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  1. #961
    Astonishing Member Drops Of Venus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magmaster12 View Post
    Just because Time Travel worked differently in Runaways does not mean it's not in the same universe, Time Travel works very different from story to story in the comics.
    It's not just the way time travel works, it's also the whole explanation as to how time travel was even possible in the first place. The show clearly didn't have any consultation from Marvel Studios and did their own take on time travel as a whole, and I don't think Kevin Feige will prioritize their version over some very important plot points established in the movies, like the fact that Tony Stark was the person who cracked the mystery behind time travel, something the show not only failed to acknowledge, but contradicted it by saying it was someone else who did it.
    Last edited by Drops Of Venus; 01-27-2020 at 06:24 PM.

  2. #962
    Ultimate Member Ascended's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hybrid View Post
    I can't even believe people are still trying to do the mental gymnastics needed to connect them and insist they're canon. I can only guess that the reason is they heard "It's all connected" so many times that they fooled themselves into believing it.
    Hey I tried bowing out of this already.

    But I can point to a multitude of examples where crossover happens in both film and tv to prove my point. Can you point at anything to prove your's?

    Other than this Runaways thing anyway, apparently. That show sounds like it is definitely its own canon.

    It's still all a dead point anyway. Now that Disney+ is a thing everything is being handled by Fiege and Marvel Studios, they'll never reference the work of companies outside of that (like ABC or Netflix), and those shows are all ending or finished already. The stuff Hulu is supposed to be doing, those Offenders cartoons or whatever, are obviously not canon from the start.

    Quote Originally Posted by Drops Of Venus View Post
    It's not just the way time travel works, it's also the whole explanation as to how time travel was even possible in the first place. The show clearly didn't have any consultation from Marvel Studios and did their own take on time travel as a whole, and I don't think Kevin Feige will prioritize their version over some very important plot points established in the movies, like the fact that Tony Stark was the person who cracked the mystery behind time travel, something the show not only failed to acknowledge, but contradicted it by saying it was someone else who did it.
    Yeah, seems like this show is completely out of MCU canon from what you're saying. Like I said, never saw it myself. Was it ever in canon to begin with?

    I would've said Ali (who played Cottonmouth in Luke Cage) being cast as Blade kicks the Netflix stuff out of canon as well, since Marvel had a rule that an actor could only play one role, but they broke that themselves when they cast Gemma Chan in Eternals after her role in Captain Marvel.

    On a topic that actually matters a tiny bit, I'm super happy that Falcon & Winter Soldier is hitting early. That show is definitely the thing I am most looking forward to!
    Last edited by Ascended; 01-27-2020 at 08:35 PM.
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  3. #963
    Astonishing Member Drops Of Venus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ascended View Post
    Yeah, seems like this show is completely out of MCU canon from what you're saying. Like I said, never saw it myself. Was it ever in canon to begin with?
    I don't think anyone ever came out and said ''this show doesn't take place in the MCU'', but no one ever came out and said otherwise either. I think the general assumption is that it was supposed to be in the MCU because that was pretty much the standard for any Marvel Television production (with the exception of Legion and The Gifted). I think it's actually even possible that Loeb wanted the show to be a part of the MCU, but the lack of communication between Marvel Studios and Marvel TV ended up screwing up that connection.

    I wonder if Doctor Strange In The Multiverse Of Madness might do to the MCU what Crisis On Infinite Earths did to the CW shows, giving Feige a chance to soft-reboot the MCU, erasing some stuff he doesn't care about while bringing in the stuff he thinks has potential. Like, it could be what gives us Ryan Reynold's Deadpool, but without the need to bring in the rest of the FOXverse. Or it could be a way for him to bring in some actors from Marvel Television that he likes, but giving them a rebooted role that doesn't follow the same continuity that Marvel TV had established, like, Charlie Cox playing a ginger Matt Murdock, or Krysten Ritter playing a Jessica Jones who's pregnant with Dani... stuff that makes them similar to the comics, but clearly sets them apart from what Netflix had done with the characters.

