Marvel Cinematic Universe Part II

[skyvolt2000]

I do think there are those who do not hate them...but are just annoyed with the whole Inhuman push that they did. I have complained about it myself with the way Toro and Quake who were never called Inhuman before were all of a sudden Inhuman. Overall I think there is a place for them...but trying to push them and 'the next big thing' just does not work. Having them as members of other teams like the FF, Avengers, Champions, etc... works for me because I do like seeing some diversity to the power sources of teams.

I the issue is the fountains of misinformation and a strong LACK of common sense that makes it ridiculous.
It also did not help that the push came with the anti-diversity crowd adding on.
We had folks throwing FITS over a promo poster that did not have certain folks.
It did not help Ms Marvel taking the most of that hate.

[Orbus]

I do think there are those who do not hate them...but are just annoyed with the whole Inhuman push that they did. I have complained about it myself with the way Toro and Quake who were never called Inhuman before were all of a sudden Inhuman. Overall I think there is a place for them...but trying to push them and 'the next big thing' just does not work. Having them as members of other teams like the FF, Avengers, Champions, etc... works for me because I do like seeing some diversity to the power sources of teams.

Was it really that? I remember the reaction at the time when it was announced that Infinity (a popular event) was going to lead into two Inhumans books and the reaction was largely positive. I remember a lot of people were excited these characters that had been around since the Lee/Kirby days and were generally fondly thought of were finally getting a push. Lots of talk of them being Marvel and the MCU's answer to Game of Thrones (which they totally could be). Then something happened and the narrative set in that they were being pushed as a replacement for the X-Men and mutant characters and this didn't let up.

There were other factors; mainly that while the main Inhumans books weren't bad they weren't anything special either which they probably needed to be to overcome the huge cynicism that surrounded them at the time. Also the idea that they were replacements for mutants wasn't entirely inaccurate like the Nuhumans characters and stories were more than a little X-Men-esque. Then Marvel stupidly decided that the controversy was something to be capitalised on by making the terrigen mists the source of mutant extinction and have it lead up X-Men vs Inhumans. The Inhumans are solid characters and they had a lot potential but it was badly botched save for that Karnak mini and Kamala is you count that character.

[jwatson]

Was it really that? I remember the reaction at the time when it was announced that Infinity (a popular event) was going to lead into two Inhumans books and the reaction was largely positive. I remember a lot of people were excited these characters that had been around since the Lee/Kirby days and were generally fondly thought of were finally getting a push. Lots of talk of them being Marvel and the MCU's answer to Game of Thrones (which they totally could be). Then something happened and the narrative set in that they were being pushed as a replacement for the X-Men and mutant characters and this didn't let up.

There were other factors; mainly that while the main Inhumans books weren't bad they weren't anything special either which they probably needed to be to overcome the huge cynicism that surrounded them at the time. Also the idea that they were replacements for mutants wasn't entirely inaccurate like the Nuhumans characters and stories were more than a little X-Men-esque. Then Marvel stupidly decided that the controversy was something to be capitalised on by making the terrigen mists the source of mutant extinction and have it lead up X-Men vs Inhumans. The Inhumans are solid characters and they had a lot potential but it was badly botched save for that Karnak mini and Kamala is you count that character.

Honestly i think what sent people over the edge besides the clouds was not only was everyone acting like it was no big deal and it was a mutant story they also branded the inhuman books with the name usually used for xbooks with Uncanny Inhumans and All New Inhumans. it was like throwing salt on it but all the time they are like "no it's in your imagination. no your not reading mutants being gassed." i don't see how anyone could expect any other reaction from x-fans. most had no idea why the gas even existed. It also didn't help when you picked those two books up. In over 40 issues between the two books the mists weren't really touched on again until ivsx kicked intot he final stage. I mean only a few nu humans like kamala were sounding the trumpet on how wrong it was and most of them didn't find out until the tail end.

