Minorities in Comics and Other Media, etc

[the illustrious mr. kenway]

I wanna be a writer and I'm working on my stuff. So I support building up characters. If they need someone to write a Blindspot solo, I'm your guy.

But the reality is much different if I get hired. A working writer outside of novels is more like a handyman. So I'm more likely to work on the solo Kraven film or CW'S Powerpuff girls than get my own stuff made.

Racebending/genderbending is more risk averse. So an Asian Danny Rand is less risky than betting on Blindspot.

I'm not being "woe is me", I'm just trying to provide insight into why that happens.

We should do stuff like this-

https://www.google.com/amp/s/screenr...-reaction/amp/

https://www.google.com/amp/s/screenr...an-marvel/amp/

TLDR version- Simu Liu wrote a multi season pitch for Sunfire.

But we need to be pragmatic too.

PS. I forgot Echo was getting a Disney+ show.

[Overhazard]

Out of curiosity...

Do any of y'all actually want race bent characters?

Lots of discussion elsewhere about racebending the F4 or race bending mutants or other characters.

And personally... it doesn't really appeal to me at all... if they want to use minorities, use and push some of the characters they have.

i don't care if F4 is all white... white friends groups do exist lol.

I don't hate racebending, but I always prefer if they use minority characters they already have.

[Agent Z]

Same here.

I'm completely neutral on it.

Sometime it's a bit cringey but sometimes I fully understand.

I pretty much feel the same way.

[godisawesome]

I think race ending depends on a lot of factors - how much it’s a genuine move of representation vs tokenism, how much it’s attempting to nab unexpectedly great talent for a smaller role, how much it impacts or doesn’t impact the characterization, and how much other characters who could represent are neglected, deployed, or non-factors.

The Arcane show, for instance, has included a tiny bit of race bending with Caitlyn and Jayce away from the more conventional white people they were to more Asian and Hispanic, for instance… but given the context of that franchise, the quality of performances by actors with that heritage, and their willingness to deploy original characters for representation as well as other canonical ones like Ekko, it’s a good decision.

The race bending of Wally West in the New 52 was undertaken in bad faith and in a bad context.

[4sake Baned]

Out of curiosity...

Do any of y'all actually want race bent characters?

Lots of discussion elsewhere about racebending the F4 or race bending mutants or other characters.

And personally... it doesn't really appeal to me at all... if they want to use minorities, use and push some of the characters they have.

i don't care if F4 is all white... white friends groups do exist lol.

It really depends overall in general a lot times it works other times it’s ehh or awful. So case by case..

As for X-men way to many white characters in lead or & secondary role & etc co definitely some them should be race bent ALONG with using Sunspot, Jubilee, Storm, Bishop, Synch, M, Darwin & etc

F4 can work as without race bending the main 4 or 6, but that’s just means u will need use Wingfoot & Kaila/Sky or etc poc supporting characters in movies/series in prominent roles. Also probably would need to give Wingfoot some powers aswell if your using him.

Ben imo should be Jewish but he doesn’t have to white he can Black Jew, mix race Jew, Asian Jew & or etc.

Sue, Reed, Johnny & kids I’d keep white or make em mixed..

It depends.

Ben Grimm being Black absolutely makes sense to me. Many people (including the dude that wrote the Easy Rawlings novels) read him as Black. Sue and Johnny being Asian also works.

Some bends are more logical than others.

Starfire being Black kinda annoys me since the character as originally designed by a Latino Artist was effectively a Space Latina (Really long hair, temper and... assets). So in my mind it was really just trading one POC for another.

The Iron Fist situation was interesting because it wasn't comic nerds who pushed back, it was the casuals: TV media fans who had enough of cultural appropriation.

Funny thing is I.F.'s origin makes way more sense if his Dad was a native of the mystic city that left. Race bending him actually would have improved matters on a plot level.

I agree Starfire is effectively a space Latina but she can be Black or brown or
Tan or white space Latina. Like Grimm can be White Jew or Blk Jew or brown Jew or etc

I can see Johnny & Sue as Asian aswell.

Danny Rand ( White savior fist ) has long been a problematic character & the changes were long needed & over due. He can’t be lead of that IP & effectively get it to highest points/peaks. He can be deuteragonist at best as he currently is in that IP. His best role is being Luke Cage sidekick or being a mid level character or back end character in a team set up..

[CosmiComic]

Native American civilian sidekick to an all White team isn't really that progressive.

A team preaching civil rights but mainly focusing on White mutants isn't much more progressive either

[4sake Baned]

Native American civilian sidekick to an all White team isn't really that progressive.

A team preaching civil rights but mainly focusing on White mutants isn't much more progressive either

True true which why If Wingfoot is used he’d need to be treated as a equal team member & giving powers aswell.

[CosmiComic]

True true which why If Wingfoot is used he’d need to be treated as a equal team member & giving powers aswell.

Yeah but I don't see that happening unfortunately.

[MasterOfMagnetism]

With the X-Men it entirely depends on what their line-up will be for the first movie. If they want a smaller cast and only focus on Xavier and the original 5 then a few characters will definitely get racebent, Disney/Marvel knows they can't focus on an all-white ensemble anymore. If the first movie is going to introduce at least some minority characters like Storm, Sunfire, Thunderbird, Jubilee, Sunspot, etc. then they won't need to racebend white characters, at least not as many. But I honestly have no clue who Marvel wants their MCU X-Men roster to be, other than that I assume there's gonna' be a bigger focus on Cyclops, Jean and Storm this time around.

With the Fantastic 4 I would agree that they can get away with having them be white as long as there are non-white characters in multiple supporting roles and they acknowledge that Ben is Jewish. But after they cast a black guy to play Kang it wouldn't surprise me if there's at least some racebending in F4.

And on the similar topic of changing a character's sexuality, I think similarly to racebending and genderbending that if you take a lesser-known character that didn't have a lot of development in the source material anyway there's no problem with re-inventing that character to make them more relevant to today's society. And there's also characters like Phastos in Eternals who never had an established sexual orientation in the comics anyway. If a character is never confirmed as straight in the comics then their sexuality might as well be "free real-estate" for writers so to speak.

I do assume (or at least hope) that Iceman will be gay right from the start in the MCU. And I wouldn't be that surprised if Johnny Storm is bisexual in Fantastic 4 because that's been a growing theory among fans for a while now. Feige has said that Phastos was "just the start" so we'll see if they follow through on that.

[MindofShadow]

Tom Holland was cast as Peter Parker way back in 2015, and while we know his current contract ends with Spider-Man: No Way Home, the hope among fans is that he's in it for the long haul with this role. Unfortunately, it sounds like the actor may be having his doubts based on a recent GQ profile.

Veteran producer Amy Pascal tells the site, "I’ve talked to him about doing, like, 100 more. I’m never going to make Spider-Man movies without him. Are you kidding me?"

Unfortunately, she might not have a choice. "Maybe it is time for me to move on," Holland ponders when asked about his Marvel future. "Maybe what’s best for Spider-Man is that they do a Miles Morales film. I have to take Peter Parker into account as well, because he is an important part of my life. If I’m playing Spider-Man after I’m 30, I’ve done something wrong."

https://www.comicbookmovie.com/spide...9657#gs.g6vplw

[Username taken]

Peak cluelessness.

[CosmiComic]

With the X-Men it entirely depends on what their line-up will be for the first movie. If they want a smaller cast and only focus on Xavier and the original 5 then a few characters will definitely get racebent, Disney/Marvel knows they can't focus on an all-white ensemble anymore. If the first movie is going to introduce at least some minority characters like Storm, Sunfire, Thunderbird, Jubilee, Sunspot, etc. then they won't need to racebend white characters, at least not as many. But I honestly have no clue who Marvel wants their MCU X-Men roster to be, other than that I assume there's gonna' be a bigger focus on Cyclops, Jean and Storm this time around.

With the Fantastic 4 I would agree that they can get away with having them be white as long as there are non-white characters in multiple supporting roles and they acknowledge that Ben is Jewish. But after they cast a black guy to play Kang it wouldn't surprise me if there's at least some racebending in F4.

And on the similar topic of changing a character's sexuality, I think similarly to racebending and genderbending that if you take a lesser-known character that didn't have a lot of development in the source material anyway there's no problem with re-inventing that character to make them more relevant to today's society. And there's also characters like Phastos in Eternals who never had an established sexual orientation in the comics anyway. If a character is never confirmed as straight in the comics then their sexuality might as well be "free real-estate" for writers so to speak.

I do assume (or at least hope) that Iceman will be gay right from the start in the MCU. And I wouldn't be that surprised if Johnny Storm is bisexual in Fantastic 4 because that's been a growing theory among fans for a while now. Feige has said that Phastos was "just the start" so we'll see if they follow through on that.

Why focus on the O5? They're the least liked and most boring (from what I've seen) iteration of the X-Men. If the MCU wants to keep the outdated X-Men metaphor, then I'd say the MCU should at least use real minority X-Men as the main heroes.

I don't see the point of having an all-White team of any group in 2021. Just throwing in civilian PoC sidekicks like Wyatt Wingfoot isn't good enough. I thought the first 2 Avengers movies were already very White back in 2012/2015

[CosmiComic]

Peak cluelessness.

What is woke-free tv?

[MasterOfMagnetism]

Why focus on the O5? They're the least liked and most boring (from what I've seen) iteration of the X-Men. If the MCU wants to keep the outdated X-Men metaphor, then I'd say the MCU should at least use real minority X-Men as the main heroes.

I don't see the point of having an all-White team of any group in 2021. Just throwing in civilian PoC sidekicks like Wyatt Wingfoot isn't good enough. I thought the first 2 Avengers movies were already very White back in 2012/2015

I wouldn't focus on the O5 if it were up to me but that's something that the FOX X-Men movies never did even after how many movies over how many years? Disney/Marvel is definitely going to want to set themselves apart from the FOX series. I think they're gonna' have most if not all the O5 characters in their version though, although they'll probably add in other characters like Storm and Wolverine, we'll see.

The first two Avengers movies were very white and very male, it took the MCU a while before they finally started giving PoC and women characters bigger roles. I honestly don't know how they're going to do the Fantastic Four, but like I said; I won't be surprised if there's some racebending.

[the illustrious mr. kenway]

https://www.comicbookmovie.com/spide...9657#gs.g6vplw

They could also do the Clone saga and use Ben/Kaine but that's more trouble than it's worth.

Miles is just more convenient.