Marvel Cinematic Universe Part II

[charliehustle415]

Not sure how I feel about them trying to graft Mayan culture onto Namor and Atlantis.

It's a completely cynical move in an attempt to present as more "diverse". This is a case of literal cultural appropriation.

To be fair a lot of cultures have some kind of myth of a lost city/society/island.

But at least he looks cool AF, my hope is that his characterization is very Hickman i.e pure bad ass

[Omega Alpha]

It's a completely cynical move in an attempt to present as more "diverse". This is a case of literal cultural appropriation.

I think it's more of a case of them wanting to making him very different from Aquaman, even though the latter is the rip-off.

[Doombot]

Namor himself is so very different from Aquaman, it would not be difficult to differentiate between them. Audiences, certainly the audiences that obsess over MCU films, would not really need Namor to spontaneously now be Mesoamerican to know he's not Aquaman.

[Ascended]

It does seem an odd choice. Isn't Atlantis supposed to be somewhere in the Eastern hemisphere, quite far removed from Mesoamerica? I'm not an expert on Marvel's Atlantis so maybe I'm wrong?

Either way, while it strikes me as a strange choice, I expect Coogler will make it work somehow. Seriously, Namor and Atlantis are the absolute *last* things to be worried about in this movie. I love the cast and Coogler and Marvel hasn't really let me down yet, but this film feel like it was cursed from the start.

[MindofShadow]

Seriously, Namor and Atlantis are the absolute *last* things to be worried about in this movie.

I disagree a bit here for a few reasons.

Something has to be shafted here. They always claimed they wanted to dig into Wakanda more... but when are they going to have time to do that?

Something has to give... they aleady have to fix the T'challa situation, they have to have Shuri's arc, they are shoe horning Iron Heart into it, and now Namor and their culture?

And that isn't even touching ANY of the stuff from the first movie. The whole, "hard to be a good man and a king." The whole, "opening up yoru country also opens it up to others problems." They whole, "the world now knows that is an African superpower country."

So is all this "atlantis culture" stuff just going to be superficial as hell? Are we getting barely any Wakanda? Something has to give somewhere.

And this isn't even getting into possible CGI problems. DC spent a TON of time and money trying to get Atlantis write and it still looked wonky in spots. MCU's cgi has been... shaky at times lately at best. And this movie had a very late start.


(also, what is the point of latching onto South American culture if all of them but one are Blue lol?)

[chief12d]

I disagree a bit here for a few reasons.

Something has to be shafted here. They always claimed they wanted to dig into Wakanda more... but when are they going to have time to do that?

Something has to give... they aleady have to fix the T'challa situation, they have to have Shuri's arc, they are shoe horning Iron Heart into it, and now Namor and their culture?

And that isn't even touching ANY of the stuff from the first movie. The whole, "hard to be a good man and a king." The whole, "opening up yoru country also opens it up to others problems." They whole, "the world now knows that is an African superpower country."

So is all this "atlantis culture" stuff just going to be superficial as hell? Are we getting barely any Wakanda? Something has to give somewhere.

And this isn't even getting into possible CGI problems. DC spent a TON of time and money trying to get Atlantis write and it still looked wonky in spots. MCU's cgi has been... shaky at times lately at best. And this movie had a very late start.


(also, what is the point of latching onto South American culture if all of them but one are Blue lol?)

On that last bit I’m interested to see how people comment on Disney’s approach to this. Studios have gotten pushback in the past when they grafted real world non-white/marginalized cultures onto inhuman races. It’s one thing for Wakandans to actually be black and appropriate elements of African culture and another to have an alien or fantastical species base their culture on a real world group of people.

It fits into the problematic history of actors of color being pushed into playing non-humans in an otherwise all white cast. I tend to think such criticisms are overblown even if rooted in real grievances but Disney seems to be doing this on such a massive scale with an underrepresented culture that I could see a lot of complaints. Even more so if they depict the Atlanteans as the barbarians they tend to be shown as in the comics.

The fact there doesn’t seem to be any major Latino representation behind the camera may also pose issues. Just because Coogler is black doesn’t mean he’s completely able to handle the intricacies of creating a fictional Mesoamerican-influenced aquatic civilization with all the potential room for stereotypes and unfortunate tropes about the community Marvel’s trying to target.