Now mind you the whole time in the x-books readers are seeing mutants die left and right and are being told mutants will have to abandon earth because the earth itself was being saturated and mutants would not be able to live on it and add the rumors at the time of mutants going to mars people were posting on here from like bleeding cool, which actually came true in the end. And then they were living in literal limbo which if anyone has read Belasco or limbo stories knows no one is going to limbo for a vacation. Yet the inhumans books had their story and that was that and it took no account for what was happening in the xbooks so while saying it was all in xfans heads the team working on it was flat out ignoring the cause and effect because imo it felt like "we are on top cause we got the rights" and that came across in the books and interviews. like you can't tell someone it's a peanut allergy in an interview and we are seeing bodies drop in the actual stories.

[Chris0013]

Honestly i think what sent people over the edge besides the clouds was not only was everyone acting like it was no big deal and it was a mutant story they also branded the inhuman books with the name usually used for xbooks with Uncanny Inhumans and All New Inhumans. it was like throwing salt on it but all the time they are like "no it's in your imagination. no your not reading mutants being gassed." i don't see how anyone could expect any other reaction from x-fans. most had no idea why the gas even existed. It also didn't help when you picked those two books up. In over 40 issues between the two books the mists weren't really touched on again until ivsx kicked intot he final stage. I mean only a few nu humans like kamala were sounding the trumpet on how wrong it was and most of them didn't find out until the tail end.

Now mind you the whole time in the x-books readers are seeing mutants die left and right and are being told mutants will have to abandon earth because the earth itself was being saturated and mutants would not be able to live on it and add the rumors at the time of mutants going to mars people were posting on here from like bleeding cool, which actually came true in the end. And then they were living in literal limbo which if anyone has read Belasco or limbo stories knows no one is going to limbo for a vacation. Yet the inhumans books had their story and that was that and it took no account for what was happening in the xbooks so while saying it was all in xfans heads the team working on it was flat out ignoring the cause and effect because imo it felt like "we are on top cause we got the rights" and that came across in the books and interviews. like you can't tell someone it's a peanut allergy in an interview and we are seeing bodies drop in the actual stories.

Maybe if they hadn't retconed characters like Quake and Toro and had it so the terrigen was NOT poisonous to mutants. Let them be their own thing finding their way without conflict with the X-Men it may have gone over better.

I think there was also something we have seen in X-Men books and in the Inhuman stories...the 'pretty ones' tell the people who are deformed by mutation or terrigenisis that is in their "true mutant/inhuman form" and nothing to be ashamed of.

Plus the fact that there were never any real consequences (as if there ever are in comics) for Black Bolt basically committing what could be seen as an act of bio terror on the planet.

[Frontier]

I've BEEN saying Kamala wasn't going to be an inhuman in the MCU, but that twist... I definitely didn't expect that. I think people are blowing it out of proportion, though.

spoilers:

Ultimately, I don't think it matters what she is. Like she said on the episode, ''whatever it is, it's just gonna be another label''. I don't think the takeaway from that is that she's suddenly gonna become an X-Man, or they're completely erasing the inhumans. I think that ending was basically a way to say that where her powers come from is not important, because that's not what makes Kamala who she is.

end of spoilers

She never really benefitted from being an inhuman, and the Inhumans never benefitted from her either. The core of the Inhumans franchise is the Royal Family, and they still can very much exist regardless of what Kamala is. I mean, they literally used Black Bolt in the MCU just a while ago. Nothing's stopping them. The NuHumans always felt like off-brand mutants anyway.

Honestly I expect it to become what her Inhuman heritage was for her in the comics. Not really all that relevant to her character.

[mace11]

Deleted post.

[Kingdom X]

https://www.cbr.com/black-panther-da...orever-marvel/

Didn't know if this was confirmed before but Kaluuya won't be in the sequel. I'm a little disappointed because while his character was a waste in the first movie, Kaluuya is so talented and this would have been a great opportunity to expand on him. Plus I think having more black men in the mix in this movie is ideal.

