Marvel Cinematic Universe Part II

[CosmiComic]

WandaVision didn't need any villains in the first place, though.

[Frontier]

Because the MCU sometimes seems afraid of accountability. That's why anyone seeking it is villainized.

I don't think it's just that but the need to keep the protagonists as the heroes they have to make the villains so extreme to the point where you start sympathizing them or thinking their point is worth the methods they go about to achieve it.

It works in the instances of, like, Killmonger where you can see why he goes over the edge while understanding his views and Michael B. Jordan's performance can carry it but stuff like the Flag-Smashers just doesn't hit.

[CosmiComic]

I don't think it's just that but the need to keep the protagonists as the heroes they have to make the villains so extreme to the point where you start sympathizing them or thinking their point is worth the methods they go about to achieve it.

It works in the instances of, like, Killmonger where you can see why he goes over the edge while understanding his views and Michael B. Jordan's performance can carry it but stuff like the Flag-Smashers just doesn't hit.

Marvel still villainized those ideologies though, whether they were well made or not. And honestly, Killmonger's ideas don't really work anyway.

[Drops Of Venus]

Scratchy could be her son Nicolas Scratch that she polyformed with magic. Because he originally was a villain of her's.

That was one of my theories during the show, but Matt Shakman specifically referred to Scratchy as her familiar while talking about the deleted scene, so it definitely seems like the plan was to make him fill the role Ebony had in the comics.

[Frontier]

Marvel still villainized those ideologies though, whether they were well made or not. And honestly, Killmonger's ideas don't really work anyway.

Villainized in so far as they were extremists.

For Killmonger it wasn't about his plan actually working but him getting the satisfaction of inflicting the pain he felt on the rest of the world.

[GenericUsername]

WandaVision didn't need any villains in the first place, though.

Agreed. The show was putting the focus on inner struggle. Dealing with loss in a time where there's been so much loss. Very relatable.

[GenericUsername]

I'm just wondering 'Why her?' Obviously they have plans for her, but she doesn't seem like a lead character right now.

Because like I said, they are introducing a lot to the magic side in the MCU. So likely she will have a link to all of that.

[Frontier]

Agreed. The show was putting the focus on inner struggle. Dealing with loss in a time where there's been so much loss. Very relatable.

Maybe could've toned down the consequences of said loss a tad...

[GenericUsername]

I think Moon Knight will show how far Disney is willing to take their Marvel shows because that would probably be the most in the spirit of the Netflix shows.

No more worse than Karli and the "don't call them terrorists even though they are terrorists" Flag-Smashers.

It was kind of illogical that everyone was so against Hayward and constantly questioning him when everything Wanda was doing at the time was kind of justifying his response to her. You had the potential for a nuanced look at someone going over the edge and using every means at their disposal in a post-Snap world...and you do nothing with it other than make him a cartoon bad guy.

Like, there was kind of this weird moral double-standard where the show wants us and some of the characters to empathize with and believe in Wanda even when it makes no sense and wasn't really justified. I feel like this hurt Monica's character a lot at the end.

Hayward was just there to keep people guessing who the real villain was when it was depression all along. Also I think they introduced him to put him in a future project. Like they did with Monica.

[Frontier]

Hayward was just there to keep people guessing who the real villain was when it was depression all along.

That doesn't really make him a better character.

[GenericUsername]

Maybe could've toned down the consequences of said loss a tad...

Blame people obsessed with HoM and parroting about recreating it all the time to creators.

[Frontier]

Blame people obsessed with HoM and parroting about recreating it all the time to creators.

Well, I think it was more just the execution and how culpable they made Wanda in what happened.

[CosmiComic]

Villainized in so far as they were extremists.

For Killmonger it wasn't about his plan actually working but him getting the satisfaction of inflicting the pain he felt on the rest of the world.

Villainized as in the bad guys were the ones wanting to fix the problems. IMO it's gotten old. Let's actually make the heroes try to fix things.

And Killmonger didn't seem to really care about the people he was actively hurting

Agreed. The show was putting the focus on inner struggle. Dealing with loss in a time where there's been so much loss. Very relatable.

Yeah, she didn't really need to fight against Agatha, as cool as it was

Because like I said, they are introducing a lot to the magic side in the MCU. So likely she will have a link to all of that.

There are many other magical characters who'd be a better fit

[Frontier]

Villainized as in the bad guys were the ones wanting to fix the problems. IMO it's gotten old. Let's actually make the heroes try to fix things.

Well, Nakia wanted T'Challa to address the same issues, it was just a collective progression of stuff that lead to T'Challa's decision to open up Wakanda and do more.

And Killmonger didn't seem to really care about the people he was actively hurting

That was the point.

[CosmiComic]

Well, Nakia wanted T'Challa to address the same issues, it was just a collective progression of stuff that lead to T'Challa's decision to open up Wakanda and do more.

Correct. Although I meant to say 'superhero', not just 'good guy'.

That was the point.

I know but there's people acting like he was right when he really wasn't. Civil rights protestors didn't necessarily lead violent revolutions and murder people to achieve progress.