DC/WB Films/Worlds (No Spoilers)

[Primal Slayer]

There's something about Hawkmans costume that....seems off to me. I think the ears are to long or maybe they are just to skinny.

[Lightning Rider]

There's something about Hawkmans costume that....seems off to me. I think the ears are to long or maybe they are just to skinny.

They're too long and flare out a bit much. I'd say the helmet isn't a perfect fit either.

[Refrax5]

There's something about Hawkmans costume that....seems off to me. I think the ears are to long or maybe they are just to skinny.

Yeah the helmet looks too big for his head..

[Refrax5]

This...is not remotely accurate. Finn was very popular. The vast majority of fans liked him. The vast majority of fans were upset directly because of his his misuse after the Episode VII. If Disney is acting like those films never happened it's because of the egregious missteps after the first installment, not because a few trolls didn't like Finn.

Yeah, I hated the new trilogy, but I thought the new characters (Rey, Finn, Poe, and Kylo) were the strongest part.

[skyvolt2000]

This...is not remotely accurate. Finn was very popular. The vast majority of fans liked him. The vast majority of fans were upset directly because of his his misuse after the Episode VII. If Disney is acting like those films never happened it's because of the egregious missteps after the first installment, not because a few trolls didn't like Finn.

Yet they have no problem showing Kylo Reyn in new stuff or releases of merch.

If those missteps were that bad-nobody should be seen.

And I am sure John would say it was more than a few trolls.

As would Michael B Jordan, Leslie Jones and the cast of Lord of the Rings Amazon show.

Folks tire of studios (who can't be touched by trolls) being silent when the actors catch all sorts of heck on Earth.

Lets not forget the trolls are NOT limited to fake fanboys-they can also be EMPLOYEES.

Since online allows anonymous antics. If we pull back that curtain who would we find? One who has power to hire or fire or greenlight stuff?

[Frontier]

At least more of an attempt was made compared to Hawkman's LoT costume.

[mace11]

Well, you literally just said they were disappointments, so yeah...

Also, as to your other points, sorry but you're wrong. They have underperformed. They made money, but just making money is not enough. That's not how the business works. As "unfair" as it seems, these movies are measured against the projections of what they should be making, rather than what they actually make. So, yeah, for a "regular" superhero movie, making $700 or $800 million at the box office is not at all shabby, but for the most hyped releases of the year from the biggest cinematic franchise of our time? Yeah...that's decidedly below the projections they had for these films.

That especially seems the case for Dr. Strange as it was set to feature not just the MCU debuts of Reed Richards and Charles Xavier, but also presumably set up the entire future direction for the MCU (i.e. the Multiverse Saga). And these elements were all teased in the film's marketing. So, for it not to hit the $1 billion mark would yes, for this franchise, be underperforming. We know this because before it was released, there were a lot of projections and speculation that it would join the billion dollar club.

To act as if word of mouth and reception didn't have an impact therefore is to effectively bury your head in the sand. We can't really blame the pandemic because Top Gun Maverick was able to hit the billion dollar mark and it was in theaters at the same time as MoM. Even Spider-Man: No Way Home almost hit two billion and it likewise came out post-pandemic.

So, for these films to perform the way they did is how we end up with headlines like this:

‘Thor: Love and Thunder’ Has Franchise-Worst Box Office Fall in Second Weekend, Adds $46 Million

Black Panther 2’s Box Office Can Fix A Disappointing MCU Trend

saying things like this:



So, sorry, there is something about the films themselves that negatively impacted their performance.



Joker also has 11 Oscar nominations to its name. Something I don't think Doctor Strange 2 will have.



Except, those films actually did come out when things were bad in the midst of the pandemic. Birds of Prey came out at the literal start and TSS came out when Delta was surging. In May of this year, we'd already moved past being in a pandemic according to health experts.



But you're acting as if word of mouth and reaction had NO impact. And that's just not true.

Let's agree to disagree and move on.

[Refrax5]

At least more of an attempt was made compared to Hawkman's LoT costume.

I like the look of Hawkman overall and the helmet looks cool, just a bit big on him in a few shots. Also, Aldis Hodge seems like a cool guy that's enthusiastic about the role, so I'm not being overly critical.

[Jokerz79]

Well, you literally just said they were disappointments, so yeah...

Also, as to your other points, sorry but you're wrong. They have underperformed. They made money, but just making money is not enough. That's not how the business works. As "unfair" as it seems, these movies are measured against the projections of what they should be making, rather than what they actually make. So, yeah, for a "regular" superhero movie, making $700 or $800 million at the box office is not at all shabby, but for the most hyped releases of the year from the biggest cinematic franchise of our time? Yeah...that's decidedly below the projections they had for these films.

That especially seems the case for Dr. Strange as it was set to feature not just the MCU debuts of Reed Richards and Charles Xavier, but also presumably set up the entire future direction for the MCU (i.e. the Multiverse Saga). And these elements were all teased in the film's marketing. So, for it not to hit the $1 billion mark would yes, for this franchise, be underperforming. We know this because before it was released, there were a lot of projections and speculation that it would join the billion dollar club.

To act as if word of mouth and reception didn't have an impact therefore is to effectively bury your head in the sand. We can't really blame the pandemic because Top Gun Maverick was able to hit the billion dollar mark and it was in theaters at the same time as MoM. Even Spider-Man: No Way Home almost hit two billion and it likewise came out post-pandemic.

So, for these films to perform the way they did is how we end up with headlines like this:

‘Thor: Love and Thunder’ Has Franchise-Worst Box Office Fall in Second Weekend, Adds $46 Million

Black Panther 2’s Box Office Can Fix A Disappointing MCU Trend

saying things like this:



So, sorry, there is something about the films themselves that negatively impacted their performance.



Joker also has 11 Oscar nominations to its name. Something I don't think Doctor Strange 2 will have.



Except, those films actually did come out when things were bad in the midst of the pandemic. Birds of Prey came out at the literal start and TSS came out when Delta was surging. In May of this year, we'd already moved past being in a pandemic according to health experts.



But you're acting as if word of mouth and reaction had NO impact. And that's just not true.

MOM made 955 million and Thor Love and Thunder 755 million.

Joker and Aquaman were billion dollar movies.

But The Batman only made 15 million more than Thor Love and Thunder with 770 million. Shazam made 355 million, MOS made close to a hundred million less than Thor Love and Thunder. WW made about 70 million more and BVS starring the DC Trinity only made about a 100 million more than Thor Love and Thunder and a hundred million less than MOM. Dr. Strange and Scarlet Witch made a hundred million more than the DC Trinity. In your attempt to dunk on the MCU you're justifying the attempts to ditch the DCEU given the metric you're using for success.

[Zagre]

At least more of an attempt was made compared to Hawkman's LoT costume.

AGree. Though to be fair, his was a bit part.

[Green Goblin of Sector 2814]

MOM made 955 million and Thor Love and Thunder 755 million.

Joker and Aquaman were billion dollar movies.

But The Batman only made 15 million more than Thor Love and Thunder with 770 million. Shazam made 355 million, MOS made close to a hundred million less than Thor Love and Thunder. WW made about 70 million more and BVS starring the DC Trinity only made about a 100 million more than Thor Love and Thunder and a hundred million less than MOM. Dr. Strange and Scarlet Witch made a hundred million more than the DC Trinity. In your attempt to dunk on the MCU you're justifying the attempts to ditch the DCEU given the metric you're using for success.

Again, no. You've basically missed the entire point of the argument. The literal point of my post is that you can't just look at the numbers, but the projections for the box office that come from audience expectations and behavior.

It's as simple as this: the DCEU hasn't built up the same expectations as the MCU. And it especially hadn't at the time that the films you cite came out. The MCU by 2017 and 2019 and especially by now has had a reputation of having almost every major milestone film in their universe hit the billion dollar mark. Even Captain Marvel, which was a pretty middling film, managed to hit that mark because Marvel made it seem like it "mattered" to their shared universe. So, Dr. Strange 2, which is supposed to be the catalyst film for the next big MCU saga, not hitting that mark is cause for at least some concern.

The DCEU does not have that reputation, at least not yet, so projections for DCEU films are very different from MCU ones.

So, Wonder Woman making $800 million for her first ever movie that came out before audiences had any sort of expectation from her as a cinematic character is not bad at all. Shazam making $355 million, despite being a character almost nobody had heard of, is also not that bad considering early MCU films made about the same and justified it getting a sequel. Aquaman getting to the billion dollar mark, in spite of the factors working against it then, was almost like a cinematic miracle and the first sign of the shared universe working in DC's favor.

So, no, my post is not evidence that they should scrap the DCEU and your attempt to seize on it as such is more so proof of a lack of understanding on how the film industry works.

[Robotman]

I love Hawkman’s costume in the comics but it’s a design that’s hard to translate into live action. The mask/helmet has a big beak and giant wings jutting out the sides. That generally doesn’t look great on a real person. Im surprised they went for a comic accurate look with it. I would have minimized everything so the live action mask looks a bit more like Wolverine’s. sometimes things look a lot better in motion, so I’m not gonna judge Hawkman’s look until I see the movie.

I just wish they would have gone with green as his base color instead of red. Also, why are they covering up Hawkman? He’s supposed to be a shirtless warrior who hits people with a spiked morningstar! Lose the armor and shoulder pads!

[Vordan]

[Robotman]

Ok, that looks way better than the initially teaser trailer. I'm now excited to see this flick. Though there are a lot of tired cliches in the trailer. “These powers are a curse.” Walking away from an explosion in slo mo.

I like Hawkman's bravado. The guy uses a mace and morningstar as his weapons of choice. He's not going to be timid. It looks like the weapon transformed into an ax at one point, so I guess they're going with a New 52 version of Hawkman's gear. The Nth metal is inside of him and he can create weapons.

Waller was a nice surprise and her appearance adds that connected universe vibe that Zaslav and co. are looking for.

There's one person in this trailer who seems to be generating the most interest and excitement from social media and it's not Black Adam.

It's this gentleman right here!



So cool to see Fate walk in the room with that Pierce Brosnan swagger.

[I'm a Fish]

I know Black Adam isn't the most emotive character, but boy does he seem bland in this.

I hope his personality bounces off the other characters at least.