DC/WB Films/Worlds (No Spoilers)

[Frontier]

https://twitter.com/flashfilmnews/st...154908188?s=21


Dude isn’t always reliable but he’s had a couple legit scoops over the years. Thought this was worth sharing since it may explain how they’ll reboot the mainline universe.

Now it sounds like discount Endgame .

I wonder what they'd do. Prevent Superman's death? Robin dying? Shazam cameo? The first SS movie never happened?

[Vordan]

Now it sounds like discount Endgame .

I wonder what they'd do. Prevent Superman's death? Robin dying? Shazam cameo? The first SS movie never happened?

Depends entirely on who is staying and who is going. Could see them eliminating Cavill killing Zod and then Cavill dying, or they could just straight up eliminate Cavill and have Sasha replace him as the protagonist in the rebooted timeline version of those movies. Affleck is eliminated and Keaton is now in his spot. Maybe Vic never has an accident so that’s how they write out Cyborg.

[John Venus]

I doubt they could get Ray Fisher to show up for anything.

And the movies are facing the same obstacle that comics do when they reboot; they can't do a clean boot because getting rid of the 'bad' stuff means getting rid of the 'good' stuff too. COIE couldn't afford to erase NTT, Nu52 couldn't afford to erase Morrison's Batman or Johns GL and the DCEU can't afford to erase Shazam, Wonder Woman, Aquaman and The Suicide Squad.

[Vordan]

Oh that DC’s continuity mess has jumped to their movies is hilarious to me. That’s what happens when you just keep letting Snyder dig deeper and deeper because you want that Avengers movie so badly. If WW hadn’t been a success they probably would’ve killed the whole universe and rebooted but now they can’t or won’t.

[Morgoth]

Now it sounds like discount Endgame .

I wonder what they'd do. Prevent Superman's death? Robin dying? Shazam cameo? The first SS movie never happened?

Most likely they will retcon the most controversial things (Snyder's ideas in particular), don't think they will completely get rid of Cavill, but they probably somehow change his story and add Supergirl there. Maybe they will make him older, so later they can add Jon into picture.
And, judging by all those rumors, they just will replace Affleck with Keaton, and maybe his movies will become canon for this new DCEU.

[Robotman]

Michael Keaton just turned 70 years old, so he’s not going to be replacing Affleck as an active Batman. He’ll appear in costume in The Flash (maybe a Kingdom Come inspired suit) but he’s not a long term option. I’m sure he’s going to be a mentor character but he’s not going to be on the starting lineup of the next Justice League.

[Guy_McNichts]

Funny thing is, back when they first started suggesting Flash's movie was going to "fix" the DCEU...and this rumor has been going for years now...I thought of a pretty easy and simply explanation to erase the more divisive elements.

As we know, in the DCEU, Wonder Woman has been around since World War I. According to Justice League, she never stopped being a hero, she just wasn't public about it because Steve's death and reasons.

So say, at some point during the Flash, he goes back in time to fix whatever has gone wrong, and while in the past, crosses paths with Diana. He convinces her to help him, and in the process, she reveals herself as Wonder Woman to the world. And that winds up being the critical thing that changes history.

Ripple affect:

- Wonder Woman goes public and she becomes an inspiration to the world from that point on.

- Because Diana, a super-powered being, is such a positive influence, Jonathon Kent doesn't discourage Clark from using his powers; in essence acting more like the Pa Kent we know from the comics. Therefore Clark becomes the Superman we know and love earlier in his life, and goes on to become a proper beacon of hope like in the comics.

- Superman and Wonder Woman become allies and they inspire other heroes like Flash and Aquaman to be more open with their heroics, and it's Zod's invasion that leads to the formation of the Justice League. Together they defeat the evil Kryptonians, preventing Metropolis from getting destroyed and without Superman having to kill Zod.
As an added bonus, suggesting the League can defeat an army of Kryptonians might help wash out the bad taste of Justice League reducing them to a bunch of chumps who can't do anything without Superman.

- If Metropolis isn't destroyed, Batman doesn't want to kill Superman and if Zod's not dead, Luthor doesn't create Doomsday. No Doomsday, Superman doesn't die.

- Superman never dies, no Steppenwolf. Therefore, no crappy Justice League movie with slaughtered Amazons, jobbing League, and all the other garbage both versions that piece of shite gave us.

Pretty simple, but we all know that's not going to happen. I'll bet anything they're going to make the secret to fixing the DCEU Batman in some way because it always has to be about the almighty Bat.
Personally, I'd rather they just didn't bother trying to "fix" the continuity. The DCEU as it was intended is dead in the water and maybe that's for the best. Focus on solo movies and reboot when the few things that are working run their course.

