DC/WB Films/Worlds (No Spoilers)

[Frontier]

To each their own, I loved BOP.

Fair enough. I didn't care for Harley's role in it.

[achilles]

This is where I strongly disagree - look what's happened with DC's solo films indeed - their only billion dollar movies happen to be the very solo Aquaman, and Joker which is outside of the DCEU entirely, which disproves each movie doing worse opening than the last (never mind the last two were released to streaming during a pandemic). Look at the movies that've done the worst, BOP and TSS which were the films most trying to connect/build the shared universe back up. Look at the movies that are most highly anticipated, do you really think connected DCEU Flash is going to outdo The Batman? What makes the big box office hits isn't the connectivity, it's the quality.

Look, you're not going to convince me. But you don't need to, you've already won back in 2012 - DC still has Avengers money dreams, so they're going to go in on connectivity again. You don't have to convince me of that, we all know the lack of connections is a temporary blowback from 2017 JL, but it won't last, it was never planned to last. And that's a real shame.

Also, guessing the people you know are fellow nerds? Doubt the general audience cares that much. And really, of all the people to crossover, Harley and Wondie not meeting is a shame? Really?

That was because those movies were...bad. And because they tried to get you to care about a bunch of characters who hadn't yet had much development or given you any reason to care. Poor execution nearly across the board.

[Badou]

What makes the big box office hits isn't the connectivity, it's the quality.

I'd say quality and marketing. I think marketing plays a big factor. The BoP movie was horribly marketed in my opinion and a big reason why it underperformed, but the first Suicide Squad I think was marketed well despite being a mess of a movie. They were smart in putting the Joker in a lot of the marketing and making the trailer and promotion a lot more colorful/upbeat with 80s rock songs to try and jump on that Guardians of the Galaxy hype. Then the movie did really well. So instead of calling this movie Suicide Squad 2, or some other title to indicate it is the 2nd SS movie, they just called it The Suicide Squad which might have confused some people. Might be a Wii and WiiU situation. It will be very interesting to see how that Suicide Squad video game does. If that also underperforms then maybe the Suicide Squad brand isn't what WB/DC thinks it is despite pumping all this money in it to turn it into a big franchise.

[Robanker]

The Suicide Squad was a fun time. It's very indulgent in a James Gunn way and by no means perfect, but I had a good time with it.

[Robotman]

I'd say quality and marketing. I think marketing plays a big factor. The BoP movie was horribly marketed in my opinion and a big reason why it underperformed, but the first Suicide Squad I think was marketed well despite being a mess of a movie. They were smart in putting the Joker in a lot of the marketing and making the trailer and promotion a lot more colorful/upbeat with 80s rock songs to try and jump on that Guardians of the Galaxy hype. Then the movie did really well. So instead of calling this movie Suicide Squad 2, or some other title to indicate it is the 2nd SS movie, they just called it The Suicide Squad which might have confused some people. Might be a Wii and WiiU situation. It will be very interesting to see how that Suicide Squad video game does. If that also underperforms then maybe the Suicide Squad brand isn't what WB/DC thinks it is despite pumping all this money in it to turn it into a big franchise.

I’ve found it to be the opposite. A lot of people I talked to were very hesitant to watch The Suicide Squad because the first movie was so bad.

[Colossus1980]

Me neither, least not one without Batman or Joker in it. Harley just doesn’t seem to be the “fourth pillar” they thought she was.

WB overestimated Robbie's HQ popularity. I remembered when they planned to have her star in SS2, BOP, Gotham City Sirens, BOP VS GCS, Joker and Harley, and a HQ solo. Talk about overkill. I like her performance but she didn't warrant so many film projects IMO. Reynold's Deadpool was much more popular but Fox didn't try and get him to star in so many projects before Fox was bought out by Disney.

[achilles]

WB overestimated Robbie's HQ popularity. I remembered when they planned to have her star in SS2, BOP, Gotham City Sirens, BOP VS GCS, Joker and Harley, and a HQ solo. Talk about overkill. I like her performance but she didn't warrant so many film projects IMO. Reynold's Deadpool was much more popular but Fox didn't try and get him to star in so many projects before Fox was bought out by Disney.

I've noticed this happens a lot in Hollywood. They get all high on someone like Robbie, and then give her or him power and lots of roles...before knowing if audiences like them. I can recall a succession of actors, (mainly though not always male), just like her, built up to be huge by Hollywood, the next big thing, and given all sorts of parts and publicity...and then, nothing, they hit a wall and disappear.

Just know if the actor you're betting big on is going to be worth it is what I'm saying.

[Johnny Thunders!]

I thought Ratcatcher, Pokadot Man, and Bloodsport all had terrific origin stories with just enough character development. Side note, I really recommend reading X-Force by Mike Allred and Peter Milligan. The anarchy and macabre humor especially!

[Vordan]

I’ve found it to be the opposite. A lot of people I talked to were very hesitant to watch The Suicide Squad because the first movie was so bad.

