Minorities in Comics and Other Media, etc

[MindofShadow]

On this site, I often see people complain about female comic villains becoming antiheroes once they become popular. Looking over it, I think this is really just white villains this mostly happens to rather than poc ones.

It is just popular villains period. All the popular villains tend to be white.

To me, from memory, that is because there are no popular black villains in comics other than Manta. I coulda swore Manta has done some misguided heroic stuff before but I don't follow DC that closely. And that dude is pretty much evil as hell in the same vein as Joker ad Red Skull, so idk if turning him makes any sense anyway.

But yeah... what other actually popular comic villains are POC?

The POC villain gallery is just trash.

[MasterOfMagnetism]

It is just popular villains period. All the popular villains tend to be white.

To me, from memory, that is because there are no popular black villains in comics other than Manta. I coulda swore Manta has done some misguided heroic stuff before but I don't follow DC that closely. And that dude is pretty much evil as hell in the same vein as Joker ad Red Skull, so idk if turning him makes any sense anyway.

But yeah... what other actually popular comic villains are POC?

The POC villain gallery is just trash.

I've always assumed that one of the reasons why there isn't as many minority supervillains is because most superheroes have always been white men and creators didn't want to look racist/misogynistic/etc. by having the superheroes beating the crap out of minorities on a regular basis.

That's why I think a lot of female villains in particular end up as anti-heroes or having a flirtatious "will-they-or-won't-they" dynamic with the hero. It would look bad if Batman was always beating-up Catwoman, Harley Quinn, Poison Ivy, Talia Al-Ghul. Same thing with Spider-Man and Black Cat.

And what POC villains there are tend to be villains of POC heroes.

But now that there are more minority heroes we should be getting more compelling minority villains to go with them.

[4sake Baned]

Do you face by black and non-white villains are they usually get beat once or twice and then next time they show up or are used as jobbers or henchmen for a white villain who they are way more capable than.. another writer will try to restore them to prominence then the next writer take some right back to being a jobber or stay in limbo for years because Big to be used as a job or but not view to be big enough to be used as the big boss villain. Most of this falls upon bad editors and management in my opinion

[Nate Grey]

It is just popular villains period. All the popular villains tend to be white.

To me, from memory, that is because there are no popular black villains in comics other than Manta. I coulda swore Manta has done some misguided heroic stuff before but I don't follow DC that closely.

I kinda remember this, I think I actually collected it. When Aquaman had his water hand, he decided to help Manta, who was still in his humanoid Manta form from the Neron Underworld Unleashed storyline. The water hand (which was magical) showed Arthur that Manta was really autistic, and only comfortable in water. So he used his hand to both give him his human form back, and to heal his autism. Manta was grateful and became a ally, or so it seemed. I just remembered it ended with Manta almost killing Arthur, telling him he's just evil autism or no autism.

Now, with DC doing the reboot dance often, I have no idea if any of that is still in continuity despite being recent (2000s or 2010s).

[Nate Grey]

Do you face by black and non-white villains are they usually get beat once or twice and then next time they show up or are used as jobbers or henchmen for a white villain who they are way more capable than.. another writer will try to restore them to prominence then the next writer take some right back to being a jobber or stay in limbo for years because Big to be used as a job or but not view to be big enough to be used as the big boss villain. Most of this falls upon bad editors and management in my opinion

Do you have any examples of this? I hear this happened to Thunderball. On DC's end, I think they make Coldcast a jobber, which is weird cause his powerset makes him a bit akin to Magneto.

[Surf]

And what POC villains there are tend to be villains of POC heroes.

Quite. Specifically of one, the Luke Cage rouges gallery (absent of IF) is probably the largest. Thing is, when he got elevated to Avenger 20+ odd years ago, he kind of left all the old dance partners back where they lived. Probably for the best as their depictions where the definition of being dated. Not all those chumps were Black though and I guess they fell into neglect by association.

[MindofShadow]

Do you have any examples of this? I hear this happened to Thunderball. On DC's end, I think they make Coldcast a jobber, which is weird cause his powerset makes him a bit akin to Magneto.