[jwatson]

https://www.cbr.com/black-panther-da...orever-marvel/

Didn't know if this was confirmed before but Kaluuya won't be in the sequel. I'm a little disappointed because while his character was a waste in the first movie, Kaluuya is so talented and this would have been a great opportunity to expand on him. Plus I think having more black men in the mix in this movie is ideal.

And with this and if Angela Bassett goes after marvel has effectively insured they can pay these black actors Payless prices and will probably have very little talk back when it comes to authenticity. The sad part is if it fails marvel and Co will claim the audience just isn't there rather than it being a clap back on some really poor positions they made. Oh well is what it is. Maybe Oprah will take a break from slave movies or lee Daniels from his pooh black folk movies to fund a good black super hero movie.

[jwatson]

Maybe if they hadn't retconed characters like Quake and Toro and had it so the terrigen was NOT poisonous to mutants. Let them be their own thing finding their way without conflict with the X-Men it may have gone over better.

I think there was also something we have seen in X-Men books and in the Inhuman stories...the 'pretty ones' tell the people who are deformed by mutation or terrigenisis that is in their "true mutant/inhuman form" and nothing to be ashamed of.

Plus the fact that there were never any real consequences (as if there ever are in comics) for Black Bolt basically committing what could be seen as an act of bio terror on the planet.

pretty much it just seemed unnecessary. I still can't believe someone thought it was a good idea. Like someone actually read the script and was like this is EXACTLY what the marvel universe needs. Given what i have read of Ike it sounds like it was fap material for him. Though if i'm honest if that Aztec namor thing is true the brown on black crime will have him sitting in the front row of Wankanda Forever.

[Force de Phenix]

She never really benefitted from being an inhuman, and the Inhumans never benefitted from her either. The core of the Inhumans franchise is the Royal Family, and they still can very much exist regardless of what Kamala is. I mean, they literally used Black Bolt in the MCU just a while ago. Nothing's stopping them. The NuHumans always felt like off-brand mutants anyway.

The thing is, they ended up expanding inhumans, and now inhumans have come to mean more than just 5 people. And she was one of them. I think the distinction is clear, but the whole fact that people have mistaken them for mutants is a part of their stories. From their first appearance, to Earth X, whose main premise was to make everyone on Earth inhuman so humans wouldn't discriminate against them because they saw what they did to mutants.

Was it really that? I remember the reaction at the time when it was announced that Infinity (a popular event) was going to lead into two Inhumans books and the reaction was largely positive. I remember a lot of people were excited these characters that had been around since the Lee/Kirby days and were generally fondly thought of were finally getting a push. Lots of talk of them being Marvel and the MCU's answer to Game of Thrones (which they totally could be). Then something happened and the narrative set in that they were being pushed as a replacement for the X-Men and mutant characters and this didn't let up.

There were other factors; mainly that while the main Inhumans books weren't bad they weren't anything special either which they probably needed to be to overcome the huge cynicism that surrounded them at the time. Also the idea that they were replacements for mutants wasn't entirely inaccurate like the Nuhumans characters and stories were more than a little X-Men-esque. Then Marvel stupidly decided that the controversy was something to be capitalised on by making the terrigen mists the source of mutant extinction and have it lead up X-Men vs Inhumans. The Inhumans are solid characters and they had a lot potential but it was badly botched save for that Karnak mini and Kamala is you count that character.

If you go to minute 15:00 you'll see how people felt about the inhumans before the articles went full on mob against them. Also, he even mentions that they weren't going to get rid of their premise.

Plus the fact that there were never any real consequences (as if there ever are in comics) for Black Bolt basically committing what could be seen as an act of bio terror on the planet.

They gave Medusa cancer and put Black Bolt in prison after this with an emphasis on their past actions.

