Marvel Cinematic Universe Part II

[skyvolt2000]

But then that never actually happened though?
The speculation only existed from the "Recast T'Challa" people who wanted a reason to get mad.

Yes it did in comics.

The recast crowd didn't want him KILLED off.

The ones that wanted him gone was the usual suspects that were ONLY concerned that Shuri be the lead.

Anyone else dies and we get a new person yet here that was not allowed for some reason. The usual suspects who lurk on Twitter and only cared that Shuri was Black Panther once. They wanted the window dressing while they DON'T show up to support the movie just like they didn't show up for Woman King and Proud Mary. Yet will cry they are not represented.

All these folks kept screaming Wakanda was the star NOT T'Challa. It's just a mantle.

Funny outside of Marvel's editors and that movie-NOBODY else believed that.

He still got more merchandise than Shuri. His trades still outsell Shuri and the rest. Nobody seems to be willing to use the collection of losers Coates & Ridley created.

So if it was just a mantle as so many claimed-SALES would confirm that. Yet they don't.

[mace11]

Brie Larson responds to leaving Marvel after The Marvels Flopped

[PhantomBoom]

Yes it did in comics.

The recast crowd didn't want him KILLED off.

The ones that wanted him gone was the usual suspects that were ONLY concerned that Shuri be the lead.

Anyone else dies and we get a new person yet here that was not allowed for some reason. The usual suspects who lurk on Twitter and only cared that Shuri was Black Panther once. They wanted the window dressing while they DON'T show up to support the movie just like they didn't show up for Woman King and Proud Mary. Yet will cry they are not represented.

All these folks kept screaming Wakanda was the star NOT T'Challa. It's just a mantle.

Funny outside of Marvel's editors and that movie-NOBODY else believed that.

He still got more merchandise than Shuri. His trades still outsell Shuri and the rest. Nobody seems to be willing to use the collection of losers Coates & Ridley created.

So if it was just a mantle as so many claimed-SALES would confirm that. Yet they don't.

All of this is such nonsense.
Like there was no one calling for some mass removal of T'Challa and for him to be replaced by Shuri in all Black Panther media, that is just not a thing that happened, and if anyone said anything close to that, I'm sure it was a minority of one or two twitter weirdos, so no one who actually matters at all.

And T'Challa not getting recast because his actor died isn't anything new, it happens all the time, when Heath Ledger died Nolan changed his plans for the third Dark Knight, and then because of that we wouldn't see Joker in a live action movie for over 8 years, and it required a continuity reboot, I'm not sure why you're trying to act like this is some kind of unique case when it isn't.
Then beyond that people did show up to support Wakanda Forever, it was very successful at the box office and was one of the highest grossing movies of 2022, I also don't understand why you're even trying to compare it to the Woman King or Proud Mary(a movie I've never heard of before today), from what I know the subject matter, stories and overall appeal of all these movies are different, the only thing all of them have in common from what I looked up is that they all have female protagonists, and if that's your point then yikes.

And Black Panther is a mantle, it is a literally a part of the character's lore that it's a mantle passed down through generations, and T'Challa was never the only or even the first Black Panther.

[Panic]

All of this is such nonsense.
Like there was no one calling for some mass removal of T'Challa and for him to be replaced by Shuri in all Black Panther media, that is just not a thing that happened, and if anyone said anything close to that, I'm sure it was a minority of one or two twitter weirdos, so no one who actually matters at all.

And T'Challa not getting recast because his actor died isn't anything new, it happens all the time, when Heath Ledger died Nolan changed his plans for the third Dark Knight, and then because of that we wouldn't see Joker in a live action movie for over 8 years, and it required a continuity reboot, I'm not sure why you're trying to act like this is some kind of unique case when it isn't.
Then beyond that people did show up to support Wakanda Forever, it was very successful at the box office and was one of the highest grossing movies of 2022, I also don't understand why you're even trying to compare it to the Woman King or Proud Mary(a movie I've never heard of before today), from what I know the subject matter, stories and overall appeal of all these movies are different, the only thing all of them have in common from what I looked up is that they all have female protagonists, and if that's your point then yikes.

And Black Panther is a mantle, it is a literally a part of the character's lore that it's a mantle passed down through generations, and T'Challa was never the only or even the first Black Panther.

The Black Panther identity was created for T'Challa, and it being a mantle was I believe a retcon to enhance T'Challa and his mythos; it shouldn't be used as an excuse to remove him from the picture. They took a character specifically created to be a hero to a particular demographic (who are under-represented in this area), and they ditched him because they cared more about being seen to be respectful of the actor's death than the character and what he was created to do (or for that matter what Chadwick Boseman would have wanted). All the classic Black Panther stories are about T'Challa, I don't think it was fair to his fanbase to simply play the mantle card.

[PhantomBoom]

The Black Panther identity was created for T'Challa, and it being a mantle was I believe a retcon to enhance T'Challa and his mythos; it shouldn't be used as an excuse to remove him from the picture. They took a character specifically created to be a hero to a particular demographic (who are under-represented in this area), and they ditched him because they cared more about being seen to be respectful of the actor's death than the character and what he was created to do (or for that matter what Chadwick Boseman would have wanted). All the classic Black Panther stories are about T'Challa, I don't think it was fair to his fanbase to simply play the mantle card.

I feel very confident you likely never met Chadwick Boseman while he was alive and you certainly don't know him now, so don't for the love of God don't put words in the mouth of a man who died because you don't like decisions made in movies.
And no they didn't "ditch" T'Challa, don't try to make this into some kind of conspiracy when it's not, it's not like his actor left over contract disputes or anything like that, he died of cancer.

[Panic]

I feel very confident you likely never met Chadwick Boseman while he was alive and you certainly don't know him now, so don't for the love of God don't put words in the mouth of a man who died because you don't like decisions made in movies.

