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  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dthirds3 View Post
    Come to think about it the doctor she looking for in x23 is implied to have created gabby and the sisters using data from the x23 program, I think another reasion she's looking for her it to know the exact details of how she was made and invistagate this further, I doubt she'd take starks word as fact with checking it out.this identity crisis could play in to why she going by x23.

    Also I wonder how gabby will react to this.
    Nothing said the doctor in X-23 #1 and 2 was responsible for creating the sisters. She just happens to be working on the immune system in mutants.

  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ambaryerno View Post
    This is the big thing no one seems to be taking away: This is only the first reveal and we haven't seen HOW this is going to affect her going forward. As I've already said, for all we know Laura is going to be even MORE confused and unsure of how to reconcile it.
    no kidding, especially since the x-23 series seems to act like Laura is a clone even though it takes place after the adamantium agenda and logans return, so is she in denial then?

  3. #78
    Welcome Back Spidey Kurolegacy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ambaryerno View Post
    Adamantium Agenda #4 is out, and we finally get the big bombshells. One does indeed pertain directly to Laura.
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    spoilers:
    It's now canon: Laura is NOT Logan's clone...She's his daughter with Sarah Kinney.
    end of spoilers
    I admit, I let out an audible ‘Yes!’ and jumped for joy at the reveal. Finally a good familial retcon from Marvel.
    I cried a few happy tears when I read it.

  4. #79
    BAMF!!!!! KurtW95's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beaubier View Post
    Here's what he said:
    Thanks for the quote. I agree wholeheartedly. Hate it when writers decide to rewrite important aspects of characters. Obviously, we’re talking about Taylor here, but just the other day I was on the GOTG thread talking about how annoying it is that Bendis (tends to do this a lot to have an impact on the characters he writes without taking the time to write creative stories going forward) rewrote Star-Lord’s origin and his old one was relegated to an AU. Have some respect for the writers who came before you. Especially if their contribution is a defining aspect of the character. I’d love to get Kyle’s opinion on what happened today.
    Good Marvel characters- Bring Them Back!!!

  5. #80
    Incredible Member healed1337's Avatar
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    The thing is, this idea where Laura at least has pieces of Sarah's DNA has been around in X-23's fandom for a while. And it makes a lot of sense from a simplicity standpoint to borrow from other DNA sources than to try and rebuild it from scratch. I take a bit of issue with Iron Man saying she's just as much Sarah's daughter as she is Logan's. Saying there are traces of Sarah's DNA would have probably worked better. Then again, it could just be that Iron Man said it that way, hoping it would help Laura feel better about it.

    Honestly, this revelation doesn't surprise me that much, nor does it bother me. I just think it could have been handled better.

  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ambaryerno View Post
    Nothing said the doctor in X-23 #1 and 2 was responsible for creating the sisters. She just happens to be working on the immune system in mutants.
    The doctor was a worker at alchemax, I'm sure it will be reviled she was involved with the sisters.

  7. #82
    Spectacular Member RoamingGnome8's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nazrel View Post
    spoilers:
    Yes, nothing quite like undermining the entire premise of a character for some cheap "feels"... this was the apotheosis of the mans failings as a writer.
    end of spoilers
    I kind of agree; it feels kind of cheap and unnecessary.

    Plus I really dislike how this kind of undermines Kyle and Yost a bit.

  8. #83
    Ultimate Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    If Adamantium Agenda essentially canonized that fan theory that Sarah Kinney used her own DNA to buttress Laura's genome, I don't see it really changing anything in the grand scheme of things. Laura would still be considered a clone by layperson's terms, having been created with cloning technology and processes (I mean, Iron Man's "you're not Wolverine's clone" seems more of a technicality then anything else, assuming "clone" means "100% genetic match). As others have pointed out, it's already been established that Kinney and Wolverine were her parents and she saw them as such. The only difference I can see is that now Laura knows that she has a genetic link to her mom, which makes sense that that would mean a lot to her.