Honestly i think what sent people over the edge besides the clouds was not only was everyone acting like it was no big deal and it was a mutant story they also branded the inhuman books with the name usually used for xbooks with Uncanny Inhumans and All New Inhumans. it was like throwing salt on it but all the time they are like "no it's in your imagination. no your not reading mutants being gassed." i don't see how anyone could expect any other reaction from x-fans. most had no idea why the gas even existed. It also didn't help when you picked those two books up. In over 40 issues between the two books the mists weren't really touched on again until ivsx kicked intot he final stage. I mean only a few nu humans like kamala were sounding the trumpet on how wrong it was and most of them didn't find out until the tail end.

Now mind you the whole time in the x-books readers are seeing mutants die left and right and are being told mutants will have to abandon earth because the earth itself was being saturated and mutants would not be able to live on it and add the rumors at the time of mutants going to mars people were posting on here from like bleeding cool, which actually came true in the end. And then they were living in literal limbo which if anyone has read Belasco or limbo stories knows no one is going to limbo for a vacation. Yet the inhumans books had their story and that was that and it took no account for what was happening in the xbooks so while saying it was all in xfans heads the team working on it was flat out ignoring the cause and effect because imo it felt like "we are on top cause we got the rights" and that came across in the books and interviews. like you can't tell someone it's a peanut allergy in an interview and we are seeing bodies drop in the actual stories.

I was reading X-Men that whole time, along with inhumans. This was after Avengers vs. X-Men repopulated the world with mutants, so there were more mutants all of a sudden. The young X-Men were traveling through time and space, Jean told Iceman he was gay, Cyclops started a revolution, which a lot of people liked because they took a harder stance against discrimination, and there was more. Through out this whole time, they never stopped revoked their classic "metaphor." Like Earth X stated 20 years prior, inhumans were treated like mutants. Duh. And we didn't see mutants die left and right until they did the event, but we all new they weren't going to get rid of the X-Men entirely because this was the 6th "extinction" event and it was par for the course.

What I didn't get about people's anger was that they were writing new stories for the X-Men and created some new characters, new tv shows, new movies, but because some people read an article on a website we know here, they started to tell them what they were seeing wasn't happening, and that they were side lining the X-Men. You could buy a lot of X-Men comics at the time. I did. Maybe some people complained about Bendis's writing, but they also complained about the Inhumans' writing saying it was worse than the X-Men books at the time.

The biggest problem was equating any form of an inhuman book as an assault on X-Men books. When they ended up making two X-Men events from it and even had a joint reboot. They were gaslighting them and fear mongering. It did exist in their imagination and it was put there by bad faith actors who wanted clicks.

These are from the 1970's

[jwatson]

The thing is, they ended up expanding inhumans, and now inhumans have come to mean more than just 5 people. And she was one of them. I think the distinction is clear, but the whole fact that people have mistaken them for mutants is a part of their stories. From their first appearance, to Earth X, whose main premise was to make everyone on Earth inhuman so humans wouldn't discriminate against them because they saw what they did to mutants.



If you go to minute 15:00 you'll see how people felt about the inhumans before the articles went full on mob against them. Also, he even mentions that they weren't going to get rid of their premise.




They gave Medusa cancer and put Black Bolt in prison after this with an emphasis on their past actions.



I was reading X-Men that whole time, along with inhumans. This was after Avengers vs. X-Men repopulated the world with mutants, so there were more mutants all of a sudden. The young X-Men were traveling through time and space, Jean told Iceman he was gay, Cyclops started a revolution, which a lot of people liked because they took a harder stance against discrimination, and there was more. Through out this whole time, they never stopped revoked their classic "metaphor." Like Earth X stated 20 years prior, inhumans were treated like mutants. Duh. And we didn't see mutants die left and right until they did the event, but we all new they weren't going to get rid of the X-Men entirely because this was the 6th "extinction" event and it was par for the course.

