Minorities in Comics and Other Media, etc

[babyblob]

Thanks to everyone who responded. I enjoyed reading your thoughts on this topic

[Agent Z]

Thanks to everyone who responded. I enjoyed reading your thoughts on this topic

No problem.

[skyvolt2000]

If by "wouldn't work" you mean in the comics story wise... I don't think Black Steve Rogers works because Black Cap ain't rallying **** in racist america in WWII (The experiment on blacks works, the rallying american propaganda really doesn't). Matt Murdock's catholic upbringing basically keeps him white (unless there are a lot of catholic latinos in New York City I guess).

Charles Xavier's origin screams rich white kid, even the part about other parents sending their kids to live at his gifted school lol. Magneto kinda has to be Jewish if you are going ot keep his comic origin faithful.

Gravedigger at DC says hi. He was fed up with digging toilets and graves and demanded to fight on the front line in Men of War (70s run).

Lana Lang - A white redhead in the comics, played by a woman of Asian descent on Smallville. Admittedly, this version of Lana got flack for a lot of other stuff but it's telling that far less people have anything to say about her hair color.

I saw more folks wanted her with Pete Ross than Clark. Where were the gripes for Pete? He was white in the comics.
Lana did marry a black man and had a kid before New 52 got rid of him.

I pointed out one day that the characters of Mr Weatherbee, Pop Tate, and Josie and the Pussycats who are African American in the show where white in the comics. This upset him. I asked why. I thought he would be happy seeing representation of his race in a popular show. He said that is was not true representation. he said it upset him that they had to race bend just to get black characters in a show and it pointed out the lack of minority characters in comics and other media. He wished there were already well established black characters that they could have used.

Archie already had BLACK folks like Chuck, Nancy, Eugene, Valerie, Val's brother, Armani (created for the 80s cartoon) and a few others.
Chuck Clayton got trashed on that show (by a black writer LOL). In that same episode more folks were praising black Josie telling off Archie about his white privilege than what was done to Chuck. You look at the blacks not named Josie or Mad Dogg and maybe the one that just cried about her role on the show-blacks do nothing on that show.

I find it interesting your friend did know Chuck and those who were already there.

The last time Chuck had a NEW story in Archie starring HIM? 12 years ago.
The last time he contributed to a story beyond a cameo-11 years in Archie's main book. In Waid's 1941-he was a PURE token just to show racism. I won't discuss Archie 1951.

Mind you he was the co-lead in Archie at RIverdale High with Archie in the 80s. Issues 22-125. He had a VERY successful trade that remains sold out.
THis is who Archie wanted to their Wolverine. Writers were ORDERED to include him in books and guess what-TOKEN appearances.

Aside from Valerie and Riverdale Josie-POC do NOTHING at Archie Comics.

The race changing is nothing more than Forcing race on a character to justify inclusion.

Lets say DC decides to do a black female movie-folks will EXPECT it to be Vixen. Don't be shocked if it's a race changed Power Girl or Zantana (new origin). Because the sins of the past failed to develop all the black women lurking in DC. Even if you toss out Nubia, Jo, Black Lightning daughters or Naomi-pencil pushers at WB won't go for it.

Remember the WB wanted a show starring a kid with powers. They wanted him to be WHITE. That character in question? STATIC. Yes Milestone's Static.

This is the same WB that told Steve Harvey, Robert Townsend (Parent Hood), Jaime Foxx and Marlon/Shawn Wayans (Wayans Brothers) to add more WHITE folks to their shows. They did NOT do the opposite for their white shows.

That is why you saw Teen Titans Go's Robin voice actor on Parent Hood.
Wayans Brothers's White Mike got his own show a year after being added.
2 females of color got removed from The Steve Harvey Show for Lydia.

[Steel Inquisitor]

Just don't pander to me. Black Johnny felt like pandering because Sue was still white (the adoption thing or whatever was a waste of words). Racebending people and them not doing anything is pandering. I don't need tokens and I don't need pandering.

I'd actually prefer keeping the races the same but so many comic characters were created during "all white" period that the movies would get very very very very white.

How is that pandering? It's not like other of the Storm's were bad actors, it's just that they are in a bad movie. Even they were unable too ave that movie purely with their acting skills. And why is the adoption thing bad? It's a logical reason which occurs in the real world, and it's so rare to see a Black family adopt a white person in media. What's alarming about complaint like this is the backlash had the effect of implying inter-mixed adapted families aren't legitimate and the adopted family in Shazam got nothing so is it because of adoption or that the characters aren't white like in the comics? If Mary Marvel were black would people have been furious over it? It's not the like Fantastic Four have to be WASPs, they were just made like that in the 60s because everyone had to be white, with few exceptions, back then. That's less of an excuse now.

If by "wouldn't work" you mean in the comics story wise... I don't think Black Steve Rogers works because Black Cap ain't rallying **** in racist america in WWII (The experiment on blacks works, the rallying american propaganda really doesn't). Matt Murdock's catholic upbringing basically keeps him white (unless there are a lot of catholic latinos in New York City I guess).

