Page 288 of 314 FirstFirst ... 188238278284285286287288289290291292298 ... LastLast
Results 4,306 to 4,320 of 4706
  1. #4306
    Astonishing Member Killerbee911's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Posts
    2,786

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jetengine View Post
    I wouldn't put Static in that list tbh. Statics problems have nothing to do with the big two and or race relationsand are all about estate control.

    Naomi will (much like Riri and eventually even Miles) be much better when she's out of Bendis hands. Thats not a knock against her though just Bendis being an incredibly mediocre writer.

    Cyborg being on the league was a bumbling mess as was the attempts to work in his solo. Why are 90% of his villains other cyborgs ? Why has he never fought a magic user ? Its all lazy shoddy writing.
    DC pulled Nu52 static book with a quick hook,I know they are rights issues but they had rights to use him at time and put out a clear bad project ,had quick hook and never used him again. But anyways the point was Static and Naomi are the things that we want to see well put together original characters. But if like Static and Cyborg you just put them out there have them fail and don't real try again what is the point. Even worse if you do a move like put Cyborg on Justice League to highlight him as major hero but then keep on using Batman,Superman and Wonder Woman as the key elements what is the point.

    They are doing good job with Naomi but if when she is put on young justice they just focus on Tim Drake, Superboy, Impulse it is creating the same problem. Marvel and DC have actually done a good job creating new minority characters but superhero comics are built to perpetually keep things the same. If you make a character a small side character they will pretty always stay there at that level. If you create to be big time there is no guarantee the character will catch on with the fans but in perpetual cycle if they catch on a little they will always been seen as important. It is two part thing treat characters as important and even when they don't do as well you,clean the slate and try again. Captain Marvel is the blueprint for what you need to with new character. She has been pushed as important character in world and in publishing they have never allowed her to completely fail and they have reload her book even before it fails. At some point it has to stand on its own merit for success but Captain Marvel book has had every opportunity to find its audience. Cyborg who had the same importance for DC imo never was given the chance to find its place in the market and among the major players in universe.To make it simpler they know it takes longer than 12 or 24 issue to find the right and tone feel for a book. Hulk is the perfect example they have been putting out middling Hulk books for years. And finally they found the the right tone for the book.

  2. #4307
    Ultimate Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    15,221

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jetengine View Post
    Yeah, your right regarding Jessica Jones. If she hadnt gotten a Tv show I might disagree sunce shes not exactly everywhere but that put her in the stratosphere.

    On the otherstuff, realistically I feel creating new characters for adaptions is better then racebending but that requires creators not be lazy and actually try to integrate new characters into a narrative. Regarding comics though, well thats down to the fans. I feel the reversal on ANAD was a mistake.
    It was never to stick in the first place. It's literally the same temporary replacement trope superhero comics have done for literally decades. It's just that for a variety of reasons, some people thought that it represented a sea-change in comics rather than he return of a familiar cycle.

  3. #4308
    Mighty Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    Posts
    1,709

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ed2962 View Post
    It was never to stick in the first place. It's literally the same temporary replacement trope superhero comics have done for literally decades. It's just that for a variety of reasons, some people thought that it represented a sea-change in comics rather than he return of a familiar cycle.
    I think the issue was, at that point the replacements were not only more interesting but often had more story opportunity then their forebearers.

    Wolverines done everything, him being dead was great.
    Marvel had Miles as a teen spiderman and they should have let Peter grow up.
    Falcap was a brand new look into what being Cap meant

  4. #4309
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    21,078

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jetengine View Post
    Naomi will (much like Riri and eventually even Miles) be much better when she's out of Bendis hands. Thats not a knock against her though just Bendis being an incredibly mediocre writer.
    Bendis is the reason Naomi isnít dead or tossed into limbo. And I say this as someone who doesnít like everything the guy has done.

    Why has he never fought a magic user ? Its all lazy shoddy writing.
    Maybe Iím just used to or prefer the idea of superhero specialization but I never understood how this was a problem. It isnít like fighting magic users isnít already something most superheroes have done at least once. DC has even had numerous solo and team books dedicated to it.

