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[wjowski]

The thing with HHH is that while yeah, at one point he had legitimately earned his spot as the show's top heel, there's no way he would still be main-eventing Wrestlemania's in his 40s and 50s if not for his family connections. He's damn sure no Chris Jericho.

[Immortal Weapon]

The quick silly turns back and forth that aired was Russo era WWF. Where some guys would turn heel/face comically for a short stint and back. It made me think of Big Show's quick turns.

This doesn't apply to MJF as he's was always heel. He's only a face when it comes to Cody. He's still an ******* to everyone else.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

The thing with HHH is that while yeah, at one point he had legitimately earned his spot as the show's top heel, there's no way he would still be main-eventing Wrestlemania's in his 40s and 50s if not for his family connections. He's damn sure no Chris Jericho.

There was points he hurt the product for damn sure. Some things got silly like the time Randy Orton won the World title from Benoit and its said HHH pulled strings so he would stay #1 heel. Evolution could have continued but they fucked up. And it ruined Randy Orton awhile as a face before he became the Legend Killer.


- The storyline was HHH would watch Randy Orton become World Champion. Now in prior heel stables like Nation of Domination ; once the new young heel lion emerged he'd lead the group and be leader . Kicking the former top heel star out because he's the new hot **** and champion of the group. Rocky had became IC Champion and Faarooq watched his role end as he was booted out as members chose him. Randy was in same position.

Instead its said HHH went to back and told Creative (led by Stephanie) that he should stay top heel and kick out Randy Orton. Forcing an ill-advised face turn before Orton was ready. All because Trips was scared he'd fail as a top face and be considered one of the pack. That he wanted to stay top heel.



- HHH and others tried to claim this was like a Sting/4 Horsemen situation. That it was supposed to be like that. Instead here is where things went wrong. Sting was WAAAAY more over than Randy Orton was as a face in 1989/1990 when they started the angle. Flair was World Champion and as top heel didn't want Sting to challenge him. Sting was ready to be the top star of the company as a face....Randy wasn't.



- The effect on this was big. Randy fizzled out within months as a top face while WWE was left in a terrible position to move towards Wrestlemania. They had to test a Batista face turn next as it was a big gamble then. Randy had failed. Lucky for WWE Batista worked. But it collapsed the heel group since all that was left by the summer was Flair and HHH. Had they did Randy as top heel they may have inducted new members and kept it going awhile longer. Instead it fizzled out.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

This doesn't apply to MJF as he's was always heel. He's only a face when it comes to Cody. He's still an ******* to everyone else.

He came out in a wild brawl that seemed to be him bailing Page and company out against Hagar. This whole , it doesn't apply to the others is ...kinda off since he did that. Yes he was played as Cody's friend. But the whole turns back and forth was funny to watch. It still echoed WWF attitude era booking .

[Punisher007]

Apparently Jericho and Sammy Guevara will be challenging for the tag belts this Wednesday.

[HUTHAIFA]

Apparently Jericho and Sammy Guevara will be challenging for the tag belts this Wednesday.

Yeah, it's not like they have an actual tag team in the Inner Circle

Maybe now that MJF is a full heel now, we can actually get him some promo time every week.

I really don't get the heel turn now. What benefit does MJF get out of it? Does he have so much hate for Cody that he never wants him to be champ. That really doesn't make sense for an opportunist like MJF.

He isn't going to join the Inner Circle. He isn't going to get a title shot, since they are "earned".

It's Swerve Bro for the sake of a Swerve Bro.

[XPac]

Yeah, it's not like they have an actual tag team in the Inner Circle

Maybe now that MJF is a full heel now, we can actually get him some promo time every week.

I really don't get the heel turn now. What benefit does MJF get out of it? Does he have so much hate for Cody that he never wants him to be champ. That really doesn't make sense for an opportunist like MJF.

He isn't going to join the Inner Circle. He isn't going to get a title shot, since they are "earned".