What I didn't get about people's anger was that they were writing new stories for the X-Men and created some new characters, new tv shows, new movies, but because some people read an article on a website we know here, they started to tell them what they were seeing wasn't happening, and that they were side lining the X-Men. You could buy a lot of X-Men comics at the time. I did. Maybe some people complained about Bendis's writing, but they also complained about the Inhumans' writing saying it was worse than the X-Men books at the time.

The biggest problem was equating any form of an inhuman book as an assault on X-Men books. When they ended up making two X-Men events from it and even had a joint reboot. They were gaslighting them and fear mongering. It did exist in their imagination and it was put there by bad faith actors who wanted clicks.

These are from the 1970's

All i'm going to say is please go read extraodinary Xmen. point blank Jeff Lemire wrote the hell out of the situation mutants were trapped in. and that wasn't at the end. the book started in 2016 and ran for 20 issues and all new inhumans and uncanny inhumans ran at the same time because i read both books. I saw the casino story, beast saving them from Kange in the past, the only time the cloud came up was when finn discovered his lost family. all new xmen started way back in 2012 so that was long before the actual story that was happening because the first issue of extraodinary was Storm recruiting teen Jean who was in school.

And i also read Al Ewing royals and the black bolt prison issue after both of which were good i remember posting how stellar the black bolt issues were with creed so i think your getting your timeline way messed up. so i know all about paralyzed Gorgon and medusa losing her hair and so on and so forth and the scene with her and black bolt basically connecting mentally and him giving her strength to go on and then finn being left behind because his body was crystalizing

I also read Death of the inhumans which was actually knox an inhuman going around killing inhumans and that story had NOTHING to do with mutants but somehow they get the blame for that too.

[Force de Phenix]

I also read Death of the inhumans which was actually knox an inhuman going around killing inhumans and that story had NOTHING to do with mutants but somehow they get the blame for that too.

No one has ever said this except you right now.

All i'm going to say is please go read extraodinary Xmen. point blank Jeff Lemire wrote the hell out of the situation mutants were trapped in. and that wasn't at the end. the book started in 2016 and ran for 20 issues and all new inhumans and uncanny inhumans ran at the same time because i read both books. I saw the casino story, beast saving them from Kange in the past, the only time the cloud came up was when finn discovered his lost family. all new xmen started way back in 2012 so that was long before the actual story that was happening because the first issue of extraodinary was Storm recruiting teen Jean who was in school.

And i also read Al Ewing royals and the black bolt prison issue after both of which were good i remember posting how stellar the black bolt issues were with creed so i think your getting your timeline way messed up. so i know all about paralyzed Gorgon and medusa losing her hair and so on and so forth and the scene with her and black bolt basically connecting mentally and him giving her strength to go on and then finn being left behind because his body was crystalizing

The whole point is that they were indeed writing X-Men stories. Plus, the inhumans were punished severely but the following stories putting them in prison, having them get sick, destroying any new inhumans from being created, and later killing the Universal Inhumans, 2 legacy inhumans, their second attempt at a moon base, and a couple of Earth inhumans. How anyone could think that they were not punished by Marvel is beyond me. And this was before Disney pulled a move to become more of a monopoly and bought Fox, so it wasn't like this happened because they had the right to the X-Men at Disney Studios. They did not, and despite this, they did all these horrible things to the inhumans and rebooted the X-Men and brought Jean Grey and Wolverine back, before Disney bought Fox.

People liked teen Jean and they liked Bendis's work with the X-Men during his tenure at Marvel. What people didn't like were the 5 back to back events, the alleged "POC being shoved down our throats", and Jane Foster, Iron Heart, Moon Girl being the smartest person in the Marvel Universe. Which was a mix of bigotry and new things scaring people.

And you said it. They ran these books at the same time, and inhumans never had more books than the X-Men at any point in this. People were given the X-Men, and had new stories, etc., but ignored the fact that they were coexisting with classic characters getting recognition and ended up demonizing anything they did as a plot against the X-Men.

