CBR article on King's Batman

[BatmanJones]

https://www.cbr.com/batman-tom-king-...t-bat-villain/

I know there's a lot of dislike for King's Batman here, with some posters saying they feel he doesn't 'get' Batman. That's fair, since every response to any comic book run is fair, just as any response to any form of art is fair.

I'm on record here as enjoying King's Batman a lot and this article explains why much more eloquently than I could. That's why I'm posting it here.

I'm curious to hear from those who like and those who dislike King's run. Hopefully this can just be a thread to respond to this article though.

Happy holidays to all comic book fans.

[Darkcrusade25]

For me I think if a solo run goes past 30 something issues, it takes me out of it. I believe 30 something issues should be enough to grab the essence of the character. King’s First 4 trades of Batman will forever be my favorite run of Batman as I believe it captures what Batman is. Right now, where he’s taking the character is a bit confusing but I’m sure he has a plan

[oasis1313]

For me I think if a solo run goes past 30 something issues, it takes me out of it. I believe 30 something issues should be enough to grab the essence of the character. King’s First 4 trades of Batman will forever be my favorite run of Batman as I believe it captures what Batman is. Right now, where he’s taking the character is a bit confusing but I’m sure he has a plan

Yeah, he does. Misery.

[batnbreakfast]

For me I think if a solo run goes past 30 something issues, it takes me out of it. I believe 30 something issues should be enough to grab the essence of the character. King’s First 4 trades of Batman will forever be my favorite run of Batman as I believe it captures what Batman is. Right now, where he’s taking the character is a bit confusing but I’m sure he has a plan

Happy Holidays... unless you are TK.
Nope, he doesn't capture the essence of the character. What he does is write fanfiction elevated by art (art I don't care for btw). I want another writer as soon as possible but there seems little chance DC has plans of making Batman interesting in 2019

[Chubistian]

I've been loving King's run since I Am Suicide. There're some things that didn't work for me, but most of it has been an incredible story and it's normal to have minor troubles with long runs. I'm really intrigued as where the story is going and expect with excitement the release of every issue. It has been my favorite ongoing this last couple of years.

[Arctic Cyclist]

I will say he's elevated Bane as a villain. I don't think anyone else would have thought to have someone lure Batman to their island home, and then lounge naked and demand Batman move in with him so that he could make him happy.

That's pretty next level. As is, and I can't believe people keep missing this as Hugo Strange is a dead giveaway, manipulating you into believing that your friend with benefits relationship could work as a marriage and then right before the wedding cutting off her mind manipulation so that she actually stops and thinks things through. That's cold, but it's what you get for turning down a guy so obsessed with you he once forced your ex into a one night stand gone wrong, trapping her in an abusive relationship with the intent to marry her, murder her father, and become your child's stepfather.

[oasis1313]

Friends with benefits and no strings is a good thing. Especially nowadays when nobody wants to make commitments anyway. Batman should thank Bane for helping him stay a happy bachelor.

[JoeZ]

He's certainly going the same long path that resulted in 'Knightfall' story arc, but only with a single title, since Detective Comics has not followed the same path.
I have mixed feelings about his running, but I can say I like it.

[BatmanJones]

He's certainly going the same long path that resulted in 'Knightfall' story arc, but only with a single title, since Detective Comics has not followed the same path.
I have mixed feelings about his running, but I can say I like it.

I appreciate all the replies but this is the sort of post I was halfway hoping to see.

When #50 came out the blaring headline was that the wedding didn't happen but to me the real headline was the final panel. It made me realize what a long game King's playing and every issue since has taken that idea farther.

It also makes me think of what I regard to be problematic about so many reviews of single issues that aren't the whole story. If we're only ever reacting to the latest issue, in many cases, and I'd cite both King's Batman here and Morrison's Batman or sort of anything by Morrison as examples, I think there's the potential to lose perspective with regard to a larger story.

I didn't start really appreciating King's Batman run until I Am Suicide and then I was hooked but I couldn't have known then what each arc was leading to.

That's why I posted the link to the article.

I feel like it does a great job of explaining the broader picture of King's long game on this book. And I felt it might give some a bird's eye view of what he's actually building toward in a way that I couldn't. Not so much about Bane as Batman's greatest villain (though of course that too) but about why Batman is behaving in a way that many view as 'out of character.' I've been saying all along that this run by King is challenging/changing Batman's character, while honoring all of the history, like all the best writers do.

If writers didn't participate in the evolution of a character we might still have Adam West inspired Batman comics and we'd have an entirely different view of the character. Another way to put it is that it would have been impossible for Miller's DKR if O'Neil/Adams hadn't participated in Batman's evolution. And the Batman we know since DKR couldn't have happened without Miller thrusting the character ever further.

To me no great character maintains every core aspect she/he/they might have had in their beginnings. The great thing to me about the serial storytelling that is 80 years worth of comics is how the characters evolve over time. To me, King is challenging every previously held characteristic of Batman; he's treating him like Job, or having Bane do that. He's putting him through every sort of ringer and, after that, of course the character will change. That's why I love the things in King's run that others regard to be sacrilege. He had to be pushed really dang far to punch Gordon in the face.