Thunderball was turned heroic by Coates in Black Panther (for some reason, it didn't really make sense but T'challa wanted to use his brain to help beat klaw because Coates Panther always needs help)

it was promptly ignored by whoever wrote Thunderball next lol. But then agian, Coates ignores everyone else so tit for tat sorta thing I guess

[MindofShadow]

Quite. Specifically of one, the Luke Cage rouges gallery (absent of IF) is probably the largest. Thing is, when he got elevated to Avenger 20+ odd years ago, he kind of left all the old dance partners back where they lived. Probably for the best as their depictions where the definition of being dated. Not all those chumps were Black though and I guess they fell into neglect by association.

T'challa has M'baku, Killmonger, Achebe, Solomon Prey, Malice #1, Malice #2, Tetu, Zenzi.

M'baku got turned into a joke (eh, to be expected tbh lol), killmonger was never used outside the franchise, achebe never used, solomon prey is a trivia question, Malice #1 is a trivia question, malice #2 got killed off in a horrid side book for what was likely movie reasons, and tetu and zenzi are super new so who knows.

So i mean, outside of Panther and Luke Cage, you don't have any black marvel heroes popular enough ot get their own black rogues really.

[Adam Allen]

Well, it's the inverse of a popular villain becoming anti-hero, but Alex Wilder started off as leader of the Runaways and ends up their arch-villain.

Which I was not personally a fan of, but I've seen other people who thought he was boring as a good guy and more interesting for turning evil, so to each their own.

[Agent Z]

I've always assumed that one of the reasons why there isn't as many minority supervillains is because most superheroes have always been white men and creators didn't want to look racist/misogynistic/etc. by having the superheroes beating the crap out of minorities on a regular basis.

That's why I think a lot of female villains in particular end up as anti-heroes or having a flirtatious "will-they-or-won't-they" dynamic with the hero. It would look bad if Batman was always beating-up Catwoman, Harley Quinn, Poison Ivy, Talia Al-Ghul. Same thing with Spider-Man and Black Cat.

And what POC villains there are tend to be villains of POC heroes.

But now that there are more minority heroes we should be getting more compelling minority villains to go with them.

Gail Simone didn't have a problem with her all-white Birds of Prey and Secret Six teams beating Cheshire, Lady Shiva and White Canary and she's one of the most progressive writers in the business. Admittedly, her takes on those characters are the definition of Dragon Lady.

[Anthony Shaw]

Moses Magnum Means Murder......sounds like a multiple platinum rap album.....

[Anthony Shaw]

A personal favorite....

[4sake Baned]

Do you have any examples of this? I hear this happened to Thunderball. On DC's end, I think they make Coldcast a jobber, which is weird cause his powerset makes him a bit akin to Magneto.

Off hand I’d say Moses Magnum, Centurius, Tombstone, Deadly Nightshade, Thunderball,
M’baku, Cheshire, Lady Shiva & maybe Princess Zanda. All have been job /underwritten & have yet to recover

[MindofShadow]

Which "franchise' owns Moses? Is he Spider-Man or X-men or ?

[Surf]

I wondered if Shaw's scan of that Avengers was the last time he showed up and please, feel free to check my internet math. But I show 22 appearances for Moses Magnum, who debuted in 1975.

One you can't even count cause that was in Classic X-Men (the issue I first saw him on the spinner rack back in the day).
5 appearances were cause McDuffie, may he rest in peace, wrote them (for Deathlok)... in freakin' 1993.
9 years after Avengers 9 scanned above (1998 - 2007) I guess he popped his head in Civil War: Battle Damage Report, so a side book. A couple pops in Dark Wolverine in 2009 and most recently to my surprise, the most recent Shuri series in 4 and 5. Now I gotta go and find those.

So in essence, in 45 years arguably the best POC foil ever peaked in 1979. As an aside, I do have Power Man Annual #1 and I forgot he was in that but he also teamed up with Nightshade so there's your one Black Super Villain Team-Up.