  4. #964
    Ultimate Member Ascended's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drops Of Venus View Post
    but the lack of communication between Marvel Studios and Marvel TV ended up screwing up that connection.
    Ha, well that kind of happened with most of the tv stuff anyway. Remember how excited we were when AoS hit and everyone thought we'd be getting heavy crossover? Letting different companies play in the same sandbox did not go the way people hoped it would. I mean, we got connective tissue, but not the kind of fully immersive experience we thought it'd be.

    I wonder if Doctor Strange In The Multiverse Of Madness might do to the MCU what Crisis On Infinite Earths did to the CW shows
    Maybe? That seems more of a business consideration than a creative one to me. I mean, Deadpool only had one foot in the X-Men continuity in the first place so I feel like that character can just do....whatever. Deadpool might even be better served by not being constrained by MCU continuity. But actors like Charlie Cox and Ritter? It'd be fantastic to bring them in and keep them in the roles, but soft reboot or hard, the Netflix stuff will never be mentioned or used again. So is it better to have a clean break and re-cast? Would using Cox and co. put more attention on the Netflix stuff than Disney wants? They want everyone watching their shows, not Defenders, after all. I'd guess a clean break is what Marvel will want, so they can be totally removed from the work of other companies and start over fresh. Plus the Netflix stuff is way more mature than the films, and I feel like that could be a PR problem waiting to happen. But damn if some of those actors weren't born to play those roles and it'd get some positive hype from fans if they returned.
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  5. #965
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    Marvel Studios Hunt for Its Ms. Marvel Continues
    https://www.murphysmultiverse.com/ma...vel-continues/

    CLEA WILL BRING EVEN MORE MAGIC TO THE MCU IN DOCTOR STRANGE 2: EXCLUSIVE
    https://www.theilluminerdi.com/2020/...trange-2-clea/

  6. #966

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    I think for anything do something like Crisis, it'd have to be in a show, and not a movie. It'd need much more time.
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  7. #967
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drops Of Venus View Post
    I don't think anyone ever came out and said ''this show doesn't take place in the MCU'', but no one ever came out and said otherwise either. I think the general assumption is that it was supposed to be in the MCU because that was pretty much the standard for any Marvel Television production (with the exception of Legion and The Gifted). I think it's actually even possible that Loeb wanted the show to be a part of the MCU, but the lack of communication between Marvel Studios and Marvel TV ended up screwing up that connection.
    Feige famously did not get along with Perlmutter's side of Marvel, and just before Agents of SHIELD launched he successfully got Disney to make Marvel Studios autonomous so he wouldn't have to answer to Perlmutter or the various Marvel people who were on the now-defunct Creative Committee.

    Feige never said the TV shows weren't canon, he didn't have to - he just completely ignored them and everything they were doing. If things had remained the way they were, then some of the things that happened on the TV shows might have become setups for things that happened in the movies - clearly Loeb/Perlmutter wanted this to be the case with the Inhumans. But no one could make Feige pay any attention to them.

    It's not exactly non-canon, it's more like one of those comic series that gets published but features plot points that no other writer will ever acknowledge. It's "canon" in the sense that it features some of the same characters or concepts, but not in the sense of anyone paying any attention to it.

    Feige's own shows will work the way Loeb originally hoped the TV shows would work, introducing ideas/concepts/characters that can then be taken up in the movies, maybe allowing them to make the movies a little less overstuffed. So they can show how someone got their superpowers on a Disney+ show and then just slide them into a movie as an existing character, stuff like that.

  8. #968
    Astonishing Member Drops Of Venus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gurkle View Post
    Feige famously did not get along with Perlmutter's side of Marvel, and just before Agents of SHIELD launched he successfully got Disney to make Marvel Studios autonomous so he wouldn't have to answer to Perlmutter or the various Marvel people who were on the now-defunct Creative Committee.