Charles Xavier's origin screams rich white kid, even the part about other parents sending their kids to live at his gifted school lol. Magneto kinda has to be Jewish if you are going ot keep his comic origin faithful.

Agreed. But characters like Oliver Queen, Bruce Wayne and Tony Stark should be more open to being non-white since it's become more common knowledge that wealthy families aren't strictly white in America. They may be rarer, but they exist. Stark's family is also Italian IIRC, and not all Italians are white. Magneto's going to be a nightmare to adapt the longer we're out from WWII, unless the MCU keeps him in the past where this is viable - anything like shifting him to the past like Cap will make him less organic.

[Agent Z]

How is that pandering? It's not like other of the Storm's were bad actors, it's just that they are in a bad movie. Even they were unable too ave that movie purely with their acting skills. And why is the adoption thing bad? It's a logical reason which occurs in the real world, and it's so rare to see a Black family adopt a white person in media. What's alarming about complaint like this is the backlash had the effect of implying inter-mixed adapted families aren't legitimate and the adopted family in Shazam got nothing so is it because of adoption or that the characters aren't white like in the comics? If Mary Marvel were black would people have been furious over it? It's not the like Fantastic Four have to be WASPs, they were just made like that in the 60s because everyone had to be white, with few exceptions, back then. That's less of an excuse now.

One argument I've seen against the adoption element was that it was an excuse not to have a black Sue Storm and pair off Reed with a black woman. I don't think that's true and I do agree with you for the most part.

Agreed. But characters like Oliver Queen, Bruce Wayne and Tony Stark should be more open to being non-white since it's become more common knowledge that wealthy families aren't strictly white in America

It isn't just them being rich, it's them having a privileged status that rich, white men in America can only afford an how that plays into their stories. Oliver's arc revolves around him realizing how separate he is from the common man after he is stranded on the island and later loses his fortune. Bruce losing his parents and the killer getting away wouldn't be so shocking to him if his parents weren't rich, white people, a demographic whose murders are often prioritized by the media and the police. Tony's personality and outlook before he became Iron Man might have been very different if he were a minority even if he was still rich.

[MindofShadow]

How is that pandering? It's not like other of the Storm's were bad actors, it's just that they are in a bad movie. Even they were unable too ave that movie purely with their acting skills. And why is the adoption thing bad? It's a logical reason which occurs in the real world, and it's so rare to see a Black family adopt a white person in media. What's alarming about complaint like this is the backlash had the effect of implying inter-mixed adapted families aren't legitimate and the adopted family in Shazam got nothing so is it because of adoption or that the characters aren't white like in the comics? If Mary Marvel were black would people have been furious over it? It's not the like Fantastic Four have to be WASPs, they were just made like that in the 60s because everyone had to be white, with few exceptions, back then. That's less of an excuse now.

comic Storm's weren't an adopted family. It was done so Reed wouldn't have a black love interest.

It is rare to see a black family adopt a white person period beacuse it rarely happens. Adoptive parents are overwhelmingly white. . Just pure common sense says that if only 6% of adoptive parents are black, the percentage of them adopting a white child is a lot smaller.

Thinking they went this route for "adoption representation!" is naïve as hell. The didn't want Sue black

[Nate Grey]

comic Storm's weren't an adopted family. It was done so Reed wouldn't have a black love interest.

It is rare to see a black family adopt a white person period beacuse it rarely happens. Adoptive parents are overwhelmingly white. . Just pure common sense says that if only 6% of adoptive parents are black, the percentage of them adopting a white child is a lot smaller.

Thinking they went this route for "adoption representation!" is naïve as hell. The didn't want Sue black

"They" being Fox. Trank wanted both Storm siblings to be black. Fox overruled him.

[Agent Z]

TV writer Nadria Tucker—whose previous credits include Underground and a story editor position on Syfy’s Krypton—made a statement today announcing that she’s been let go from a very different Superman-based series, tweeting that she’s been dropped from the writer’s room of The CW’s upcoming Superman & Lois. This kind of staffing change on a yet-to-be-released show wouldn’t be terribly newsworthy, except that Tucker also stated that she’d been a vocal critic of some aspects of the show (which stars Tyler Hoechlin and Elizabeth Tulloch, extending their Arrowverse runs as the title characters), stating that she’d spent the last several months “flagging #metoo jokes in dialogue,” “defending the Bechdel test,” “FIGHTING to ensure the only Black faces on screen aren’t villains,” and pushing for more female-forward storylines—all of which, she says, was ignored, with an implication that raising these issues led to her contract being dropped.

https://news.avclub.com/superman-loi...t-g-1845607534

[Surf]

It's kind of a question I meant to ask the thread back in the summer but cha know, time/circumstance. Anybody ever recall a time or two where, on the low, Caucasians have hipped you to some real game? Not talkin' about a formal lesson (not, not that either though), I mean about when it happens on their end, it's just regular talk but it clicks to you in a way that you've never heard that stated like that before. It could be something innocuous or something poignant but what to me stands out is that- to them it was just conversation and they don't have any idea how that game sat with you personally and it can be profound. It could be from a co-worker or a flex from a spouse or several ways it might can come. Hell, I've even picked up on a tip or two second hand from the regulars here over time.

