DC/WB Films/Worlds (No Spoilers)

[Steel Inquisitor]

So, what mate? How does superman deal with criminals? No, wait, wait! let me guess. He gives them a chocolate cake and asks them nicely. Dude! Even postcrisis superman has capacity to atleast do the @bold things you mentioned.

Because that's not how he's supposed to act, even that Superman has been Superman for a while but acts like he's on his first week. He's not Batman in a red cape. He had no business doing that in either of those situations, he wasn't in danger there. And given how dangerous his powers are it'd be incredibly stupid for him to be a super-hero if that encounter with Lex was all it took to nearly burn a person alive. When did Post-Crisis Superman ever do things like that?

Superman has been typecasted and boxed into so called stereotypical boyscout roll for so long that we get these kinds of reaction from something very trivial.This is how people see superman as.

Though i would admit this pretty funny.

Only by people who don't know the character. People used to think Captain America was a joke, too. The only thing that separates Superman from Cap is bad writing. That's not being typecast that's how he's been written for the majority of his time when he's owned by DC Comics. What DC has trouble with is writing him so he's not a caricature, especially in live action. There's more options than boy scout parody and nearly burning someone's face off with his heat vision.

[manwhohaseverything]

Because that's not how he's supposed to act, even that Superman has been Superman for a while but acts like he's on his first week. He's not Batman in a red cape. He had no business doing that in either of those situations, he wasn't in danger there. And given how dangerous his powers are it'd be incredibly stupid for him to be a super-hero if that encounter with Lex was all it took to nearly burn a person alive. When did Post-Crisis Superman ever do things like that?



Only by people who don't know the character. People used to think Captain America was a joke, too. The only thing that separates Superman from Cap is bad writing. That's not being typecast that's how he's been written for the majority of his time when he's owned by DC Comics. What DC has trouble with is writing him so he's not a caricature, especially in live action. There's more options than boy scout parody and nearly burning someone's face off with his heat vision.

Dude! There is no supposed too.Get that through your head . There are thousands of versions of superman. Moreover, i seriously think you haven't actually read superman comics of any versions of the character. You seem to have an idea of about the character in your head due to superman being palimpsest. That's it. Also, at multiple points superman did wore batman like cape, even during the prototype phase. Just to throw in that trivia. Finally, superman and batman do have commonalities. Why? They were both inspired from same characters like zorro and one of the is inspired by previous one on top of it.

Dude! Cap became interesting because they adopted the idealist and not the rule book clinging boyscout. Superman went down hill when he became a boyscout. Cap was a fugitive who fought for freedom from winter soldier onwards. That's what made him interesting. Superman is that kind of idealist when people who get him write him . @bold Yet, you are the one who constantly use slippery slope arguments and making a fuss like the sky is falling about "i will take you in without breaking you" . Listen to yourself dude. Take your own advice. Actually read superman comics, both old and new. He has been around and has a history.

[batnbreakfast]

The more this man talks, the more I get excited. I like his approach of not retreading the conventional origin story, but it still being an origin story for the character in terms of getting a handle at this crime-fighting thing. Reeves take on Batman is bound to be one of the most inspired takes on the character yet.

I remember Reeves saying he likes Batman'66. Doesn't shine through in the footage.

[Steel Inquisitor]

Dude! There is no supposed too.Get that through your head . There are thousands of versions of superman. Moreover, i seriously think you haven't actually read superman comics of any versions of the character. You seem to have an idea of about the character in your head due to superman being palimpsest. That's it. Also, at multiple points superman did wore batman like cape, even during the prototype phase. Just to throw in that trivia. Finally, superman and batman do have commonalities. Why? They were both inspired from same characters like zorro and one of the is inspired by previous one on top of it.

I've read numerous Superman comics, and watched many cartoons, tv shows and movies on him. Not all Supermen are equal, and most have been dismissed in our conversations which aren't Golden Age Superman or Snyder's. Again, I ask: show me examples of Post-Crisis Superman doing things like that. I was being figurative about my Batman comment, but if you have any examples that fit the description I'd like to hear it and no Elseworlds. Canon examples. They do have things in common but they're not identical, their relationship is interesting because of what ideals and tactics they do share and those they don't. For example, Batman's all about stealth and striking fear into people, even other super-heroes. They're not clones of each other, Superman's not the "bad cop."

