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  1. #946
    Extraordinary Member Gaastra's Avatar
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    The whole notion that the shows, especially Agents of SHIELD, didn't take place in the MCU has always struck me as not just foolish, but overly complicated. So what, the AoS universe is exactly like the MCU with all the same events happening at the same time, and all the same characters (played by the same actors), except Coulson's alive? That's far more complicated than it needs to be.
    Trouble is the movies have had aos stuff in them with the guy from aos showing up in cap 2. (so there has been someone from the show in the mcu films) and the agents helicarrier from the show showing up in avengers 2 plus Jarvis in endgame there had been crossovers. Plus aos told us where abomination was something the movies never did and had nick fury, maria hill and sif show up. So there have been aos stuff in the movies plus a full character showing up.

  2. #947
    MYTH SMITH ∞ !!! G. Boney's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaastra View Post
    Trouble is the movies have had aos stuff in them with the guy from aos showing up in cap 2.
    What guy are you talking about? Sitwell? Because he didn't originate on Agents of Shield.
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  3. #948
    Mighty Member Hybrid's Avatar
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    AoS was immediately marked as an alternate continuity by Season 6, mainly because they had no idea the time skip was going to happen and thus their attempt to be in sync with the MCU completely failed by creating a continuity gap so massive that it can only be in its own.

    Even before then, it was a one-sided relationship where AoS pretended it was in the MCU while the movies ignored them. As far as I'm concerned, what confirms the Disney+ shows are actually part of the MCU is that they're in the Phase format itself, not on the outside. Loeb only tried to ride the coattails of the MCU for marketing purposes, nothing more.

  4. #949
    Ultimate Member Ascended's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hybrid View Post
    AoS was immediately marked as an alternate continuity by Season 6, mainly because they had no idea the time skip was going to happen and thus their attempt to be in sync with the MCU completely failed by creating a continuity gap so massive that it can only be in its own
    Which just means AoS is now happening in 2020 compared to the movies' 2024. That's all. We've got a twenty year continuity gap for Captain Marvel. She's still part of the MCU.

    Unless AoS has done something that actively contradicts the movie continuity (and maybe it did, I don't recall) this just puts AoS in "flashback" mode.

    Even before then, it was a one-sided relationship where AoS pretended it was in the MCU while the movies ignored them. As far as I'm concerned, what confirms the Disney+ shows are actually part of the MCU is that they're in the Phase format itself, not on the outside. Loeb only tried to ride the coattails of the MCU for marketing purposes, nothing more.
    A one sided relationship doesn't mean its not the same continuity. It just means one side of that street acknowledged the other more often. Hell, you saying it was a one sided dynamic shows it's the same continuity; you can't have a dynamic at all if you're not part of the same world. And the movies tipped their hat to the shows many times, directly and indirectly (though mostly indirectly), further showing they share the same events even if the Avengers don't talk about it much.

    It's sort of like, the stuff that happens in America gets talked about a lot in the UK right? But generally, outside of something truly major like Brexit, what happens in the UK does not get talked about much in America. But it's still the same planet.

    Disney+ is most definitely going to do the "shared universe" thing better and be far more rewarding for it, and now that Fiege has control of this stuff the MCU might very well contradict the older tv shows, and if that happens then the shows will no longer be part of MCU continuity, but until that actually happens.....I'm sorry man, but "it's not as connected as I wanted and AoS wasn't listed as part of Phases!" doesn't show that these are separate continuities, it just shows that it didn't have as much back and forth as you wanted. And I doubt anyone disagrees with that; we all wanted things to be tied tighter together, but that doesnt mean different continuity, it means weaker continuity than we hoped for.

    If this is what you gotta tell yourself, I'm not one to judge. You do you. But saying it's all different even though there's been tons of examples showing otherwise? Seems like more hoops to jump through than I'm willing to deal with.

    And yeah, marketing was a big part of the whole thing. Which makes it no different from any other aspect of the MCU. The fact that the movies tie together at all was due to marketing and business realities. But all the characters from the films who crossed over, the characters from the shows who crossed over, the tech and ideas and shared events that crossed over....just because this was fueled by business reasoning doesn't really mean anything.
    Last edited by Ascended; 01-26-2020 at 02:06 PM.
    "We all know the truth: more connects us than separates us. But in times of crisis the wise build bridges, while the foolish build barriers. We must find a way to look after one another, as if we were one single tribe."

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  5. #950
    Astonishing Member Drops Of Venus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ascended View Post
    Which just means AoS is now happening in 2020 compared to the movies' 2024. That's all. We've got a twenty year continuity gap for Captain Marvel. She's still part of the MCU.

    Unless AoS has done something that actively contradicts the movie continuity (and maybe it did, I don't recall) this just puts AoS in "flashback" mode.
    The problem is that Jeph Loeb tried to explain AOS not tying in to Avengers: Infinity War/Endgame by saying it takes place before The Snap, which is obviously extremely contradictory, since the season 6 premiere clearly tells us one year had passed after season 5. Season 5 ended exactly during Thanos' invasion on Earth, meaning that season 6 would unquestionably have to take place after The Snap. So while the show didn't necessarily contradict anything, Jeph Loeb did when he tried to come up with an explanation to the events of the show. As far as we know, his word is supposed to be canon, since he was the guy in charge.

