Marvel Cinematic Universe Part II

[MindofShadow]

Inhumans Royal Family fans are in total agreement!

Yep! Can't wait for the Inhumans first appearance in TV or Movies, because they've never had a show before! Never! It will be really cool to see them for hte first time!

[MindofShadow]

Love Gunn, but he along with any other creative from the MCU can say whatever they want. My head canon will always say otherwise considering the acknowledgement the shows gave the movies and how good they were (well, with the notable exception of Iron Fist, anyway).

That said, I would be curious as to how Feige and company would interpret The Hand, themselves.

Some of them may have been good, but connecting to the canon didn't do anything for them and vice versa.

Just because they aren't "canon" doesn't mean the shows still aren't good.

It really just means, eventually we will see the same characters again in new shows or movies. Which, if you are a fan of the characters, means more media, which is always good.

[CosmiComic]

I figure Hawkeye is gonna be heavy on the Fraction influence, with the more serious Winter Soldier type approach used as a foundation. Hoping we get some flashbacks to Clint's youth, hoping for the circus origin to be used. Figure it'll be somewhat irreverent but more satire than zinger.

Ms. Marvel I think will be more YA-ish, more zany, Iron Man type fun. More like her early comics. Hope the rumors of a totally new origin are false; can't do the terrigen cloud in the MCU (unless some wild stuff happens before the show starts, which is possible) but I don't want them to stray any further than they need to from the source material.

Someone else can be responsible for the Terrigen cloud, although I doubt it would be exactly like the comics version.

One thing I hope for Hawkeye is he'll actually be a character period. Frankly, I think Kate will be more interesting.

Yep! Can't wait for the Inhumans first appearance in TV or Movies, because they've never had a show before! Never! It will be really cool to see them for hte first time!

Haha, maybe one of them will show up in Ms Marvel

Some of them may have been good, but connecting to the canon didn't do anything for them and vice versa.

Just because they aren't "canon" doesn't mean the shows still aren't good.

It really just means, eventually we will see the same characters again in new shows or movies. Which, if you are a fan of the characters, means more media, which is always good.

They can always be brought back with the shows being a vague backstory but not explicitly referenced.

[mathew101281]

The Netflix show I can see how they can easily say they aren’t canon, but Agents of Shield, was directly referenced in the movies themselves.

[Frontier]

The Netflix show I can see how they can easily say they aren’t canon, but Agents of Shield, was directly referenced in the movies themselves.

Well, in a way that's easy to gloss over like "how did Fury get that Hellicarrier in AoU?"

I don't prefer it that way, but I can see the movie guys looking at it like that.

[Ascended]

Someone else can be responsible for the Terrigen cloud, although I doubt it would be exactly like the comics version.

One thing I hope for Hawkeye is he'll actually be a character period. Frankly, I think Kate will be more interesting.

Oh, they could definitely introduce the terrigen cloud, or something like it, before Ms. Marvel hits. Just a guess but it seems to me like the Eternals is the most likely place for that to go down, if that's what happens.

I'm not too concerned about the details, and the show won't reflect the comics perfectly and shouldn't. But Marvel has played a really dumb game in recent years where they write off all things mutant, then all things Inhuman, depending on what movie rights they have access to, and I really don't want that screwing with Kamala. Change what *has* to be changed so the character fits into the MCU narrative, but otherwise stick to the source material.

My guess is they'll make Kamala a mutant instead of a Inhuman. And that'd actually be fine with me; it keeps her tied to a marginalized group of superhumans and her origin sequence can play out mostly the same as the comics. But as long as the show is well done and they don't change Kamala so much she's no longer Kamala, I'll be happy.

As for Clint, I wouldn't worry. These shows have done a damn fine job of expanding and exploring the films' secondary characters. We learned more about Sam Wilson in the first episode of F&tWS than we did in his four or five previous film appearances, we learned more about Wanda's history and character than we ever did in her film appearances. The Hawkeye show will have plenty of room to dive into Clint, his character, his history, and really develop him in a way the films never did. It'll be fine.

They can always be brought back with the shows being a vague backstory but not explicitly referenced.

I'd be fine with that, but even if the Studio took that approach I don't think it'd take long before they contradicted something from the show. Like, even if they got Cox back as Daredevil and acted like the show could possibly/maybe be part of canon, before long we'd have some conflict with Kingpin or Bullseye that doesn't fit. No point in halfassing it and trying to work around a show you don't have the rights to; better to start from scratch.

I think the best case scenario, and I wouldn't bet on this happening, is that some of the actors return to their roles but Marvel says the Netflix stuff was just a multiverse branch. But I think we'll get new casting.

If I'm wrong, that'll be great though. Those Netflix shows were (mostly) really damn good with some superb casting and I'd hate to lose those guys. But I think we're going to.