That’s how it always goes. If you manage to get a ton of people to see a bad film, whether through a great marketing campaign or because people want so badly to see your movie because the premise of it excites them, (aka the BvS factor) you’ll likely make a lot of money on that film. But when the sequel comes around, that’s when the impact of the first film’s crappiness has an impact. People stay away because the first film was so bad and they’ve just got no interest.

Also the first SS movie had Batman, Joker, and Will Smith in it. Those three definitely helped it’s performance at the box office.

[Pinsir]

I often take my mother to see DC movies and she didn't want to see TSS because of the Delta variant. If you're in Texas or Florida, the darkest days of the pandemic are coming. Not to mention you can just watch TSS on HBO MAX one of the most popular streaming services in the country. Like they're are so many variables as to why this film is underperforming, like every other film this year.

[Thezmage]

This is where I strongly disagree. You need the connectivity to make big box office hits! Look what’s happened to the DCEU with its solo approach… every single entry has opened lower than the last. I know several people who don’t really care about DC films because there’s no overarching story, the movies lead no where basically! Hopefully WB has realized his and what Gunn said is true because the overwhelming majority want connectivity and to see these characters interact with each other! Such a shame we haven’t seen Harley and Wonder Woman interact, and they’ve been around for 5 years!

People go see movies that aren't connected every day. I think it's hurting them more to cling to the DCEU branding as it's setting up false expectations from the audience

[Vakanai]

Fair enough. I didn't care for Harley's role in it.

Have you cared for Harley's role in any of these movies? Or for the character in any medium in general? If you're not a fan of Harley, it'd be hard to care for her role in most things.
Not saying you don't, I don't know, just that I know a lot of people here don't care for Harley at all. Or that they find her too overexposed in comics over characters they do like, and that carries over to their feelings on film too.

That was because those movies were...bad. And because they tried to get you to care about a bunch of characters who hadn't yet had much development or given you any reason to care. Poor execution nearly across the board.

The Suicide Squad wasn't, and it's still not doing hot. Have you any evidence that the lack of connectivity is harming DC movies other than what some of your friends have said? Especially considering the solo Aquaman and Joker films have been their most successful since the end of the Nolan Dark Knight trilogy?

I'd say quality and marketing. I think marketing plays a big factor. The BoP movie was horribly marketed in my opinion and a big reason why it underperformed, but the first Suicide Squad I think was marketed well despite being a mess of a movie. They were smart in putting the Joker in a lot of the marketing and making the trailer and promotion a lot more colorful/upbeat with 80s rock songs to try and jump on that Guardians of the Galaxy hype. Then the movie did really well. So instead of calling this movie Suicide Squad 2, or some other title to indicate it is the 2nd SS movie, they just called it The Suicide Squad which might have confused some people. Might be a Wii and WiiU situation. It will be very interesting to see how that Suicide Squad video game does. If that also underperforms then maybe the Suicide Squad brand isn't what WB/DC thinks it is despite pumping all this money in it to turn it into a big franchise.

Agreed, marketing is also hugely important.

[Vakanai]

I often take my mother to see DC movies and she didn't want to see TSS because of the Delta variant. If you're in Texas or Florida, the darkest days of the pandemic are coming. Not to mention you can just watch TSS on HBO MAX one of the most popular streaming services in the country. Like they're are so many variables as to why this film is underperforming, like every other film this year.

I am fully vaccinated but I live in Alabama and we're not far behind those states I imagine in the spread of the Delta variant, and while vaccination protects me from needing to be hospitalized or the risk of death I can still get a breakthrough infection. My mom is also vaccinated and got covid a bit over a month ago. So I'm staying out of theaters as well until things are more fully under control. Even vaccinated there's no reason to risk getting sick, it isn't immunity.

[Vakanai]

People go see movies that aren't connected every day. I think it's hurting them more to cling to the DCEU branding as it's setting up false expectations from the audience

This. The Jungle Cruise is reportedly doing well, and it has no connections to anything else. People act like all superhero films need to be "connected" to matter anymore when the same rules of good movies still apply like they always have.

[achilles]

Have you cared for Harley's role in any of these movies? Or for the character in any medium in general? If you're not a fan of Harley, it'd be hard to care for her role in most things.
Not saying you don't, I don't know, just that I know a lot of people here don't care for Harley at all. Or that they find her too overexposed in comics over characters they do like, and that carries over to their feelings on film too.

The Suicide Squad wasn't, and it's still not doing hot. Have you any evidence that the lack of connectivity is harming DC movies other than what some of your friends have said? Especially considering the solo Aquaman and Joker films have been their most successful since the end of the Nolan Dark Knight trilogy?

Think you're confusing me with someone else. I haven't mentioned connectivity; I don't think it's all that important one way or the other---it's how good the movie is. The Suicide Squad, (or SS...which is it---the good one?) was good. Taxi...er, Joker, was also good. Aquaman I hear was fun. Some others, not so much.