Also, although I'm not really a big Flash guy, it's pretty lame his first big movie is going to be a continuity mangle where he shares the spotlight with a Batman and a Supergirl and who knows what else.
If I was a Flash fan, I'd be pretty pissed.

[John Venus]

My suggestion is that they simply pivot to this universe and leave 'Earth Snyder'. WW, WW84, Aquaman, The Suicide Squad and Shazam happened exactly as they did on this earth. Main difference the Christopher Reeves movies and Keaton's first two Batman movies are also canon to this universe. Sasha Calle would be the daughter or clone of Reeve's Superman.

The other theory is that the movie ends up with Flash traveling back in time and causing some kind of the change in the timeline and by the time he gets back, he realizes something is different now but it's left open ended what.

The other option is that Keaton's '89 Batman universe ends up merging with the DCEU world with Sasha Calle Supergirl and Keaton Batman replacing Cavill and Batfleck.

The other other option is that MoS, BatvsSup, JL and Snydercut JL are all outright erased. Everything else is canon. The new Batman is Battinson. The new Superman equivalent will be Sasha Calle. Timeline rewrite would mean that she was the one that Bloodsport shot and not Cavill's Superman. If Michael B Jordans Val Zod or Ta Nehisi's Superman project works out, he will later join in as the new Superman. The new JL will be Calle's Supergirl, Pattison's Batman, Gadot's Wonder Woman (possibly replaced by Nubia if her third movie comes out before the next JL), Mamoa's Aquaman and Shazam.

[RobinGA]

I suspect rather than fixing the DCEU what we will get is them restarting
projects, with new actors. Reimagining that kind of thing.
What we have now is probably what we will have in the future.

If they have a real reboot that would work it has to start with Superman.
But the Superman projects are in tatters. Until at least Coates find a way to save it.
But everything flows from Superman, for the obvious reason that he sets the
template. That was the way it worked in the Golden Age, he has a reverence
beyond simply his powers. If Superman is screwed up, nothing else will work.

[Agent Z]

I suspect rather than fixing the DCEU what we will get is them restarting
projects, with new actors. Reimagining that kind of thing.
What we have now is probably what we will have in the future.

If they have a real reboot that would work it has to start with Superman.
But the Superman projects are in tatters. Until at least Coates find a way to save it.
But everything flows from Superman, for the obvious reason that he sets the
template. That was the way it worked in the Golden Age, he has a reverence
beyond simply his powers. If Superman is screwed up, nothing else will work.

Not only is this untrue, it's kind of insulting to other characters to imply live or die by how well Superman does.

[Last Son of Krypton]

https://twitter.com/flashfilmnews/st...154908188?s=21

According to @DanielRPK, #TheFlash movie will revisit all the DCEU movies and give them an alter take. WB would use #TheFlashMovie to set up a new Justice League movie.

Dude isn’t always reliable but he’s had a couple legit scoops over the years. Thought this was worth sharing since it may explain how they’ll reboot the mainline universe.

This is sort of what Marvel did with What If? I guess it could explain the alternate Barry we saw in the set leaks.

Finger crossed for "Party Superman" showing up.

[Guy_McNichts]

If they have a real reboot that would work it has to start with Superman.
But the Superman projects are in tatters. Until at least Coates find a way to save it.
But everything flows from Superman, for the obvious reason that he sets the
template. That was the way it worked in the Golden Age, he has a reverence
beyond simply his powers. If Superman is screwed up, nothing else will work.

Honestly, I think that approach and philosophy is part of what holds DC back. And it's definitely what ruined the Justice League movie(s). This notion that everything MUST start and revolve around Superman. If not him, Batman. And everyone else is a peon beneath them.

As much as Batman hogs the spotlight, the early Snyder movies were built around the idea that Superman is the center of all things and nothing can or will happen until he does it first. Wonder Woman might have first appeared in World War I, but--until Patty Jenkins changed it--she was supposed to give up and go into hiding until Superman "inspires" her to return. The central thesis of Justice League is the supposed greatest heroes are utterly useless unless Superman is there to lead them. It's there in Snyder's version, and Whedon doubled-down on it.

I am not saying Superman should be torn down or treated without respect or reverence. But this devotion to the "pecking order" is part of why DC struggles in my opinion.
And it's not just Superman. Batman is absolutely part of the problem here, too.