[chicago_bastard]

The Netflix show I can see how they can easily say they aren’t canon, but Agents of Shield, was directly referenced in the movies themselves.

Please give one example of a direct reference to AoS in a movie. One that is clearly stated as such and not just the product of the imagination of AoS fans who want it to be a reference.

[Drops Of Venus]

The Netflix show I can see how they can easily say they aren’t canon, but Agents of Shield, was directly referenced in the movies themselves.

If you're talking about Age Of Ultron, that's hardly what I would call a direct reference. Nick Fury mentioned getting help from a friend, and then AOS expanded on that by showing that friend was Coulson. The movie never showed us who that friend was, so there is enough room for deniability. That was the entire nature of the relationship between Marvel Studios and TV: one-sided. Also, that was in early 2015 when Marvel Studios was still working under Marvel Entertainment, something that changed that same year and distanced the two even further. The fact that Joss Whedon directed AOU and helped co-create AOS was also certainly a factor on why that little easter-egg was allowed.

[Ascended]

There were a number of easter eggs in the films, but that's all they were. Stuff like in Winter Soldier; when Fury cuts his way out of his SUV, the device he uses was introduced in AoS first. There's actually a lot of things like that, small details you gotta keep an eye out for or you'll miss them. Can't remember what a lot of them are, but I'm sure Google remembers, if anyone cares to look it up.

But that's all the films ever did; minor easter eggs and "blink and you'll miss it" reference points. And it makes sense; you don't assume everyone in the theater is also watching the shows so you limit your references to small stuff that won't throw the pace and plot off for anyone not tuning into ABC each week. The shows, on the other hand, (rightfully) assume that if you're watching them you're also watching the films so they can go deeper with the tie-in's.

But in any case, the shows never fully realized the promise of it all "being connected." Between whatever legal/contractual hurdles existed between multiple studios, filming schedules, the beef between Fiege and Ike, whatever, I think we can all agree that the connections between the films and the tv stuff wasn't what we were promised.

Now, I never understood the argument that AoS *wasn't* canon just because the relationship between films and tv was one-sided. I have no idea what happened in Paris yesterday, but Paris still exists on the same planet I do. I figure it's Occam's razor; the simplest solution is that it was a shared universe but the films simply didn't discuss the shows' events, just like the films never talked about the dark elf invasion in Thor 2, or the time Tony was assumed dead in Iron Man 3.

Everyone always asks where the films directly reference the shows, but we could also ask where the films directly contradict the shows too. Give me an example where the films establish something that goes against what the shows did.

And it's all moot now anyway. Arguably the shows were canon....until Disney decided to get into the streaming service game, ripped up their contracts with ABC and Netflix, and started Disney+. Whether the shows were canon or not, they aren't now (except, apparently, Agent Carter).

[Oberon]

It's canon if you want it to be, and if not, that's okay too.

It is sad about the discarding of both AoS *and* the Netflix shows?

They don't even get to be considered an alt 'verse, yet Tobey Maguire Spider man movies do?

[CosmiComic]

I'd honestly prefer Kamala remain an Inhuman. I generally like when the origins stay the aside from outdated or problematic parts

[Writerblog]

I'd honestly prefer Kamala remain an Inhuman. I generally like when the origins stay the aside from outdated or problematic parts

I see no problem with her original origin, but seems like some marvel creatives hates inhumans

[CosmiComic]

I see no problem with her original origin, but seems like some marvel creatives hates inhumans

I think it's because of the whole IvX thing. But blaming yhr characters for editorial decisions doesn't make much sense.

I'm not a huge Inhuman royal family fan, because they always seemed fairly classist to me. And the could killing mutants wasn't endearing either. But I think Kamala's connections to the Inhumans is more interesting than jsut being a mutant, and it connects her to Captain Marvel ina a way

[Metro]

Eh I think with Vulture it's less about Tony specifically and more about class warfare in general. Yes Tony funded Damage Control, or helped design it or whatever, but that's just narrative synergy at work; the real point was that the rich and powerful made a mess and then paid themselves to clean it up while the little guy got screwed. Tony was just the face of that story element, for obvious reasons.

With Mysterio, it was very much about Tony specifically, and the pain he had caused, both real and perceived.

It really wasn't.
With Mysterio it was all about how self centered and vain he was, he just used Tony as an excuse to be a psycho.

One thing I hope for Hawkeye is he'll actually be a character period

He was already one though.

[CosmiComic]

I was being snarky but MCU Hawkeye is barely a character. He's boring with no personality. He's really the only MCU hero I dislike.

I don't disagree with your othet point. If Beck was willing to kill and lie like this, he was never stable to begin with. Stark was just a trigger for him