[Frontier]

On that last bit I’m interested to see how people comment on Disney’s approach to this. Studios have gotten pushback in the past when they grafted real world non-white/marginalized cultures onto inhuman races. It’s one thing for Wakandans to actually be black and appropriate elements of African culture and another to have an alien or fantastical species base their culture on a real world group of people.

It fits into the problematic history of actors of color being pushed into playing non-humans in an otherwise all white cast. I tend to think such criticisms are overblown even if rooted in real grievances but Disney seems to be doing this on such a massive scale with an underrepresented culture that I could see a lot of complaints. Even more so if they depict the Atlanteans as the barbarians they tend to be shown as in the comics.

The fact there doesn’t seem to be any major Latino representation behind the camera may also pose issues. Just because Coogler is black doesn’t mean he’s completely able to handle the intricacies of creating a fictional Mesoamerican-influenced aquatic civilization with all the potential room for stereotypes and unfortunate tropes about the community Marvel’s trying to target.

They also wrote out the Robbie Reyes Ghost Rider so they don't really have a really prominent Latino hero at the moment...unless the announce a White Tiger Disney+ show.

[Kingdom X]

I disagree a bit here for a few reasons.

Something has to be shafted here. They always claimed they wanted to dig into Wakanda more... but when are they going to have time to do that?

Something has to give... they aleady have to fix the T'challa situation, they have to have Shuri's arc, they are shoe horning Iron Heart into it, and now Namor and their culture?

And that isn't even touching ANY of the stuff from the first movie. The whole, "hard to be a good man and a king." The whole, "opening up yoru country also opens it up to others problems." They whole, "the world now knows that is an African superpower country."

So is all this "atlantis culture" stuff just going to be superficial as hell? Are we getting barely any Wakanda? Something has to give somewhere.

And this isn't even getting into possible CGI problems. DC spent a TON of time and money trying to get Atlantis write and it still looked wonky in spots. MCU's cgi has been... shaky at times lately at best. And this movie had a very late start.


(also, what is the point of latching onto South American culture if all of them but one are Blue lol?)

I'm assuming we're going to get deep dives into Wakanda itself on Disney+
https://deadline.com/2021/02/black-p...ia-1234684707/

I think I need to see a trailer because I cannot figure out how I feel about this movie. On the one hand I trust Coogler and the first film had such a strong supporting cast so I know the actors will bring it. On the other hand... while it's cool to get some Central/South American rep, if they're being introduced as antagonists without any Latino/a talent behind the camera... well isn't that the same **** we've been complaining about white directors doing to us for years?

[Maine Starfish]

They also wrote out the Robbie Reyes Ghost Rider so they don't really have a really prominent Latino hero at the moment...unless the announce a White Tiger Disney+ show.

well, America Chavez was just introduced as well

but anyways I think the mayan/aztec influence on the design for Namor looks dope as ****

[Witchfan]

I don’t like anything I see there.

[InfamousBG]

He looks awful plain and simple. That is not Namor. Now I am not one to usually lose my cool over changing comic characters to the big screen but this...this...no. Just no.

I am praying I am wrong. I hope I am very wrong.

[Frontier]

It's really hard for me to imagine Namor with stuff in his nose and ears.

[the illustrious mr. kenway]

I finally saw Multiverse of Madness and I enjoyed it more than I thought I would. It's a decent Dr. Strange flick but they did Wanda dirty. However Ms. Olsen pulled off being a campy Disney villain and it added to the horror aspect.

[MindofShadow]

The fact there doesn’t seem to be any major Latino representation behind the camera may also pose issues. Just because Coogler is black doesn’t mean he’s completely able to handle the intricacies of creating a fictional Mesoamerican-influenced aquatic civilization with all the potential room for stereotypes and unfortunate tropes about the community Marvel’s trying to target.

Also don't forget a lot of the "good african stuff" in Wakanda was Chadwick pushing it.

Then again, I think that Namor actor is rather outspoken and firey so, maybe that might help.

[John Venus]

Is there a T'Challa/Namor cross over in the comics that could serve as an indicator for where they might be going with this?

I know there is Secret Wars but that was part of a much bigger cross over, I'm talking about something that involves just T'Challa and Namor (also possibly Dr Doom).