Iron Man was a B-list character until Robert Downey, Jr. came along. Marvel rolled with it and capitalized. Did anyone really care about Loki before Tom Hiddleston? Now, he's one of their most beloved characters with his own TV show.
Before Aquaman broke a billion dollars, Wonder Woman was DC's only legit hit with critics and audiences. Warner followed it with a movie that went out of its way to show in no uncertain terms she's a piss-ant compared to Superman. And if Snyder had continued with his Justice League plans, WW and Aquaman--the only two successful characters--would've been DEAD in the sequel.

I think they need to stop thinking all things must begin and end with Superman and Batman.

[CosmiComic]

Honestly, I think that approach and philosophy is part of what holds DC back. And it's definitely what ruined the Justice League movie(s). This notion that everything MUST start and revolve around Superman. If not him, Batman. And everyone else is a peon beneath them.

As much as Batman hogs the spotlight, the early Snyder movies were built around the idea that Superman is the center of all things and nothing can or will happen until he does it first. Wonder Woman might have first appeared in World War I, but--until Patty Jenkins changed it--she was supposed to give up and go into hiding until Superman "inspires" her to return. The central thesis of Justice League is the supposed greatest heroes are utterly useless unless Superman is there to lead them. It's there in Snyder's version, and Whedon doubled-down on it.

I am not saying Superman should be torn down or treated without respect or reverence. But this devotion to the "pecking order" is part of why DC struggles in my opinion.
And it's not just Superman. Batman is absolutely part of the problem here, too.

Iron Man was a B-list character until Robert Downey, Jr. came along. Marvel rolled with it and capitalized. Did anyone really care about Loki before Tom Hiddleston? Now, he's one of their most beloved characters with his own TV show.
Before Aquaman broke a billion dollars, Wonder Woman was DC's only legit hit with critics and audiences. Warner followed it with a movie that went out of its way to show in no uncertain terms she's a piss-ant compared to Superman. And if Snyder had continued with his Justice League plans, WW and Aquaman--the only two successful characters--would've been DEAD in the sequel.

I think they need to stop thinking all things must begin and end with Superman and Batman.

At this point, WB only even thinks that about Batman. Even Superman doesn't seem that important. Although with all these upcoming projects, this could be changing

[John Venus]

Batman is the most profitable property. Superman is the most iconic and sacrosanct and any mistake made in handling him must be rectified immediately. Everybody else is a fluke or second rate or not worth the time. That's the impression I get from WB. They wouldn't even try with other characters if the MCU hadn't taken off the way it did.

The 'Superman first' mind set is detrimental to other characters. Especially the JSA and Wonder Woman.

[SiegePerilous02]

Honestly, I think that approach and philosophy is part of what holds DC back. And it's definitely what ruined the Justice League movie(s). This notion that everything MUST start and revolve around Superman. If not him, Batman. And everyone else is a peon beneath them.

As much as Batman hogs the spotlight, the early Snyder movies were built around the idea that Superman is the center of all things and nothing can or will happen until he does it first. Wonder Woman might have first appeared in World War I, but--until Patty Jenkins changed it--she was supposed to give up and go into hiding until Superman "inspires" her to return. The central thesis of Justice League is the supposed greatest heroes are utterly useless unless Superman is there to lead them. It's there in Snyder's version, and Whedon doubled-down on it.

Even the reverence to Superman is empty lip service. They put him on a pedestal as a plot device, but not an engaging character with an actual fleshed out arc. So Diana gets screwed over for him and the reason they did it for didn't even help him much, because his arc wasn't going to be at all inspiring. Jenkins and Gadot did an awesome job with their first film considering the restraints they had to work with and I'm grateful for it, but if they really wanted Superman to be the first superhero like he usually is, have Wonder Woman first show up around the time he does. Don't have her debut first without it being acknowledged and invent a BS reason for her to remain in the shadows until he "inspires" her to return. If she absolutely must come first, go all in on it.

And do a JL film that justifies all these larger than life heroes coming together with moments for them all to shine. Even emphasizing Superman's importance via the Mother Boxes not activating until after he's dead is really stupid. He's only been on Earth for 30 something years, and only came to his full power in the last 2 or so years. Why did they wait until now to wake up?

Batman is the most profitable property. Superman is the most iconic and sacrosanct and any mistake made in handling him must be rectified immediately. Everybody else is a fluke or second rate or not worth the time. That's the impression I get from WB. They wouldn't even try with other characters if the MCU hadn't taken off the way it did.

The 'Superman first' mind set is detrimental to other characters. Especially the JSA and Wonder Woman.

They don't seem to be working on it "immediately" if MOS2 being in development hell for so long before ultimately shitting the bed is any indication (if it was ever going to exist).

I don't think it's that detrimental to the JSA because IMO they should be on their own Earth anyway. It's really only detrimental to Wonder Woman in the way they weirdly decided to go with it in the DCEU.