This ins't about prototypes, this is about how he's written in comic and other media. Canon.

Dude! Cap became interesting because they adopted the idealist and not the rule book clinging boyscout. Superman went down hill when he became a boyscout. Cap was a fugitive who fought for freedom from winter soldier onwards. That's what made him interesting. Superman is that kind of idealist when people who get him write him . @bold Yet, you are the one who constantly use slippery slope arguments and making a fuss like the sky is falling about "i will take you in without breaking you" . Listen to yourself dude. Take your own advice. Actually read superman comics, both old and new. He has been around and has a history.

Cap's all about the rule book, but when he's pushed too far he goes rogue then he comes back. He has a code, its just not as rigid as Superman's. There are lines he won't cross, which is why he carries his shield while Bucky Cap carried a gun and USAgent is his conservative AzBats. I use those arguments when they're required - like Black Adam. He's a dictator who murders people, he's an anti-hero/villain like Namor. The Rock gets that, its why his presentation was perfect by acknowledging how Black Adam thinks. He's the biggest bully in the yard and he'll bury anyone who tries to take him down. Kind of like Bane in that respect. He thinks he's a hero when he's really a dangerous nutcase who believes simply because he has power it makes him right. Johnson wasn't subtle about heavily implying he wants Black Adam to take down the Justice League. This is more than what inspired Superman, its how he's portrayed in media.

Cap went back to working with SHIELD in the comics after Winter Soldier in 616. He's effectively the Avengers liaison to SHIELD during Hickman's Avengers.

[Robotman]

Maybe I’m in the minority, but I’m just kinda tired of Batman movies. It looks interesting but not really anything special. It’s Batman meets Seven I guess. Reeves is a great director so I’ll give it a chance.

[batnbreakfast]

Maybe I’m in the minority, but I’m just kinda tired of Batman movies. It looks interesting but not really anything special. It’s Batman meets Seven I guess. Reeves is a great director so I’ll give it a chance.

Planet of the Apes is kinda depressing. Why not apply that to Batman

[Agent Z]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rB-FvIrIML4

"Next time they shine your light in the sky, don't go to it. The Bat is dead, bury it. Consider this mercy." That's something Ultraman would say when he's in a good mood. No Superman would day that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSnt30x0uew

Mr Fantastic couldn't stretch this far. Issuing threats is something every superhero has done at least once and there is nothing about this line that is exclusive to Ultraman. You'll jump through any hoops to make this Superman look like a villain just because he doesn't fit your own narrow-minded idea of what Superman is like.

2:38 About to light Lex like a Christmas tree.

Yeah because no Superman has ever reacted viscerally to his loved ones being put in danger. Especially towards Lex.

"I'll take you in without breaking you, which is more than you deserve." That's something AzBats would say, not Superman.

Now you're really scraping the bottom of the barrel. How is telling somebody, "I'll arrest you without hurting you" thuggish.

Superman's so easy for a bad guy to manipulate him into nearly committing murder. Just kidnap his mother or girlfriend, and he'll do it on command. His impulse control is absolutely terrible.

If it were that easy, he wouldn't have taken a long time to consider the option, then go to Bruce trying to diffuse the situation and then beg him to help him. It certainly took far more prodding than Byrne's Superman who murdered (that's the proper use of that word by the way) three powerless Kryptonians because they threatened to come to his world and kill everyone despite being stranded on a desert rock.

How was Snyder's Superman anything like that?

He wasn't.

[Steel Inquisitor]

Mr Fantastic couldn't stretch this far. Issuing threats is something every superhero has done at least once and there is nothing about this line that is exclusive to Ultraman. You'll jump through any hoops to make this Superman look like a villain just because he doesn't fit your own narrow-minded idea of what Superman is like.

They're not supposed to sound like a mob enforcer when they do it, or barely have control over rather powers from killing people when they get emotionally distraught. And this is Superman, there are expectations here. He's not Deadpool. I don't need to do anything to make this Superman look villainous.

Yeah because no Superman has ever reacted viscerally to his loved ones being put in danger. Especially towards Lex.

It's not about being upset, it's having discipline to not accidentally murder people when a villain throws them for a loop. This Superman failed that test miserably.