But as the article I shared shows so well, he is being pushed that far and so of course he's changing.

Every opinion is always valid but this is why I look forward to King's Batman more than any other comic I love.

[BatmanJones]

Friends with benefits and no strings is a good thing. Especially nowadays when nobody wants to make commitments anyway. Batman should thank Bane for helping him stay a happy bachelor.

I know you're half joking but I'd argue Batman has never been a happy bachelor. He hasn't much been happy at all since the 1970s and since DKR/Batman: Year One allowed the character to evolve as it did, he hasn't much displayed happiness at all.

I've also had difficulties feeling happy so this exchange in Batman #50 really hit me where I live and I think it's almost the essence of King's run to date:

Bruce: Alfred... Can I be... happy?

Alfred: Master Bruce, after all you've done. All you've endured, suffered. To go on another day... Don't you have to be?

To me this is the central question of King's run on the book: Can Batman or Bruce Wayne be happy and does he need to be and if he is what does that mean for Batman?

That's something new and something I've never seen in a Batman book and something that hits me hard and that's why I love this run most of all.

[BatmanJones]

Probably should have posted the text of the article so it doesn't get missed in this thread. This is what I was hoping people would respond to, in all/any ways. Here's the text.:

Batman: Tom King Has Transformed Bane Into the Greatest Bat-Villain, Ever
by Renaldo Matadeen – on Dec 25, 2018 in CBR Exclusives

Throughout decades of crises in the Dark Knight's life, his rogues' gallery has grown exponentially. It's become filled with some profoundly sadistic individuals, so much so that some fans would argue to the bone that Bruce Wayne has the nastiest, meanest villains in all of comics.

It's hard to deny this when you've got someone like Joker as your archnemesis. Apart from being a mass murderer and terrorist, he's done terrible things to Bruce, from the murder of Jason Todd to the assault on Barbara Gordon, so it's no surprise he's touted as the Caped Crusader's greatest enemy, a popular opinion among many.

However, as Tom King has illustrated since taking over the Batman solo title since DC Rebirth, if you're looking for the Bat's most cerebral villain, one who has matched him mentally and physically over the years, his greatest opposition isn't the Clown Prince of Crime, it's Bane.

THE BRUTE EQUIVALENT

We agree Joker has taken the Bat to the cleaners at times, but only one man has truly broken him. Bane's back-breaking exploits in Knightfall stand as the Dark Knight's greatest defeat in combat, and one which almost drove him to retirement (not to mention it almost shattered the symbol of the Bat-family when Azrael took over).

Twenty-five years later, King continues to show Bane is his true equal in the field as a wrestler and martial artist, with arcs like "I Am Suicide" pushing Batman to the limit in Santa Prisca. With or without his size-altering drug, Venom, the villain often pummels and constricts the Bat, because he's adapted from years of fighting. He's learned and evolved with each meeting, because he doesn't just see it as a brawl, it's a dance to him. That's why he deconstructs and studies Batman's every move, as Bane knows he'll never kill a villain, which allows him to prepare for their next inevitable tango.

Batman #59, which brings the Bat to Arkham to dish out a beating on Bane, proves why he's physically a genius, as he opts not to engage, but to submit and allow Bruce to beat him senseless, pretending to be drugged. It's all tactics for a bigger endgame, and Bane is all too ready to sacrifice his body now for what's to come later. And that makes him even more dangerous than the Joker -- he's not rash, impulsive or emotional. Bane is methodical, cold and calculating, and when it comes to a fight, he's patient, ready to lose the battle to win the war.

THE MIND GAMES

As King has Bane laying out his mind games, we're reminded how brilliant a strategist he is. The curtain was raised in Batman #50, when it was revealed Bane was Holly Robinson's puppet master, whispering doubts into Catwoman's ear about marrying Bruce. The influence of her best friend pushed Selina Kyle to leave him at the altar, proving Bane isn't just about breaking the Bat physically, but also mentally.

He doesn't care for Bruce's secret identity, he simply wants to dissolve every ounce of happiness, from marriage and family to the promise of a better tomorrow. But that doesn't mean he wants Bruce's affiliates dead. Bane, unlike Joker and company, believes people living and suffering is a much greater torment. This is why he helped drive Selina away, knowing the damage it would inflict internally. It's also why, though he hired the KGBeast to shoot Nightwing, he didn't want Dick dead. Amnesia suits his needs better, as it reminds Bruce that Dick might actually have been happy had he never been taken under his wing, which is a haunting stroke of genius on the mastermind's part.

Seeing Bane commanding his own army of rogues within the confines of Arkham to execute all this reiterates the kind of mastermind he is. He's creating a maze not even Batman can solve, as Bruce is yet to figure out Bane seeded the info that caused Jason Todd to try to kill the Penguin. Basically, he's disassembling everything Bruce worked his entire life for -- his hopes, dreams and the symbol of the Bat, something no other villain has ever come close to accomplishing.