    One show that did contradict Avengers: Endgame in-story was Runaways, though. They dealt with time travel in the series finale and... let's just say there is no way that show can take place in the MCU now. Which means Cloak & Dagger doesn't, by association. Which MAY also mean the Netflix shows are on the same boat, since C&D was supposed to be on the same universe as Luke Cage. Let's just say the Runaways showrunners kinda screwed everything up with that series finale.

  6. #951
    Ultimate Member Ascended's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drops Of Venus View Post
    The problem is that Jeph Loeb tried to explain AOS not tying in to Avengers: Infinity War/Endgame by saying it takes place before The Snap, which is obviously extremely contradictory, since the season 6 premiere clearly tells us one year had passed after season 5. Season 5 ended exactly during Thanos' invasion on Earth, meaning that season 6 would unquestionably have to take place after The Snap. So while the show didn't necessarily contradict anything, Jeph Loeb did when he tried to come up with an explanation to the events of the show. As far as we know, his word is supposed to be canon, since he was the guy in charge.
    Eh, Loeb is one thing. I don't generally take what is said as canon, I take what is on screen as canon. If the show didn't contradict anything then I don't think it "counts." Loeb will say what Loeb will say, after all, but I try not to lay the blame for creators at the feet of their product, yknow?

    One show that did contradict Avengers: Endgame in-story was Runaways, though. They dealt with time travel in the series finale and... let's just say there is no way that show can take place in the MCU now. Which means Cloak & Dagger doesn't, by association. Which MAY also mean the Netflix shows are on the same boat, since C&D was supposed to be on the same universe as Luke Cage. Let's just say the Runaways showrunners kinda screwed everything up with that series finale.
    Oh yeah? I've never watched Runaways or Cloak & Dagger, so this is news to me. I actually tend to forget they exist. Okay, well, those two shows are out then.

    And really, it's all largely pointless now anyway. The tv stuff is almost all gone, what few shows remain are winding down.

    I imagine when Disney kicks off their own Daredevil and the other (former) Netflix characters, the Netflix shows will be jettisoned from continuity too, though given their maturity rating they were never going to be close to the films anyway; too divergent an audience.

    But even if this stuff is kicked out of continuity tomorrow, that doesn't change the fact that it *was* in the continuity up to that point.
    "We all know the truth: more connects us than separates us. But in times of crisis the wise build bridges, while the foolish build barriers. We must find a way to look after one another, as if we were one single tribe."

    ~ Black Panther.

  7. #952
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    And I thought the continuity with the Marvel cartoons was screwy .

  8. #953
    Extraordinary Member Witchfan's Avatar
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    The Falcon and the Winter Soldier is now set to air in August and September, with WandaVision airing in October and November. The Doctor Strange 2 trailer will be released when WandaVision ends. Paul Bethany says we should be getting a WandaVision trailer soon.

  9. #954
    Chaos bringer GenericUsername's Avatar
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    Did they confirm WandaVision for October?
    Love is for souls, not bodies.

  10. #955
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drops Of Venus View Post
    One show that did contradict Avengers: Endgame in-story was Runaways, though. They dealt with time travel in the series finale and... let's just say there is no way that show can take place in the MCU now. Which means Cloak & Dagger doesn't, by association. Which MAY also mean the Netflix shows are on the same boat, since C&D was supposed to be on the same universe as Luke Cage. Let's just say the Runaways showrunners kinda screwed everything up with that series finale.
    Just because Time Travel worked differently in Runaways does not mean it's not in the same universe, Time Travel works very different from story to story in the comics.

  11. #956
    Mighty Member Hybrid's Avatar
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    Dude, let's stop trying to pretend Loeb's Marvel shows are in the MCU. They were clearly in their own continuities, and only part of the MCU by brand because of Loeb's "It's all connected" crap. Kevin Feige is the MCU lead, and he had no involvement with them, and he's referred to how unconnected the shows were in the past while promising that the Marvel Studios shows on Disney+ are the real deal going forward.

    I can't even believe people are still trying to do the mental gymnastics needed to connect them and insist they're canon. I can only guess that the reason is they heard "It's all connected" so many times that they fooled themselves into believing it.

  12. #957
    Extraordinary Member Witchfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GenericUsername View Post
    Did they confirm WandaVision for October?
    Not confirmed, but likely.

    The lineup for 2022 now likely looks like this
    February- Ant-Man 3
    May- Black Panther 2
    July- Captain Marvel 2
    October- Blade
    Guardians 3 will be pushed back to 2023, and Captain Marvel moves up.

  13. #958
    Astonishing Member Blind Wedjat's Avatar
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    The best way to address the continuity thing is to do it the same way Star Wars does it. Some things are canon, other things are not. All are Star Wars.

    Same thing applies. Marvel TV stuff wasn't canon. Marvel Studios films are canon. All are still MCU.

  14. #959
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    Some of the casting for the tv shows was spot on and I'd love for them to show up in something else. So as far as I am concerned these shows are still canon until one of them shows up played by a completely different actor.

  15. #960
    Chaos bringer GenericUsername's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Witchfan View Post
    Not confirmed, but likely.

    The lineup for 2022 now likely looks like this
    February- Ant-Man 3
    May- Black Panther 2
    July- Captain Marvel 2
    October- Blade
    Guardians 3 will be pushed back to 2023, and Captain Marvel moves up.
    Oh, well then I'll wait for Disney/Marvel to announce it. The reason being that Wanda's show seems to be progressing pretty fast. Faster than Falcon and Winter Soldier, so there can always be surprises. Like the show already having been moved up.
    Love is for souls, not bodies.

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