I didn't know him. I have read the Black Panther appreciation thread where they have said, iirc, that Chadwick Boseman's family (his brother, I think) had said that Chadwick would have wanted the character to be recast rather than die with him. If I'm remembering wrong I'm sure they'll put me right, however I believe that was what was said. The people in that thread will know a lot more about this stuff than most of the rest of us.

And no they didn't "ditch" T'Challa, don't try to make this into some kind of conspiracy when it's not, it's not like his actor left over contract disputes or anything like that, he died of cancer.

I wasn't trying to make it some sort of conspiracy. The actor died. They could have recast him. They decided to kill the character rather than recast. The death of the actor doesn't automatically mean the character has to die - for example, Dumbledore was not killed-off in Harry Potter when Richard Harris died. In this case I suspect that they cared more about how things looked than anything else. Consequently I think the long-term BP fanbase got screwed, and I feel sympathy for them.

[Gaastra]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime...6c1e6a14&ei=11

Majors avoids jail by going to the shrink.

[PhantomBoom]

I didn't know him. I have read the Black Panther appreciation thread where they have said, iirc, that Chadwick Boseman's family (his brother, I think) had said that Chadwick would have wanted the character to be recast rather than die with him. If I'm remembering wrong I'm sure they'll put me right, however I believe that was what was said. The people in that thread will know a lot more about this stuff than most of the rest of us.

None of Boseman have spoken about it other than his brother, the rest have been very supportive of Wakanda Forever.
And even his brother has had nothing more to say than "I think he would've wanted the role recast".

I wasn't trying to make it some sort of conspiracy. The actor died. They could have recast him. They decided to kill the character rather than recast. The death of the actor doesn't automatically mean the character has to die - for example, Dumbledore was not killed-off in Harry Potter when Richard Harris died. In this case I suspect that they cared more about how things looked than anything else.

"I wasn't trying to make a conspiracy but also heres my conspiracy theory". Yeah sure. Beyond that Ryan Coogler was friends with Boseman and alsmot left the movie entirely because of Boseman's death, so to claim T'Challa wasn't recast because no one actually cared is wrong.
There are multiple cases of movies, shows and even animated series not recasting when an actor dies, this is not in any way unique at all, I can bring up multiple examples both past and present of this happening.

Consequently I think the long-term BP fanbase got screwed, and I feel sympathy for them.

I feel far more sympathy for the man who died, especially if apparently his death means this little to them

[Frontier]

I understand the personal and emotional reasoning behind not recasting and having the actual feelings of Chadwick's loss play out in the actual film.

But it also left a huge hole in both the franchise and the MCU in general without T'Challa and it is just as felt.

I wasn't trying to make it some sort of conspiracy. The actor died. They could have recast him. They decided to kill the character rather than recast. The death of the actor doesn't automatically mean the character has to die - for example, Dumbledore was not killed-off in Harry Potter when Richard Harris died. In this case I suspect that they cared more about how things looked than anything else. Consequently I think the long-term BP fanbase got screwed, and I feel sympathy for them.

Which we've even seen in the MCU in the case of Thunderbolt Ross.

[PhantomBoom]

It really didn't.
I'm not going to act like it isn't a shame T'Challa isn't around, but there's no "huge hole" in the franchise or the MCU.

[80sbaby]

It really didn't.
I'm not going to act like it isn't a shame T'Challa isn't around, but there's no "huge hole" in the franchise or the MCU.

Yes there is. Boseman's T'Challa was going to be a central figure in the MCU, like Steve and Tony. They no longer have that, unfortunately.

[PhantomBoom]

Yes there is. Boseman's T'Challa was going to be a central figure in the MCU, like Steve and Tony. They no longer have that, unfortunately.

And why can't Shuri the new Black Panther be that? Or literally anyone else? I like T'Challa but come on now, he's not essential for this role, especially not with all the characters the MCU has already introduced and haven't even gotten to yet.

Like we're about to get the F4 introduced why can't Reed be a central figure in the MCU going forward?

[gurkle]

They can't just decide someone is going to be their flagship character. Or they can, but sometimes it doesn't work out (see: The Marvels).

T'Challa was going to be a flagship character going forward because audiences loved Boseman as T'Challa, to an extent that doesn't often happen, and it seemed like with the success of Black Panther, T'Challa was going to fill the hole left by Downey stepping down as Iron Man. Losing him was terrible luck for the MCU (worse for the man and his loved ones, of course), and there was a huge hole to fill. Recasting the part might not have filled the hole, but some people think it was worth trying while others don't.

[80sbaby]

And why can't Shuri the new Black Panther be that? Or literally anyone else? I like T'Challa but come on now, he's not essential for this role, especially not with all the characters the MCU has already introduced and haven't even gotten to yet.

Like we're about to get the F4 introduced why can't Reed be a central figure in the MCU going forward?

Because the fanbase hasn't gotten behind Letitia Wright's portrayal the way they did Boseman's. She doesn't have that presence and it's not even in the character's wheelhouse, really.

Reed could be, sure. But we are talking about what's happening now.

[80sbaby]

They can't just decide someone is going to be their flagship character. Or they can, but sometimes it doesn't work out (see: The Marvels).

T'Challa was going to be a flagship character going forward because audiences loved Boseman as T'Challa, to an extent that doesn't often happen, and it seemed like with the success of Black Panther, T'Challa was going to fill the hole left by Downey stepping down as Iron Man. Losing him was terrible luck for the MCU (worse for the man and his loved ones, of course), and there was a huge hole to fill. Recasting the part might not have filled the hole, but some people think it was worth trying while others don't.

Exactly this. The character worked for the audience as a whole, casuals and die hard comic fans alike. Shuri isn't that.