THE OVERALL EFFECT ON BRUCE

The overall impact Bane's had as an instrument of destruction has been phenomenal. Bane's actions have driven Bruce to depression and damaged his psyche to the point he can't control his anger anymore. This is evidenced by Bruce assaulting Mr. Freeze, almost killing the KGBeast and shockingly punching Commissioner Gordon, reaffirming that both the hero and the man are well and truly broken.

And Batman clearly knows the time is coming for him to face these inner demons Bane has riled up, as hinted at by him recruiting a new team of Outsiders. Bruce is now doubting himself as the man to usher in a new generation of vigilantes. He's second-guessing every move, and fighting from a place of anger, not love. In other words, Bane's plan to sink him further under the cowl, steeped in vengeance, is working perfectly.

Ultimately, Batman has a contingency plan for everything and everyone, but the fact he remains in the dark when it comes to Bane's long-term scheme, it shows just how deep, intricate and scary it is. King's run is the crown jewel and culmination of so many Bane stories, punctuating how we've underestimated him, and that he is indeed more mind than muscle. Stacking his recent actions, where he's always a step ahead, on top of what we've seen him do to Bruce in years prior, it's undeniable he's Batman's polar opposite. No one has ever put Bruce through the wringer like this, and the sad thing is, it appears King's Bane is just getting started.

[jetengine]

You say Banes plan is deep and scary ? I'd say its nonsensical and SOD shattering.

[Inversed]

For me personally, I'm still really iffy regarding that last page reveal. Making it so that EVERYTHING that happened during King's run was apart of Bane's masterplan just feels way too contrived, especially ones like The Button and War Of Jokes And Riddles where it makes seemingly no sense he was responsible for. That's why I'm still waiting to see what the reasoning will be first before completely judging it, but right now I've still got my reservations.

I think the idea that after I Am Bane, he decided to step up his game and go for breaking him emotionally rather than physically, and going after anyone who had recent encounters with Batman for inspiration, would be the much more interesting story decision in my opinion. It shows him in control, and using events to his advantage, but not in complete control of everything that would require some masterful 4D chess.

One thing I haven't figured out how I feel about is the exact approach the "wedding" happened. On one hand, if Selina had come to the decision on her own, then it does bring some legitimacy to that question of "Can Batman be happy/be in a relationship and still be effective?" and we can see the pain as Bruce spends the next several issues trying to come to terms with that himself if that really is the case or not, forcefully pushing himself to his limits to test it.

On the other hand, you have your main antagonist interfering with these events, manipulating Selina into coming to this decision and effectively leaving him, with the plan to drive Batman to a downward spiral of emotional recklessness. So, doesn't that answer the question that yes, Batman CAN be happy when he's with someone, and that is why Bane interfered in the first place, to make sure he isn't. So now the story becomes us watching him go through this fall and waiting until he finally figures out he's been played so that he can slowly go through the rise to get back up. It does still lead to interesting stories that explore what "Batman" means, but ultimately Batman himself starts to feel more like a passive character at this point, being pointed in certain directions basically until the point in the story where he's supposed to have agency again (which I assume will be whenever he reunites with Selina).

I do agree that despite my feelings, I don't think Batman's portrayal and his actions haven't felt out of character and have fit well with the story that has been told.

[BatmanJones]

Great post, Inversed. Great points. Agree we'll have to wait and see wrt all you raised.

I expect we will get to find out the answer to the question "Can Bruce be happy and still be Batman" and I don't think the wedding is off the table. Of course, I don't know what King's got planned but I felt more like the wedding/romance was interrupted than forever canceled. King's still got about 50 issues to go so I sort of do expect to see this central question addressed. And I expect we'll find out what Riddler, Joker, and Gotham Girl are doing on Team Bane. I could be wrong but King seems like a meticulous writer to me so I think we're going to get those answers.

Re: Selina deciding for herself vs. being manipulated by Bane from behind the scenes I'd argue he knew the best/maybe only way to do it without Selina feeling at all manipulated and feeling she did make the decision on her own. I'm not saying anything new when I say if there's one person she loves and trusts as much or more than Bruce it's Holly. And Holly was, of course, the one that planted the final seed. Seeing Holly kneel to Bane after convincing Selina to split was shocking and haunting to me.

But I'm not really examining the run critically until maybe when it's over. King got me where I live with I Am Suicide and since then I've just been along for the ride. King/Bane has Batman broken emotionally in such worse ways than anyone could have done physically and that appeals to my sensibilities very much.

And that's what makes this run so meaningful to me. I don't read superhero comics for the fights. I read them for the emotional depth they've come to carry. I'm sorry to say I can identify with everything Batman's being put through during this run, though there wasn't any master criminal behind things in my life. Most of the time, if I've had an arch-enemy, it's been myself.

Thanks for posting! Glad to hear you're appreciating the run.

[oasis1313]

I know you're half joking but I'd argue Batman has never been a happy bachelor. He hasn't much been happy at all since the 1970s and since DKR/Batman: Year One allowed the character to evolve as it did, he hasn't much displayed happiness at all.

I was joking. Although I think it makes Bruce happy to whomp up on bad guys.