Anyway, this is all to say that those measures can help to keep us goin in the game of American. So many are with us but clearly a lot more than most thought don't give a F. Like Earthquake said in this IG story, 65+ Million American's felt Trump's trusted advisor and White Nationalist Stephen Miller being in the President's ear on a regular basis can just be overlooked. This don't account for just the upper class White voter either, poor white voters without a pot to piss in supported this President en masse. Still lots of influence in that group (i.e. Hollywood) which is why ANY show of strength on behalf of Black people specifically (but not exclusionally), weather by protests, coming out for a Black Panther movie or countering Red districts is a positive to me. Gotta keep watchin' out though.

[OopsIdiditagain]

I have a question for the minority members on this site regarding The Media.

I know a man named Jay whom I met in a mental health support group a few years. We had a couple of things in common. We love to write, and love Dnd. So we exchanged numbers and talked and set up weekly Dnd games. Over the course of those games we developed a great friendship. One thing we bond over is the Show Riverdale. me because I love the comics and him because he just loves the show.

I pointed out one day that the characters of Mr Weatherbee, Pop Tate, and Josie and the Pussycats who are African American in the show where white in the comics. This upset him. I asked why. I thought he would be happy seeing representation of his race in a popular show. He said that is was not true representation. he said it upset him that they had to race bend just to get black characters in a show and it pointed out the lack of minority characters in comics and other media. He wished there were already well established black characters that they could have used.

My question for the African American, Latino, or other minority member of this thread. Is his view common? Do you get made when they make a white character black, or Latino? I adit he is the only African American person I talk to or have been close friends with so I have no one else to ask this. So I thought I would try and get the view here.

His view is common, but for me it's a case by case thing. I won't lie I'm not asking for every character to be race bent, especially when the characters have racist ties. But I'll never bash Black actors/actresses for getting a role like some people do online.

While I wish there were more well-established characters too I feel like people forget that a lot of iconic white characters like the Lone Ranger, Edmond Dantes, James Bond etc are actually inspired by real Black, Latino, Asian and Arab people.

[Steel Inquisitor]

comic Storm's weren't an adopted family. It was done so Reed wouldn't have a black love interest.

It is rare to see a black family adopt a white person period beacuse it rarely happens. Adoptive parents are overwhelmingly white. . Just pure common sense says that if only 6% of adoptive parents are black, the percentage of them adopting a white child is a lot smaller.

Thinking they went this route for "adoption representation!" is naïve as hell. The didn't want Sue black

They don't have to be, the whole point of the FF is that they're a group who become family - Ben Grimm was never a Storm, but he did become family. If anything that updates the concept to be more like the idea would be today, which is more diverse and inclusive. The FF don't have to be a traditional family to be updated contemporarily.

If they truly did this to avoid Sue being black that was wrong, but that's on the people who made the decision not that the Storm's having adopted Sue couldn't be good in itself. It also allowed the Storm family and Johnny to not be white in a movie, which is an achievement in itself.

Overwhelmingly white, not impossible. What's wrong with showing this representation in media? Those families should get representation.

Johnny and Sue being from a biracial family with adopted siblings is literally the status quo of the movie, as it was in Shazam. You didn't answer anything about the Shazam's family, who would also be a smaller minority among adopted kids. For or against?

[BroHomo]

They don't have to be, the whole point of the FF is that they're a group who become family - Ben Grimm was never a Storm, but he did become family. If anything that updates the concept to be more like the idea would be today, which is more diverse and inclusive. The FF don't have to be a traditional family to be updated contemporarily.

If they truly did this to avoid Sue being black that was wrong, but that's on the people who made the decision not that the Storm's having adopted Sue couldn't be good in itself. It also allowed the Storm family and Johnny to not be white in a movie, which is an achievement in itself.

Overwhelmingly white, not impossible. What's wrong with showing this representation in media? Those families should get representation.

Johnny and Sue being from a biracial family with adopted siblings is literally the status quo of the movie, as it was in Shazam. You didn't answer anything about the Shazam's family, who would also be a smaller minority among adopted kids. For or against?

Sooo basically more representation of straight white males is a needed?

[J. D. Guy]

I saw more folks wanted her with Pete Ross than Clark.

Eeh. I wouldn't think too highly of this, either.

That's because what you refer to is more of a shipper's tactic. One of them is killing off the undesired character, but another one is shipping them off with someone else. And in this instance, shipping the show's then-two only prominent POC characters meant that neither were a threat to the shipper audiences' canon or non-canon White ships. I'm pointing this out in case anyone thought or would think Smallville's shipper audience was shipping Lana and Pete together because they liked those two characters as actual characters and thought it'd be interesting to write and read stories about them together.

Basically, they shipped Smallville's Lana with Smallville's Pete because they felt Pete wasn't a real threat to anything or anyone. And by doing so, Lana, who was a threat as far as they were concerned (to Clark/Lois and Clark/Lex, and possibly Clark/Chloe, too), is now no longer one.

[Agent Z]

Sooo basically more representation of straight white males is a needed?

What are you talking about?

[Steel Inquisitor]

What are you talking about?

Nothing, it's a straw man.