opposed to Palestinians. The U.S. does not recognize Palestine as a state, which has caused much controversy, since it might very well be the first step towards a lasting peace as it would established permanent boarders and stop Israel’s invasion of Palestine, but in turn would mean recognizing the parts of Palestine that are occupied by the Hamas terrorist organization, which would mean legitimizing that territories organization.

    Again, it is all very complicated. And there is more to it than that, but that is what I believe is the cause of controversy surrounding the tweet. And again, I myself am not too well informed on the subject, something which I may have to change since this conflict could be the start of America getting involved in another war.
    Yeah, it seems very complicated and i sadly dont have the time to research the subject as much as i should to say something not ignorant.

    But im pretty sure Gal Gadot doesnt support Genocide and Mass Executions as some on Twitter claim.
    Maybe what she said was a bit naive, i dont know, it doesnt strike me as her in any way supporting Mass Murder etc as people on twitter say she does.

    Twitter tends to be a one sided echo chamber that leaves little room for situations to be complicated.

  5. #12155
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    Quote Originally Posted by DarkViKing View Post
    Twitter tends to be a one sided echo chamber that leaves little room for situations to be complicated.
    Twitter and other sites are not made for discussions. What happens there and elsewhere is "I'm right and you're wrong!!!" and then "No, I'm right and you're wrong!!!"

    As for politics, guys, let's keep it in the Community section where it belongs.
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  6. #12156
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    Okay, let me try this again: if you want to discuss politics, go find another forum for it.
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  7. #12157
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    The Wonder Woman comics have been racially diverse since the Perez comics when the clay origin was still used. I didn't see any major poc characters brought into the book during any of the New 52 runs other than Hestia who was mostly in the Superman/Wonder Woman book and was really just a shallow replacement for Nubia and Philippus (and in fact they whitewashed her most notable non-white villain, Dr Poison). The WW comics have also had sympathetic and heroic male characters before the New 52 as well. The Zeus origin "fixed" a problem that never existed in the first place.
    Well I for one would like all the characters to be Greek. They live on and island and are isolated from the world. In this case race is important because they're Greek and the Greeks are white. Their society should be pretty homogeneous. Even today, Greece is pretty homogeneous. What does a character like Nubia ( who is African) have to to with Greek Mythology ? It doesn't make sense to me. I for one would make Nubia and Vixen sisters and have their story set in Africa. As for Doctor Poison I think they deliberately did that change because of the Japanese were on the side of the Axis during World War 2 ( even though in the movie it is World War I ). They didn't want to show a disfigured Japanese woman as a villain because Asians were depicted as ,,hideous monsters" ( in other words, racist caricatures) in the comics of the 40s .

  8. #12158
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    Disney's Hercules underperformed at the box office. It made only 252.7 million worldwide. As you mentioned, Hercules is known in popular culture but people aren't interested in seeing another Hercules movie.

  9. #12159
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    Oh please spare me. Nothing about the amazons is greek. In the mythos they weren't greek. In the comics nothing bout their culture seems to be from ancient greece other than the aesthetics. Their origin story doesn't even say they are greek, and in various origins they were created by the gods and thus could look like whatever the writer chooses. Plus why wouldn't other women join their ranks over time as they got lost at sea and ended up there?

  10. #12160
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha View Post
    Oh please spare me. Nothing about the amazons is greek. In the mythos they weren't greek. In the comics nothing bout their culture seems to be from ancient greece other than the aesthetics. Their origin story doesn't even say they are greek, and in various origins they were created by the gods and thus could look like whatever the writer chooses. Plus why wouldn't other women join their ranks over time as they got lost at sea and ended up there?
    Well according to Greek Mythology, the Gods look like the Greeks themselves. This is something that most people don't know about Greek Mythology. You wouldn't said the same thing if it was Egyptian mythology of African mythology. I agree with the last part, other woman can join their ranks if they got lost and sea and etc.