  5. #4310
    Ultimate Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    15,221

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jetengine View Post
    I think the issue was, at that point the replacements were not only more interesting but often had more story opportunity then their forebearers.

    Wolverines done everything, him being dead was great.
    Marvel had Miles as a teen spiderman and they should have let Peter grow up.
    Falcap was a brand new look into what being Cap meant
    I don't disagree, but we still have most of them. Laura and Miles still have their own titles as do Riri and Kamala. JaneThor is back as the new Valkyrie. Sam's book got cancelled but if they wanted to they could expose those same themes with the new Patriot.

  6. #4311
    Ultimate Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    15,221

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    Bendis is the reason Naomi isn’t dead or tossed into limbo. And I say this as someone who doesn’t like everything the guy has done.


    Maybe I’m just used to or prefer the idea of superhero specialization but I never understood how this was a problem. It isn’t like fighting magic users isn’t already something most superheroes have done at least once. DC has even had numerous solo and team books dedicated to it.
    I think the point was why not mix it up with Cyborg's foes? We had the Dave Walker series, then we got the exact same ground retreaded in Vic's Rebirth series.

  7. #4312
    Mighty Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    Posts
    1,709

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ed2962 View Post
    I think the point was why not mix it up with Cyborg's foes? We had the Dave Walker series, then we got the exact same ground retreaded in Vic's Rebirth series.
    This.

    We all like 'the evil mirror' villain but mix it up ffs.

  8. #4313
    Astonishing Member
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    2,888

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mathew101281 View Post
    Iím of two minds about that. Yes new characters under old brands tend to stick better initially, but they tend to be relegated to secondary characters or sidekicks. Every time their is a reboot, or a continuity shake up there is a legit chance that character will be shelved (see Cassandra Cain) or replaced by a fresher younger character.

    Non spinoff characters have a different problem. Getting off the ground is hard, but if they do, you have a character with itís own distinct identity, that isnít beholden to another character.

    Eh, the first problem lies more with editorial staff trying to maintain the status quo versus anything else. New Characters under old brands have the ability to break out of that shell when given the chance (see Miles Morales or Mighty Thor), they just need a editorial staff willing to allow the characters to share the spotlight. ANAD essentially illustrated the value was there, but instead of having them share the mantles and having the best of both worlds, you end up with what Marvel did, backtracking the progress made to appease the classic comic book fans and dying comic book brick and mortor stores.

    The same problems with the first demographic also falls under the second demographic as well. Brian Bendis brought Luke Cage to stardom for a small period of time, but essentially he was relegated back to secondary characters and then eventually wiped off the planet. So the issue you described in the first description doesn't just apply there. One of the big 2 biggest problems is their undying allegiance to the old guard to the point of preventing progress.

  9. #4314
    Astonishing Member
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    2,888

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ed2962 View Post
    It was never to stick in the first place. It's literally the same temporary replacement trope superhero comics have done for literally decades. It's just that for a variety of reasons, some people thought that it represented a sea-change in comics rather than he return of a familiar cycle.
    While True, Marvel did perform a bit more pull under the rug when it came to how they backtracked with ANAD. Specifically how they pointed to a banner indicating that both the old guard and the new guard were going to share the mantles and that ended up being a bold face lie. The only one that remained was Miles Morales and Ironheart. Most people aren't upset about the old guard taking of their mantles, they're upset that the new guard had to lose their. The fact that Mighty Thor was one of the biggest reveals from Marvel's Panel really indicated the goldmine that they had and they choose to squash it.

  10. #4315
    Mighty Member Electricmastro's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Posts
    1,496

    Default

    Appreciation post for one of Marvel's Muslim heroes, Sooraya Qadir (aka Dust):


  11. #4316
    Oni of the Ash Moon Ronin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
    Location
    Here, for now.
    Posts
    984

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jetengine View Post
    I think the issue was, at that point the replacements were not only more interesting but often had more story opportunity then their forebearers.