It's Swerve Bro for the sake of a Swerve Bro.

That's a good point. On paper MJF really gains nothing from turning on Cody at this point unless he's secretly going to join the Inner Circle or whatever. It's not an opportunistic move, so the motivation has to purely be personal. We'll see how good a job MJF does selling it in the upcoming weeks.

[Immortal Weapon]

Yeah, it's not like they have an actual tag team in the Inner Circle

Maybe now that MJF is a full heel now, we can actually get him some promo time every week.

I really don't get the heel turn now. What benefit does MJF get out of it? Does he have so much hate for Cody that he never wants him to be champ. That really doesn't make sense for an opportunist like MJF.

He isn't going to join the Inner Circle. He isn't going to get a title shot, since they are "earned".

It's Swerve Bro for the sake of a Swerve Bro.

There's a benefit to MJF turning. Look at what he was doing before the turn, he was Cody's cheerleader. Since the debut of Dynamite he's only had one match, and no promo time. We only saw him being second fiddle to Cody. MJF is second fiddle to no one damn it.

[titanfan]

The thing with HHH is that while yeah, at one point he had legitimately earned his spot as the show's top heel, there's no way he would still be main-eventing Wrestlemania's in his 40s and 50s if not for his family connections. He's damn sure no Chris Jericho.

He's mainly been putting people over at Wrestlemania anyway, I don't have a huge problem with it.

Evolution HHH was the worst HHH. Do we not remember how he was hijacking every show and had to open with a 15 minute promo every single episode?!?!?!?!

[Punisher007]

The Reign of Terror didn't wear people out just for Triple H winning matches. It was also:

-The fact that we got 20+ minute Trips/Evolution promos nearly every opening to Raw for years, and it was pretty much the same freaking promo every time. It went on and on and on and on and on and it got SO BORING and repetitive.

-Same for the "Evolution beats down some poor schmuck forever." It can be effective if used strategically, but not when it's done all the freaking time.

-Trips dominating the show in-general because even if he had no match, he'd still have multiple backstage segments most shows, and he'd be at least somewhat involved in the other Evolution stuff. Raw might as well have been renamed "Triple H and friends" because that's what it was for like THREE YEARS!!

-Trips wasn't in peak physical shape. Coming back from his injury, and getting too big, made his in-ring work much more slow and boring than it had been before (or would be afterwards for that matter).

-The fact that those who lost to them rarely got their momentum back and usually just ended up slipping down the card.

-Etc.

All of this, combined with Smackdown doing some really cool stuff at the time, gave many people little incentive to watch Raw then (I gave up watching it much for a long while there because I got sick of it being the "Triple H" show). Really Reign of Terror Triple H was the LEAST interesting or effective version of Triple H imo.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

Joey Mercury's lashing out at ROH and one of management is the same guy Jim Cornette brought up 7 years ago it appears on his ROH exit.





According to Jim , Charlie Haas threatened to punch the same guy back then. As Jim joked , "Greg sure I'll fire Charlie the moment he does this. But it won't stop you from being knocked out on ground once he does."

[titanfan]

-The fact that those who lost to them rarely got their momentum back and usually just ended up slipping down the card.

Really Reign of Terror Triple H was the LEAST interesting or effective version of Triple H imo.

[quote]

To the people who think the Baron Corbin reign of terror was bad on RAW, you probably weren't there for Triple-H/Eugene story/feud where the whole time you're watching, you're thinking both "Get this off my screen!" and "How is this storyline the A-Storyline on this program right now?!?!?!"

[Immortal Weapon]

Sin Cara asked for his release
https://twitter.com/SinCaraWWE/statu...51665310842883

[titanfan]

They can release Sin Cara because they own the character under the mask.

[XPac]

Sin Cara asked for his release
https://twitter.com/SinCaraWWE/statu...51665310842883

It'll be interesting to see if they bother replacing him with another Sin Cara. They did before... though Sin Cara at that point wasn't a curtain jerker.