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[XPac]

I think overseas might be the worst ... "I AM A REAL AMERICAN!" ... can't be all that endearing outside the states right now.

But I am probably wrong.

If Angle wins the world cup, maybe Hogan can present it to him while they play real American in the background.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

"And that Little Jimmy, was the day WCW died."

this, among other things (screwing over macho man, the dungeon of doom, screwing over shawn in their feud, and his whole run with TNA.)

Well as Bischoff and others brought up Hogan/Savage had a relationship where they 1 minute was really good with each other and the next things would not be as good. It was a weird deal as the 2 would have that backstage. When things were good Savage would sing Hogan's praises. When it was bad he was doing a rap album called "Be a Man , Hulk Hogan..." lol.

Kevin Sullivan himself said the entire idea of the Dungeon of Doom was to give Hogan villains to work with ala his 80's run in WWF. So the whole purpose of that was a stable for Hogan to defeat repeatedly. A fact that Sullivan claimed he had to work at 1st to gain Hogan's trust since he was known more being a "heel booker". Its true that goofy cage concept was ...well bonkers and Hogan gave a lot more input and was allowed to do that and Sullivan had to try and put it together. But its not like Hogan screwed the Dungeon of Doom here.

Beyond the Giant who joined later ...the entire Dungeon had goofy guys in face paint like Beefcake and others. The NWO made the whole Dungeon kinda not work anymore even though WCW kept it around to work awhile after it.

Its true Hogan did not want to do a long feud with Shawn and pulled the plug on a proposed 3 match program behind the scenes. He just wanted to do 1 match and win to go home. Of course it doesn't justify Shawn's goofy selling of Hogan which he took heat for.

[Kal-El Summers]

While Hogan is definitely a gigantic piece of shit, downplaying his importance to the WWF/E is stupid. If WrestleMania hadn't been a huge success, Vince's hope for a national expansion would've fallen flat on it's face and the WWF probably ends up a footnote in history of failed territories that bit off more than it could chew. Say what you will about the guy behind the character, but Hulk Hogan sparked the two biggest boom periods in the history of wrestling and there's no one else that can even come close to a claim like that.

[Immortal Weapon]

No one is trying to downplay Hogan's importance or take away his accomplishments. The WWE can do what they want with Hogan but refuse to support anything that Hogan is apart of.

[Kal-El Summers]

Saying that there'd be no WWF without Vince is downplaying his role in things. While Vince's vision and drive to expand are a big part of it, if he didn't have *THE* guy to capitalize on it to make his biggest idea work, the WWF would've never survived past 1985.

[master of read]

Well as Bischoff and others brought up Hogan/Savage had a relationship where they 1 minute was really good with each other and the next things would not be as good. It was a weird deal as the 2 would have that backstage. When things were good Savage would sing Hogan's praises. When it was bad he was doing a rap album called "Be a Man , Hulk Hogan..." lol.

Kevin Sullivan himself said the entire idea of the Dungeon of Doom was to give Hogan villains to work with ala his 80's run in WWF. So the whole purpose of that was a stable for Hogan to defeat repeatedly. A fact that Sullivan claimed he had to work at 1st to gain Hogan's trust since he was known more being a "heel booker". Its true that goofy cage concept was ...well bonkers and Hogan gave a lot more input and was allowed to do that and Sullivan had to try and put it together. But its not like Hogan screwed the Dungeon of Doom here.

Beyond the Giant who joined later ...the entire Dungeon had goofy guys in face paint like Beefcake and others. The NWO made the whole Dungeon kinda not work anymore even though WCW kept it around to work awhile after it.

Its true Hogan did not want to do a long feud with Shawn and pulled the plug on a proposed 3 match program behind the scenes. He just wanted to do 1 match and win to go home. Of course it doesn't justify Shawn's goofy selling of Hogan which he took heat for.

i still stand by what i said.

looking back on it, save for one time, everytime randy won the belt, it was connected to hogan, with him either staying in the ring while randy celebrated or randy dropping the belt to him shortly after winning it.

the whole DOD angle was just to get hogan over and did no one connected with that group any services in the long run. it didn't help that at "superbrawl 6", hogan was able to fend off the entire DOD, by himself, in a cage with some of the weakest chairshots since lance storm. and this included the giant and somewhat loch ness but they were "holding him back" from entering the cage. (although i suspect it had more to do with the fact that loch ness wouldn't have been able to get inside the cage due to being so friggin huge)

and i'm not saying what shawn did to hogan wasn't right. but it was a direct result of him going using his creative control to make himself look good at the cost of someone else.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

i still stand by what i said.

looking back on it, save for one time, everytime randy won the belt, it was connected to hogan, with him either staying in the ring while randy celebrated or randy dropping the belt to him shortly after winning it.

Of course Randy was put into the NWO where he had a chance to make a lot more money as we saw as well. Its been said that when things were good money wise etc Savage was very happy with Hogan. When it wasn't....he was unhappy with Hogan. It was the ultimate in comical relationships in wrestling.

the whole DOD angle was just to get hogan over and did no one connected with that group any services in the long run. it didn't help that at "superbrawl 6", hogan was able to fend off the entire DOD, by himself, in a cage with some of the weakest chairshots since lance storm. and this included the giant and somewhat loch ness but they were "holding him back" from entering the cage. (although i suspect it had more to do with the fact that loch ness wouldn't have been able to get inside the cage due to being so friggin huge)

It wasn't supposed to get anyone over in that group that started it. They only added Vader and Giant later to the group to keep giving it juice in a way to get more out of it. Giant became a star from it as Vader vanished as we saw to the WWF. But Vader's run was DOA the moment Hogan stood up from his power bomb. People have said Giant could have debuted outside the group and really been ok , but he was 'new" and they needed a monster for Hogan to work against. (Giant Haystacks at one point was gonna work against Hogan but he got diagnosed with cancer and left...he died a year or two later).

In all the entire Dungeon was there to feed Hogan guys. No one was supposed to be protected or viewed as a "huge" star then. Not til the Giant joined and they started plans to get him away from the group later.

and i'm not saying what shawn did to hogan wasn't right. but it was a direct result of him going using his creative control to make himself look good at the cost of someone else.

Well that has always been Hogan , he nixed an idea of a bigger angle which really was sad to watch since Shawn was really doing good as a heel then. But the company knew what they were getting into here and approved the 1 match and done deal.

But in the 3 cases listed here you can say Hogan possibly screwed Shawn's long term plans over . But the 1st 2 above...well Savage himself seemed fine with palling around next to Hogan onscreen as a heel or face for awhile as $$$ rolled in. The Dungeon itself was a stable for Hogan to run through til Giant joined and they made plans for him.

[MarkRodriguez09]

Respect for the character Hogan went out the window after the fingerpoke of doom

Wasn't the Fingerpoke of Doom supposed to represent that the nWo was back together again, be it Black and White or Red and Black. People always miss the point. It wasn't the fact that you missed out on a championship match. It was that the nWo gained more numbers and it was more powerful than ever before.

[Immortal Weapon]

Wasn't the Fingerpoke of Doom supposed to represent that the nWo was back together again, be it Black and White or Red and Black. People always miss the point. It wasn't the fact that you missed out on a championship match. It was that the nWo gained more numbers and it was more powerful than ever before.

They did at the expanse of Goldberg who's win streak was their biggest draw at the time. They killed his mystique in favor of something that already grew stale by that point.

[BeastieRunner]

Saying that there'd be no WWF without Vince is downplaying his role in things. While Vince's vision and drive to expand are a big part of it, if he didn't have *THE* guy to capitalize on it to make his biggest idea work, the WWF would've never survived past 1985.

And THE GUY has changed 3 times since then, all getting bigger than Hogan.

Vince is the common thread. No Vince, no WWF.

Hogan is important in the run up (definitely on the Mount Rushmore of wrestling) but I don't think if you erase Hogan from history, the WWF dies. Andre and Macho were primed to go.

I do, however, think if you erase Bruno ... the WWF dies. Not even Austin (Rock was still there) would have that impact. Same with Cena. Vince always has backup plans.

[HUTHAIFA]

Glad that Nia hot the win at Evolution. Battle royals should just to be used to put over monsters or fan favorite underdogs.

On that note, I am pulling for Lashley to get the win at Crown Jewel. He needs the momentum more than anyone else there. Lio Rush needs to be a lot more creative with Lashley. The Lashley chants doesn't give Lashley heat, it just makes you want to mute the tv.

I like to see Rush be more like Salina Vega, and incorporate his wrestling ability to help Lashley cheat.

[Username taken]

Then why even watch wrestling? There would be no WWF without Hogan.

Yes, Hogan was instrumental in making WWF what it. One can’t erase his impact. In my youth, I was a Hogan fan (like most young people) but upon getting older and realizing how dirty his backstage politics were, my opinion of the guy dropped completely.

For me, it turned into full on disgust upon hearing his racist views. He’s apologized but it sounds like one those “I’m sorry because I got caught” sort of deals. I will (and I don’t say this lightly) NEVER watch or support any media that Hogan is involved in. Ever.

[sirmarkus]

Glad that Nia hot the win at Evolution. Battle royals should just to be used to put over monsters or fan favorite underdogs.

On that note, I am pulling for Lashley to get the win at Crown Jewel. He needs the momentum more than anyone else there. Lio Rush needs to be a lot more creative with Lashley. The Lashley chants doesn't give Lashley heat, it just makes you want to mute the tv.

I like to see Rush be more like Salina Vega, and incorporate his wrestling ability to help Lashley cheat.

I read somewhere that Lashley is wrestling injured. Hopefully he can work through it, and if anyone can, it's him. Dude is a beast.

[mrluck_07]

And THE GUY has changed 3 times since then, all getting bigger than Hogan.

Vince is the common thread. No Vince, no WWF.

Hogan is important in the run up (definitely on the Mount Rushmore of wrestling) but I don't think if you erase Hogan from history, the WWF dies. Andre and Macho were primed to go.

I do, however, think if you erase Bruno ... the WWF dies. Not even Austin (Rock was still there) would have that impact. Same with Cena. Vince always has backup plans.

Sammartino was crucial but his drawing power was limited to the Northeast. Also, Andre served in the special attraction role, not as the main guy. Matter of fact if you look at a lot of old WWF posters he was headlining mostly B house shows. As for Savage, he wasn't coming off the popularity from a movie like Hogan. Hogan was so important b/c WWE's main source of revenue then was house shows.

BTW, that's Silver Surfer in your avy, no?

[Kal-El Summers]

And THE GUY has changed 3 times since then, all getting bigger than Hogan.

Vince is the common thread. No Vince, no WWF.

Hogan is important in the run up (definitely on the Mount Rushmore of wrestling) but I don't think if you erase Hogan from history, the WWF dies. Andre and Macho were primed to go.

I do, however, think if you erase Bruno ... the WWF dies. Not even Austin (Rock was still there) would have that impact. Same with Cena. Vince always has backup plans.

Andre was almost as in bad a shape then as he was at WM 3 when he could barely move and he'd already been working for the WWWF/WWF well before then. Also, why Savage was a fantastic talent, he wasn't pulling the same star power that Hogan was and he benefited a lot from working in the midcard until his WWF Title push. I wouldn't disagree about Bruno.