    Wolverines done everything, him being dead was great.
    Marvel had Miles as a teen spiderman and they should have let Peter grow up.
    Falcap was a brand new look into what being Cap meant
    Wolverine makes $$$ he was never gonna stay dead, Though I did like Old Man Logan
    Peter has grown up, He got married finished college, he mind was completely wiped of his marrage, Created (or rather Dr. Octopus) a successful business and lost it. The biggest flaw that Miles has is he has no real nemesis that is his own they are mostly borrowed or copied from peter.
    Steve Rogers is a marvel staple, he is never going to go away. Every one know it was temporary I remember reading a interview with Christopher Priest with him saying as much.

    The market for comics is narrowed and when it come to forms of media it is on the low end. WarnerMedia Entertainment having DC streaming service, HBO, TNT, TBS and a few other channels. Disney owning ABC, Free Form and a slew of other channels and Disney + coming out. They have both have very large wider reaching platforms other than comics to create new and interesting stories with as much diversity as they want. Make the character popular before the comics.
    Surely not everybody was kung fu fighting

  12. #4317
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    21,078

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ed2962 View Post
    I think the point was why not mix it up with Cyborg's foes? We had the Dave Walker series, then we got the exact same ground retreaded in Vic's Rebirth series.
    But what would that have really added? We see this stuff in other superhero comics all the time. By contrast a superhero focusing exclusively on cyborgs was unique.

  13. #4318
    Astonishing Member Overhazard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    2,808

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    But what would that have really added? We see this stuff in other superhero comics all the time. By contrast a superhero focusing exclusively on cyborgs was unique.
    Different foes would have added some variety, it seems like there are only a few cyborg stories, he's either fighting an evil version of himself, or there's "Rahh, my humanity!" There's also the one where he might get to be fully human again, until he isn't. Also, him being taken over by an evil A.I. or blowing him up.

  14. #4319
    Extraordinary Member
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    5,439

    Default

    They were trying to sell COMICS fans on a Cyborg that had never been in the Titans and wasn't Beast Boy's buddy.

    I'm not surprised that they could never get any real traction. If you cared about Cyborg in the first place there's an even
    chance that you might not care about this version.

    You have to have some kind of idea on who your audience is.The same goes for Female Wolverine.

    For decades Marvel had been selling Comic Book Clint Eastwood to primarily dudes. Replacing him with a hot teen and her cute little sister is kinda missing
    the entire point of that book for half that audience.

    Like, Replacing Punisher with a Female would have been just as big of a misstep, imo.

    .
    Last edited by Vic Vega; 09-11-2019 at 01:35 PM.

  15. #4320
    Astonishing Member
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    2,888

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Vic Vega View Post
    They were trying to sell COMICS fans on a Cyborg that had never been in the Titans and wasn't Beast Boy's buddy.

    I'm not surprised that they could never get any real traction. If you cared about Cyborg in the first place there's an even
    chance that you might not care about this version.

    You have to have some kind of idea on who your audience is.The same goes for Female Wolverine.

    For decades Marvel had been selling Comic Book Clint Eastwood to primarily dudes. Replacing him with a hot teen and her cute little sister is kinda missing
    the entire point of that book for half that audience.

    Replacing Punisher with a Female would been just o big a misstep, imo.

    .

    Eh, those two are night and day differences. Cyborg issue wasn't his "required ties" of having Titans and Beast Boy companions, it's DC not having a clear vision on what they want to do with Cyborg and refusing to place him in the same tier as his Justice League counterparts. Even in the movie, he gets worfed aka pulled apart just to indicate how tough the villain is. When you treat your new hero as second rate versus his counterparts in your top hero team in your universe, people are going to turn off.

    This was why JLO was originally so celebrated, because it attempted to course correct much of the damage new 52 did by making him a leader, capable, and transitioning out of the classic man vs machine cycle he seems to constantly be in since New 52. Of course all of that went out the window since the last two issues, but that again indicates just how DC just doesn't want to treat him right.


    X-23, on the other hand. as Wolverine was among the best selling Marvel book during that time, selling better than most current classic heroes. She even sold better than Mighty Thor. So unlike Cyborg, X-23 as wolverine was a massive success. So she definitely found an audience, rather it was the current readership or a bit of new readers coming in to enjoy. But like the other heroes, she lost popularity after her series was canceled and they transitioned her back to X-23.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •