Minorities in Comics and Other Media, etc

[OopsIdiditagain]

Have you heard of Champagne Sharks?

Is their podcast any good?

[KOSLOX]

The emotional whiplash I've seen on twitter is amazing. When Flint looked red under the red mirage it was "Screw them, they don't deserve clean water!" When it flipped blue, crickets. When Texas didn't flip blue (which is the liberal pipe dream that will never happen, even with all those Californian expats, 'cause California isn't as liberal as people think.) It was "screw em." When Georgia was red it was "Screw the south, let em burn" to "Georgia on my mind." When blue. This is a game to these people. This is sports for people who think they're above watching sports.

I got off most social media in March and it's been wild listening to everyone.

My wife constantly asking me about stuff and I just start laughing because it's so dumb.

I still haven't bothered to look up the marker thing, but apparently that's a big deal to some people?

[Overhazard]

I got off most social media in March and it's been wild listening to everyone.

My wife constantly asking me about stuff and I just start laughing because it's so dumb.

I still haven't bothered to look up the marker thing, but apparently that's a big deal to some people?

See, this is how I know you're smarter than me. I stay away from twitter on weekends, I only go on it during lulls at work. The marker thing, I think trump made that up. Trumpers in arizona want them to keep counting, the ones in Pennsylvania want them to stop counting. I just wish this would end already. I'm still kind of on edge, not as much on wednesday, but still on edge.

[MindofShadow]

I got off most social media in March and it's been wild listening to everyone.

My wife constantly asking me about stuff and I just start laughing because it's so dumb.

I still haven't bothered to look up the marker thing, but apparently that's a big deal to some people?

I dumped FB fully last election

IG i've widdled down to like 30 people, after this last covid cycle I unfollow anyone that seems stupid

[babyblob]

I have a question for the minority members on this site regarding The Media.

I know a man named Jay whom I met in a mental health support group a few years. We had a couple of things in common. We love to write, and love Dnd. So we exchanged numbers and talked and set up weekly Dnd games. Over the course of those games we developed a great friendship. One thing we bond over is the Show Riverdale. me because I love the comics and him because he just loves the show.

I pointed out one day that the characters of Mr Weatherbee, Pop Tate, and Josie and the Pussycats who are African American in the show where white in the comics. This upset him. I asked why. I thought he would be happy seeing representation of his race in a popular show. He said that is was not true representation. he said it upset him that they had to race bend just to get black characters in a show and it pointed out the lack of minority characters in comics and other media. He wished there were already well established black characters that they could have used.

My question for the African American, Latino, or other minority member of this thread. Is his view common? Do you get made when they make a white character black, or Latino? I adit he is the only African American person I talk to or have been close friends with so I have no one else to ask this. So I thought I would try and get the view here.

[ed2962]

I have a question for the minority members on this site regarding The Media.

I know a man named Jay whom I met in a mental health support group a few years. We had a couple of things in common. We love to write, and love Dnd. So we exchanged numbers and talked and set up weekly Dnd games. Over the course of those games we developed a great friendship. One thing we bond over is the Show Riverdale. me because I love the comics and him because he just loves the show.

I pointed out one day that the characters of Mr Weatherbee, Pop Tate, and Josie and the Pussycats who are African American in the show where white in the comics. This upset him. I asked why. I thought he would be happy seeing representation of his race in a popular show. He said that is was not true representation. he said it upset him that they had to race bend just to get black characters in a show and it pointed out the lack of minority characters in comics and other media. He wished there were already well established black characters that they could have used.

My question for the African American, Latino, or other minority member of this thread. Is his view common? Do you get made when they make a white character black, or Latino? I adit he is the only African American person I talk to or have been close friends with so I have no one else to ask this. So I thought I would try and get the view here.

I care about "quality" representation and then if said "representation" is meant to be significant. Maybe it matters if they race swap a major character. But seriously...who cares if Pop Tate is suddenly Black or Asian or whatever? What's interesting to me is how selective the outrage is. Blind Al and Domino are White in the comics, but Black in the Deadpool movies, yet no one seemed to care. There was MAJOR outrage at Black Heimdall, but in the very same movie, there was an Asian Hogan ( and look at the those 70's John Buscema Thor comics, John drew him as White). I get more bothered by lame token characters or offensive stereotypes than race-bending minor support characters.

I'm also a little surprised that your friend said it's not "real" representation...those are in fact real actors playing parts in real TV shows that reach real audiences.

[Agent Z]

I have a question for the minority members on this site regarding The Media.

I know a man named Jay whom I met in a mental health support group a few years. We had a couple of things in common. We love to write, and love Dnd. So we exchanged numbers and talked and set up weekly Dnd games. Over the course of those games we developed a great friendship. One thing we bond over is the Show Riverdale. me because I love the comics and him because he just loves the show.

I pointed out one day that the characters of Mr Weatherbee, Pop Tate, and Josie and the Pussycats who are African American in the show where white in the comics. This upset him. I asked why. I thought he would be happy seeing representation of his race in a popular show. He said that is was not true representation. he said it upset him that they had to race bend just to get black characters in a show and it pointed out the lack of minority characters in comics and other media. He wished there were already well established black characters that they could have used.

My question for the African American, Latino, or other minority member of this thread. Is his view common? Do you get made when they make a white character black, or Latino? I adit he is the only African American person I talk to or have been close friends with so I have no one else to ask this. So I thought I would try and get the view here.

I take it on a case-by-case basis. For a lot of comic characters, little, if anything, changes if they are made racial minorities. I think the only ones for whom being racebent wouldn't work are Bruce Wayne, Tony Stark, Thor and Oliver Queen. Maybe Superman and Wonder Woman but YMMV.

One also has to take into account that some of these characters were created in a time when it wasn't as common to use minorities in comics. One well known example is Ferro Lad from Legion of Superheroes who was originally intended to be black but this was nixed by an editor. I've read similar things about Shadow Lass as well.

In short, like all things, this depends on execution.

[Agent Z]

I care about "quality" representation and then if said "representation" is meant to be significant. Maybe it matters if they race swap a major character. But seriously...who cares if Pop Tate is suddenly Black or Asian or whatever? What's interesting to me is how selective the outrage is. Blind Al and Domino are White in the comics, but Black in the Deadpool movies, yet no one seemed to care. There was MAJOR outrage at Black Heimdall, but in the very same movie, there was an Asian Hogan ( and look at the those 70's John Buscema Thor comics, John drew him as White). I get more bothered by lame token characters or offensive stereotypes than race-bending minor support characters.

I'm also a little surprised that your friend said it's not "real" representation...those are in fact real actors playing parts in real TV shows that reach real audiences.

They also had nothing to say about the Ghost, who is a white man in the comics, being depicted as a black woman in Ant-Man.

What really annoys me about the Heimdall thing is how the same people who whine about "redhead erasure" always bitch about black people playing white redheads but never complain when it's white redheads being played by white people or non-black minorities.

Jimmy Olsen - Almost none of the guys who played him in live action are redheads but it was Mechad Brooks who got the most heat from fans.

Matt Murdock - Neither Ben Affleck nor Charlie Cox got any complaints for not being redheads. Charlie Cox even said that he refused to dye his hair red because it would look ridiculous. Can you imagine a black actor who was hired to play Matt saying that without the Internet calling for his head?

Lana Lang - A white redhead in the comics, played by a woman of Asian descent on Smallville. Admittedly, this version of Lana got flack for a lot of other stuff but it's telling that far less people have anything to say about her hair color.

Pat Dugan and Yolanda Montez - Both are redheads in the comics but their actors on the CW show have brown and black hair respectively. No one complains.

[Agent Z]

Hell, Thor is a redhead in the myths but you hardly see anyone complaining about Marvel making him blonde.

[MindofShadow]

Just don't pander to me. Black Johnny felt like pandering because Sue was still white (the adoption thing or whatever was a waste of words). Racebending people and them not doing anything is pandering. I don't need tokens and I don't need pandering.

I'd actually prefer keeping the races the same but so many comic characters were created during "all white" period that the movies would get very very very very white.

I take it on a case-by-case basis. For a lot of comic characters, little, if anything, changes if they are made racial minorities. I think the only ones for whom being racebent wouldn't work are Bruce Wayne, Tony Stark, Thor and Oliver Queen. Maybe Superman and Wonder Woman but YMMV.

If by "wouldn't work" you mean in the comics story wise... I don't think Black Steve Rogers works because Black Cap ain't rallying **** in racist america in WWII (The experiment on blacks works, the rallying american propaganda really doesn't). Matt Murdock's catholic upbringing basically keeps him white (unless there are a lot of catholic latinos in New York City I guess).

Charles Xavier's origin screams rich white kid, even the part about other parents sending their kids to live at his gifted school lol. Magneto kinda has to be Jewish if you are going ot keep his comic origin faithful.