    Now, if Marvel is trying say that Laura is a "normal" human mutant (e.g. Kinney and Wolverine had a one-night stand somehow which resulted in Laura's conception), then that's a problem; not only is Laura being a clone (albeit one with a modified genome) been too well established to change (Innocence Lost does not work otherwise), the post Adamantium Agenda X-23 comics have Laura still identifying herself as a clone.
    Doctor Strange: "You are the right person to replace Logan."
    X-23: "I know there are people who disapprove... Guys on the Internet mainly."
    (All-New Wolverine #4)

  9. #84
    Uncanny Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    Not a one-night stand. IVF. Sarah and Logan have never even met.
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  10. #85
    BAMF!!!!! KurtW95's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WebLurker View Post
    If Adamantium Agenda essentially canonized that fan theory that Sarah Kinney used her own DNA to buttress Laura's genome, I don't see it really changing anything in the grand scheme of things. Laura would still be considered a clone by layperson's terms, having been created with cloning technology and processes (I mean, Iron Man's "you're not Wolverine's clone" seems more of a technicality then anything else, assuming "clone" means "100% genetic match). As others have pointed out, it's already been established that Kinney and Wolverine were her parents and she saw them as such. The only difference I can see is that now Laura knows that she has a genetic link to her mom, which makes sense that that would mean a lot to her.

    Now, if Marvel is trying say that Laura is a "normal" human mutant (e.g. Kinney and Wolverine had a one-night stand somehow which resulted in Laura's conception), then that's a problem; not only is Laura being a clone (albeit one with a modified genome) been too well established to change (Innocence Lost does not work otherwise), the post Adamantium Agenda X-23 comics have Laura still identifying herself as a clone.
    It’s not like Superboy with Lex filling in the blanks. It’s IVF. Making her a normal mutant kid of Wolverine and Sarah Kinney. And it makes no sense because the whole reason why they went with a female clone was because the Y-chromosomes in the DNA of Wolverine’s they had was damaged. If the DNA is that damaged, they should never be able to create a viable sperm sample.
    Good Marvel characters- Bring Them Back!!!

  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by KurtW95 View Post
    It’s not like Superboy with Lex filling in the blanks. It’s IVF. Making her a normal mutant kid of Wolverine and Sarah Kinney. And it makes no sense because the whole reason why they went with a female clone was because the Y-chromosomes in the DNA of Wolverine’s they had was damaged. If the DNA is that damaged, they should never be able to create a viable sperm sample.
    Yes it is like superboy, Sarah used her DNA replace or modify the damaged chromosome(that they got from a blood sample) , then used that to grow Laura. They only similarly with IVF is that Sarah was forced to carry Laura out of spite for going against Rice

  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dthirds3 View Post
    Yes it is like superboy, Sarah used her DNA replace or modify the damaged chromosome(that they got from a blood sample) , then used that to grow Laura. They only similarly with IVF is that Sarah was forced to carry Laura out of spite for going against Rice
    Did you not read the issue? They explicitly state that she is not a clone and she is just as much Sarah’s kid (biologically). It is IVF.

    And I don’t like it. The whole point is that she’s Wolverine’s clone. Wolverine’s. No one else’s.
    Good Marvel characters- Bring Them Back!!!

  13. #88
    Incredible Member Jumpyshark's Avatar
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    This reveal is cool to me, and also the first thing about (not-quite-so-old-man) Logan's return that has me interested, as it's a big deal for him too in a way, should he find his way back to what's normal for him (i.e. with the X-Men, not mind-controlled or whatever).

    Also, I agree with Ambaryerno that this is a big deal for Laura, who had basically found her feet with her identity and self-perception over the course of ANW, and now she's had a big reveal for her to reconcile with, which has not always been a strong suit for her.

  14. #89
    Mighty Member Nazrel's Avatar
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    I was wondering if Craig Kyle said anything about this; he seems to have posted this famous visual allegory.

    https://twitter.com/MrCraigKyle/stat...06425670725632
    Context is king.

    X-23's most basic surface level characteristic that any idiot should grasp: Stoicism.
    I don't demand that her every minor appearance be a nuance in-depth examination of her character, but is it to much to ask she be written in Archetype?! This is storytelling 101! If you want people to stay invested in a character, you need to, at the bare minimum, write them such a way that they can plausibly be believed to be the same character!

  15. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nazrel View Post
    I was wondering if Craig Kyle said anything about this; he seems to have posted this famous visual allegory.

    https://twitter.com/MrCraigKyle/stat...06425670725632
    I never read Spawn, so I don't get it.

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