Now you're really scraping the bottom of the barrel. How is telling somebody, "I'll arrest you without hurting you" thuggish.

That's not about arresting anyone, its a not so subtle death threat. From a god like being who knows he can grind Batman to dust right there. It wouldn't be until much later Batman would be able to go toe to toe with him as an equal. The threat was I'll kill you if you don't do as I say. His language wasn't subtle with its imagery.

If it were that easy, he wouldn't have taken a long time to consider the option, then go to Bruce trying to diffuse the situation and then beg him to help him. It certainly took far more prodding than Byrne's Superman who murdered (that's the proper use of that word by the way) three powerless Kryptonians because they threatened to come to his world and kill everyone despite being stranded on a desert rock.

Cavill's Superman was played like a fiddle by that Lex at every step. He had such poor impulse control on killing people he came very close to murdering Lex, despite the fact he's a veteran super-hero by now. Lex posed no physical threat. Superman didn't try to diffuse the situation until Lex blackmailed him into trying to kill him like a puppet. Instead, he inflamed the tension. He never reached out like he should have. Even when he did try to explain what's going on to Batman in their fight it's a pathetic attempt.

What Post-Crisis Superman did with those Kryptonians was not the same thing Cavill's did. He had a history of being against killing, it left emotional and psychological scars for years, he was a reluctant executioner - he didn't kill them in heat that of battle. Not all killings are identical circumstances, if Cavill's had done this nobody would have any problems with him doing it. He didn't.

He wasn't.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

Maybe I’m in the minority, but I’m just kinda tired of Batman movies. It looks interesting but not really anything special. It’s Batman meets Seven I guess. Reeves is a great director so I’ll give it a chance.

You're not the only one. There was nothing special in the trailer, nothing was ever gonna beat TDK so having a shared universe Batman as the next was the right idea plus the trailer looked murky as all could barely see a thing couldn't even make out the bat suit until I saw a brightness enhanced still!

Also the beat down on the thug, there is no way that thug survived that, I wonder if people are gonna have the same energy to complain not my Batman for this film...

[manwhohaseverything]

He wasn't.

And that's too bad, for me. As for villainy, it depends on the lines you draw for yourself and what others perceive you as.I wish Snyder's superman was more goldenage superman.

[manwhohaseverything]

I've read numerous Superman comics, and watched many cartoons, tv shows and movies on him. Not all Supermen are equal, and most have been dismissed in our conversations which aren't Golden Age Superman or Snyder's. Again, I ask: show me examples of Post-Crisis Superman doing things like that. I was being figurative about my Batman comment, but if you have any examples that fit the description I'd like to hear it and no Elseworlds. Canon examples. They do have things in common but they're not identical, their relationship is interesting because of what ideals and tactics they do share and those they don't. For example, Batman's all about stealth and striking fear into people, even other super-heroes. They're not clones of each other, Superman's not the "bad cop."

This ins't about prototypes, this is about how he's written in comic and other media. Canon.



Cap's all about the rule book, but when he's pushed too far he goes rogue then he comes back. He has a code, its just not as rigid as Superman's. There are lines he won't cross, which is why he carries his shield while Bucky Cap carried a gun and USAgent is his conservative AzBats. I use those arguments when they're required - like Black Adam. He's a dictator who murders people, he's an anti-hero/villain like Namor. The Rock gets that, its why his presentation was perfect by acknowledging how Black Adam thinks. He's the biggest bully in the yard and he'll bury anyone who tries to take him down. Kind of like Bane in that respect. He thinks he's a hero when he's really a dangerous nutcase who believes simply because he has power it makes him right. Johnson wasn't subtle about heavily implying he wants Black Adam to take down the Justice League. This is more than what inspired Superman, its how he's portrayed in media.

Cap went back to working with SHIELD in the comics after Winter Soldier in 616. He's effectively the Avengers liaison to SHIELD during Hickman's Avengers.

Reading something and actually have an educated opinion on something are two different. Granted, i don't consider myself that. Finally, Superman used to bully back those corrupt people in power for the little. He did it in new52 as well. Moreover, no version of superman is that much of a push over. Clark shoving a guy in trash can in bryne man of steel.

Even donner superman went back to the dinner guy to teach him a lesson.