[MindofShadow]

Hell, Thor is a redhead in the myths but you hardly see anyone complaining about Marvel making him blonde.

some of the really old myths actually bounced back and forth on if Thor is blonde or red head actually.

but yeah, you are 100% right.

[MindofShadow]

One would think that by now our loyalty would be rewarded with something material, but no, just more action faking. Biden was a disaster for downticket dems, the Lincoln Project was an abject failure, and the dems are going to try even harder to win over these affluent white people who live in the suburbs. They have nothing but contempt for the working class, who are majority black and brown.

They will blame black people when Georgia doesn't elect the two Democrat senators in the run off despite the fact Stacy Abrams is some sort of Goddess. Watch.

[Overhazard]

I have a question for the minority members on this site regarding The Media.

I know a man named Jay whom I met in a mental health support group a few years. We had a couple of things in common. We love to write, and love Dnd. So we exchanged numbers and talked and set up weekly Dnd games. Over the course of those games we developed a great friendship. One thing we bond over is the Show Riverdale. me because I love the comics and him because he just loves the show.

I pointed out one day that the characters of Mr Weatherbee, Pop Tate, and Josie and the Pussycats who are African American in the show where white in the comics. This upset him. I asked why. I thought he would be happy seeing representation of his race in a popular show. He said that is was not true representation. he said it upset him that they had to race bend just to get black characters in a show and it pointed out the lack of minority characters in comics and other media. He wished there were already well established black characters that they could have used.

My question for the African American, Latino, or other minority member of this thread. Is his view common? Do you get made when they make a white character black, or Latino? I adit he is the only African American person I talk to or have been close friends with so I have no one else to ask this. So I thought I would try and get the view here.

Representation is a good thing, it will always be a good thing, but for a lot of media it usually starts and ends with "Look, a black person!" I watched riverdale, and they don't really do anything with the black characters, then again with a show like riverdale where Archie seems to get dumber and hornier every season that might not be such a bad thing.

Perhaps it's because I've gotten older, but surface level representation isn't enough for me anymore, there has to be more there, and that boils down to the writing. If the writing isn't there everything else falls apart.

Finn in Star Wars for instance, is surface level representation undercut by terrible writing. John Boyega has been very outspoken about how terrible Finn was in these movies.

I don't know how to feel about racebending sometimes. It can feel lazy, or they could just add a character of color whose already there. It just screams a lack of imagination.

[Username taken]

Just don't pander to me. Black Johnny felt like pandering because Sue was still white (the adoption thing or whatever was a waste of words). Racebending people and them not doing anything is pandering. I don't need tokens and I don't need pandering.

I'd actually prefer keeping the races the same but so many comic characters were created during "all white" period that the movies would get very very very very white.



If by "wouldn't work" you mean in the comics story wise... I don't think Black Steve Rogers works because Black Cap ain't rallying **** in racist america in WWII (The experiment on blacks works, the rallying american propaganda really doesn't). Matt Murdock's catholic upbringing basically keeps him white (unless there are a lot of catholic latinos in New York City I guess).

Charles Xavier's origin screams rich white kid, even the part about other parents sending their kids to live at his gifted school lol. Magneto kinda has to be Jewish if you are going ot keep his comic origin faithful.

Exactly.

I don't want to be pandered to and race-bending will never be first choice for representation. That being said, I don't agree with "conservative reactionary" nonsense that's so popular online. These guys don't complain when you turn minority characters white but cry and cry when it's the other way round.

Ultimately, if you're going to have these minorities, they need to do something and mean something. A lot of creators just put minorities to show how "progressive" they are but really they are just using these characters as "commodities" to sell their characters.

[MindofShadow]

Representation is a good thing, it will always be a good thing, but for a lot of media it usually starts and ends with "Look, a black person!" I watched riverdale, and they don't really do anything with the black characters, then again with a show like riverdale where Archie seems to get dumber and hornier every season that might not be such a bad thing.

Perhaps it's because I've gotten older, but surface level representation isn't enough for me anymore, there has to be more there, and that boils down to the writing. If the writing isn't there everything else falls apart.

Finn in Star Wars for instance, is surface level representation undercut by terrible writing. John Boyega has been very outspoken about how terrible Finn was in these movies.

I don't know how to feel about racebending sometimes. It can feel lazy, or they could just add a character of color whose already there. It just screams a lack of imagination.

The first step was tokens

the second steps was racebending and tokens who get put on posters but really don't amount to much and are usually pretty crap characters

next step is actually having black characters be important