  11. #12161
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    Quote Originally Posted by Veni View Post
    Well I for one would like all the characters to be Greek. They live on and island and are isolated from the world. In this case race is important because they're Greek and the Greeks are white. Their society should be pretty homogeneous. Even today, Greece is pretty homogeneous. What does a character like Nubia ( who is African) have to to with Greek Mythology ? It doesn't make sense to me. I for one would make Nubia and Vixen sisters and have their story set in Africa. As for Doctor Poison I think they deliberately did that change because of the Japanese were on the side of the Axis during World War 2 ( even though in the movie it is World War I ). They didn't want to show a disfigured Japanese woman as a villain because Asians were depicted as ,,hideous monsters" ( in other words, racist caricatures) in the comics of the 40s .
    The Amazon's were based off of Scythian culture, who were of Iranian decent. They where also nomadic and occupied much of Eurasia, and could have been composed of many ethic groups. (Although the Greeks did describe the Scythian's they encountered as "ruddy")

    Doctor Poison was changed for the movie because Japan was an ally of America in World War 1, but in Vol.4 of the Wonder Woman comics, she was changed from Japanese to Caucasian.

    And in her original appearance in the comics, she was not disfigured but wore an ugly mask to disguise herself as a man.
    Last edited by I'm a Fish; 05-13-2021 at 10:31 AM.

  12. #12162
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    Quote Originally Posted by Veni View Post
    Well I for one would like all the characters to be Greek. They live on and island and are isolated from the world. In this case race is important because they're Greek and the Greeks are white. Their society should be pretty homogeneous. Even today, Greece is pretty homogeneous. What does a character like Nubia ( who is African) have to to with Greek Mythology ? It doesn't make sense to me. I for one would make Nubia and Vixen sisters and have their story set in Africa.
    To add to the point that the Amazons are only vaguely Greek, in Greek Mythology the gods created humanity generally, which obviously goes beyond just white people, and there were Ethiopians and other "non-whites" present in Ancient Greece. There's no need for them to be all white.

  13. #12163
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    Quote Originally Posted by Veni View Post
    Well according to Greek Mythology, the Gods look like the Greeks themselves. This is something that most people don't know about Greek Mythology. You wouldn't said the same thing if it was Egyptian mythology of African mythology. I agree with the last part, other woman can join their ranks if they got lost and sea and etc.
    But the amazons aren't gods so what does that have to do with anything? And the gods look like the greeks but they can also look like whatever they want. They can be animals or trees or anything at all.

  14. #12164
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    Well yeah Ethiopia is in Africa and at one point the Persians tried to occupy Ancient Greece twice and failed. It's a known fact that ancient Greeks thought that everyone who wasn't Greek was a barbarian.

  15. #12165
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    Quote Originally Posted by I'm a Fish View Post
    The Amazon's were based off of Scythian culture, who were of Iranian decent. They where also nomadic and occupied much of Eurasia, and could have been composed of many ethic groups. (Although the Greeks did describe the Scythian's they encountered as "ruddy")

    Doctor Poison was changed for the movie because Japan was an ally of America in World War 1, but in Vol.4 of the Wonder Woman comics, she was changed from Japanese to Caucasian.

    And in her original appearance in the comics, she was not disfigured but wore an ugly mask to disguise herself as a man.
    Here is a map of the area where most archeologists think the Amazons, if they existed in the form we're sort of familiar with, lived.



    It's probable that the spoke a blend of several languages including Scythian filtered through whichever dialect of Greek they were speaking, and likely several others, nearly all extinct. And yes, Themiscyra? did in fact exist in Anatolia as a town, not an island, somewhat nearish Troy, (which some forms of the legend have them fighting in on the side of Troy and all dying, their chief after unwisely fighting Achilles. Many of the names for the Amazons also come from the mythology....thought they pretty much all suffered gruesome deaths.

    This is fun too:

    https://www.nationalgeographic.com/h...ations-science

    It gives the sometimes funny translations of the names for Amazon warriors, (individuals), on Greek vases. None of THOSE names ever made it into the comics I'll bet....


    Looking at that map, they should have gotten together with XO from Valiant...
    Last edited by achilles; 05-13-2021 at 12:17 PM.

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