So, your idea of superman is mere perception. Not reality. Moreover, you being figurative doesn't change the fact that superman and batman will always be made from the same mold. I never said the word "identical". Superman has a larger than life personality and is very upbeat. Batman has a personality of a stick, generally. Superman is a swashbuckling hero.Batman can be a serious downer.

No mate, cap was about the rule book when he trusted his superiors and authority figures implicitly. That changed, so much so he didn't believe in the registration accords. Blah! blah!I never said black adam's morality is what superman's is. Read my previous post carefully. Especially, my replies to @frontier.There is a general feel to a character. Goldenage superman had larger than life charismatic personality. He wasn't a goody two shoes wet towel which superman is normally portrayed as.Moreover,only idiots who haven't read goldenage comics would think goldenage superman doesn't have moral limitation.Nobody here said, black adam= goldenage superman. But, the personality, the charisma, the leanings, and the way the do things is very similar. Your insinuations prove your ignorance. Not mine. Cap going back to shield doesn't negate that freedom will always be what captain fights. Superman fights for truth, justice and the same, Not some rule book created by state for control and distribution of violence . He would break law to protect the weak and the oppressed. He always has. He always will.

[the illustrious mr. kenway]

I thought I'd be sick of Batman but Reeves brought me back in. I dug the trailer and I'm super hyped for it. I don't mind the more antihero/harsh take on him. If you wanted to do a more mature take on Batman, you'd have to acknowledge that this dude would be on a more slippery slope than the others.

[Flash Gordon]

Who would’ve thought WW, Aquaman, and Shazam would be the new Trinity? What a world we live in.

It's a dream come true, they're the best.

DC should really lean into Wonder Woman being their top gun. Promote Aquaman and Shazam a whole bunch, too.

[SiegePerilous02]

I'm not - but then I watch everything Batman, from Batman Unlimited to the Scooby Doo and Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles crossovers to the Lego stuff, so for me it all gets balanced out. If you're that tired of the uber violence, maybe you need to check out some of the other Batman offerings that aren't as violent?

I have (at least the Lego stuff). But the stuff like the Nolan films, BvS, and now Reeves, as well as the Arkham games, are far more prolific and mainstream than any of that stuff could hope to be. Plus the comics have been doing stuff like that for a long ass time.

My feelings about it are complicated, because I think this film overall looks extremely well put together and has a lot of promise so I'm willing to see where it goes. But we have more than enough Batman films in general and I find the pushing of the heightened violence with Batman to be inherently distasteful since he's a character primarily meant for kids to view as a hero. So I'm basically at "we really don't need this, but this specific thing still looks cool and it could execute its ideas well so I'm interested."

Yeah because no Superman has ever reacted viscerally to his loved ones being put in danger. Especially towards Lex.


Now you're really scraping the bottom of the barrel. How is telling somebody, "I'll arrest you without hurting you" thuggish.

I'm not okay with the film in general anymore, but I agree that these two points aren't worth criticizing too much. Flashing his angry laser eyes when he's upset (but not following through with anything, and this definitely warrants being angry) is in character. And dude is not nor has he ever been a pacifist. He used to do things comparable to modern Batman or even things that would make him look like a wuss. Superman is not a smiling farmboy 24/7, let him have an edge.

If it were that easy, he wouldn't have taken a long time to consider the option, then go to Bruce trying to diffuse the situation and then beg him to help him. It certainly took far more prodding than Byrne's Superman who murdered (that's the proper use of that word by the way) three powerless Kryptonians because they threatened to come to his world and kill everyone despite being stranded on a desert rock

I think the execution of this scene is a little botched though. I agree he's not a murderous thugs looking for a fight and wants to appeal to Bruce. But the scene is constructed very poorly. He's saying things like "there is no time" and "you don't understand" without actually just spitting it out and putting the ball in Bruce's court. The fight partially happens because this Superman is incredibly lousy at communicating. Yeah Batman has all the weapons firing at him, but they are just an annoyance. And there is that bit right before he flies Batman through the building where he shoves him into an alley and slowly walks towards him. Valuable seconds he could have spent opening his mouth.

[Gaius]

Speaking of Daredevil, it looks like they're going for black lenses like Daredevil instead of the white eyes, so kind of the same effect just with a different color.

Yeah, now that you mention cowl does look a bit Netflix Daredevil-ish.