    Feige never said the TV shows weren't canon, he didn't have to - he just completely ignored them and everything they were doing. If things had remained the way they were, then some of the things that happened on the TV shows might have become setups for things that happened in the movies - clearly Loeb/Perlmutter wanted this to be the case with the Inhumans. But no one could make Feige pay any attention to them.

    It's not exactly non-canon, it's more like one of those comic series that gets published but features plot points that no other writer will ever acknowledge. It's "canon" in the sense that it features some of the same characters or concepts, but not in the sense of anyone paying any attention to it.

    Feige's own shows will work the way Loeb originally hoped the TV shows would work, introducing ideas/concepts/characters that can then be taken up in the movies, maybe allowing them to make the movies a little less overstuffed. So they can show how someone got their superpowers on a Disney+ show and then just slide them into a movie as an existing character, stuff like that.
    I agree with your overall point, but just a correction: the split between Marvel Studios and Marvel Entertainment did not happen before Agents Of S.H.I.E.L.D.'s debut. That show started airing in 2013 (and it was in development ever since 2012), and the split happened in 2015. We had two different shows (AOS and Agent Carter) before the split, and it's interesting to think that those two shows were the ones that were the most connected to the MCU. AOS was the only show that managed to pull actors from the movies as guest stars; not to mention the show was co-created by Joss Whedon, who was the director of the Avengers movies at the time. Agent Carter was the only Marvel Television show that had Kevin Feige's name credited (as an executive producer, I think). In return, Agent Carter was also the only Marvel TV show that was directly acknowledged by the movies, since James D'Arcy, who had only ever appeared on that show, also appeared on Avengers: Endgame playing the same character. When you stop to think about this... it seems like it's possible that Feige was ok with Marvel TV in the beginning, when it was just two shows they could kind of oversee. But then Marvel TV got bigger, the split happened, and any interest he had over that particular part of Marvel was likely killed due to the fact that, besides not having the time to oversee everything they were doing, he didn't want anything to do with Perlmutter. So the divide between film and TV sectors just got bigger and bigger... which led to where we are now.

  9. #969
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    Thank you for the correction.

  10. #970
    Mighty Member Oberon's Avatar
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    I like the idea of BP 2 possibly having both Doom and Namor, regardless of title.

    Think of it as a double cross heisty kind of movie. Maybe we don't specifically know that Doom is in the scene, but he appears to be some shadowy agent behind Namor.

    At the end it is revealed D and N have some sort of alliance, but D, as usual, double cross Namor - which leads to Namor coming back to the good side, possibly even becoming a better ally to Panther.

    This movie would benefit from some exposition in the early part or ending-teasers in previous ones.

  11. #971
    Mighty Member Oberon's Avatar
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    I suppose it is possible that the FF may show up in more family focused material and not necessarily movies. TV streams. Despite some people's feelings, many, many of their classic stories are quite gripping and could be relevant. If the comics can have 4, 5 figures who all qualify as "the smartest", why can't there be more in the MCU.

  12. #972
    Keeper of the Torch Ravin' Ray's Avatar
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    Footage from the Disney+ shows!

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  13. #973
    Astonishing Member Drops Of Venus's Avatar
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    Well, that Loki teaser was unexpected... is he imprisoned or something? What is that symbol on his uniform?

    God, WandaVision looks so trippy. It really looks different from anything we've seen from Marvel Studios. I got some Legion vibes from it, which is the highest compliment ever!

    F&TWS looks cool too... Not the show I'm the most excited for, but still looking forward to it.

  14. #974
    Mighty Member Diammandis's Avatar
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    AHH THE CRIBS SPEED AND WICCAN INCOMING OMG. I honestly cant wait for these shows omg
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  15. #975
    Astonishing Member Xalfrea's Avatar
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    WandaVision is easily among the three that got me interested and intrigued. Was just so WTH. Not to knock against the other two though, they also look great.

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