And I read all the X-Men at that time, and saw the movies and TV shows.

[Chris0013]

They gave Medusa cancer and put Black Bolt in prison after this with an emphasis on their past actions.

And then very soon after they went right back to the status quo. Always happens. Same withe the falling out between Carol Danvers and Jessica Drew over the death of Bruce/Hulk. Jess hated Carol for it...and then just made up because reasons.

[jwatson]

No one has ever said this except you right now.



The whole point is that they were indeed writing X-Men stories. Plus, the inhumans were punished severely but the following stories putting them in prison, having them get sick, destroying any new inhumans from being created, and later killing the Universal Inhumans, 2 legacy inhumans, their second attempt at a moon base, and a couple of Earth inhumans. How anyone could think that they were not punished by Marvel is beyond me. And this was before Disney pulled a move to become more of a monopoly and bought Fox, so it wasn't like this happened because they had the right to the X-Men at Disney Studios. They did not, and despite this, they did all these horrible things to the inhumans and rebooted the X-Men and brought Jean Grey and Wolverine back, before Disney bought Fox.

People liked teen Jean and they liked Bendis's work with the X-Men during his tenure at Marvel. What people didn't like were the 5 back to back events, the alleged "POC being shoved down our throats", and Jane Foster, Iron Heart, Moon Girl being the smartest person in the Marvel Universe. Which was a mix of bigotry and new things scaring people.

And you said it. They ran these books at the same time, and inhumans never had more books than the X-Men at any point in this. People were given the X-Men, and had new stories, etc., but ignored the fact that they were coexisting with classic characters getting recognition and ended up demonizing anything they did as a plot against the X-Men.

And I read all the X-Men at that time, and saw the movies and TV shows.

Just because you say it will never make it fact. Like i don't care about the Fox movies so it was nothing for me i stopped after x1 tried last stand(or first class which ever one they were young) and quit again and then tried Days of and quit the last time so there were no movies for ME as an X-fan. Also terrigen never had anything to do with mutants so blame it on editorial because not a single x-fan was clamoring to see our characters be gassed. Also it was the main board that had a problem with the diversity issue because i was here when it was happening and i remember the bitching and moaning about their faves being "Replaced" just like i was here when inhuman fans were all "suck it, mutants had their time." so people can blame x-fans all they want for not supporting a story that was literally dropped on us out the blue but it is what it is. I know what was happening cause i was here and i was reading the books and i saw mutants being gassed and i read Charles peanut allergy soule interview. So take it up with that dude and the editors but to blame fans who spend their money on what THEY want to read not another franchise being pushed on them is absurd to me.

And quite frankly the funniest part is I still supported it because i did read All new and Uncanny because i knew the other shoe would drop and i wanted to see how it was handled especially with all the gaslighting that was going on. CBR may have edited the boards and deleted a lot of posts but i remember clear as day when i think about it, i can bring up the image of some of the posts and posters in my mind.

And x-fans aren't the ones who doled out any punishment so again it sounds like your problem is marvel. They pimped the story, they released the gas and when it didn't go how they expected because it just was visually wrong, not even going into the story THEY chose to punish the inhumans for the stories they created. Same way mutants had NOTHING to do with HOM and got the decimation but if you think we were clamoring for that that is hilarious to me because no x-fan wanted their fave depowered or dead from gas and especially from a story they most likely didn't even know existed let alone read.

[Frontier]

https://www.cbr.com/black-panther-da...orever-marvel/

Didn't know if this was confirmed before but Kaluuya won't be in the sequel. I'm a little disappointed because while his character was a waste in the first movie, Kaluuya is so talented and this would have been a great opportunity to expand on him. Plus I think having more black men in the mix in this movie is ideal.

There really seems to be a distinct lack of prominent black males in a Black Panther movie.