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  1. #4261
    Astonishing Member WonderLight789's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primal Slayer View Post
    If you think we are in the same place now as we were then.....well lol...good luck with that.

    Other users may comment on how power level but it doesnt seem like its the only thing they comment on which like I said if thats what one wants to focus on, they can.



    WW84 was FREE or basically $15 for the US to watch. Black Widow is $30 + $6.99 for D+. That's a major difference.
    We are in the same place. All the evidence that Rightoya posted is from the last 4 years. So yea. WW is still being treated poorly and still portrayed as a weaklink.

    It wouldn't have made WW84 perform better if it was $30 + 6.99. Because WW84 had terrible word of mouth on top of mostly mixed reviews from critics. BW was the whole opposite.

  2. #4262
    Astonishing Member WonderLight789's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psy-lock View Post
    Are we seriously comparing the quality of the movies by strength feats? Captain Marvel was a bland movie, starring a bland character. And after all the hype the most memorable thing she did in Endgame is get a new haircut

    Haven't seen Black Widow yet, but the fact that she only got a movie after she died says a lot about how much Marvel "values" her. And the writing for her wasn't great in the other movies either, especially the Whedon ones.

    For all its flaws, I'd take WW1984 over these two any day.
    No. I am comparing the will between companies to actually portray a female as a powerhouse. CM was made into a big one. DCEU WW is a massive weaklink without gear. Even Spiderman almost got the same level of power in terms of physical stats feats. People can tr to find excuses all they want. Marvel was the first to introduce a big female powerhouse with CM on the silver screen. WW came nowhere close to that. Marvel was the first to have a female lead comic moviue grossing over a billion. The so callerd most important female hero came nowhere close to that. in just one movie and a half. CM already has a bigger presence in her universe than DCEU WW has in hers. Facts only.

  3. #4263
    Extraordinary Member Primal Slayer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mystical41 View Post
    We are in the same place. All the evidence that Rightoya posted is from the last 4 years. So yea. WW is still being treated poorly and still portrayed as a weaklink.

    It wouldn't have made WW84 perform better if it was $30 + 6.99. Because WW84 had terrible word of mouth on top of mostly mixed reviews from critics. BW was the whole opposite.
    You said we are in the same place in the world COVID wise as we were during the release of WW84. That is simply false.

  4. #4264
    Ultimate Member Gaius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mystical41 View Post
    BW was released on streaming too and the pandemic ids still going strong. Plus WW was still weak in WW 2017 and other DCEU movies. For example her best strength feat is lifting a 30 tons tank. She got 2 shotted by superman in jl. And did nothing to doomsday outside the sword. CM is far better portrayed in terms of power. WW is just a super human xena in the DCEU.
    Yeah, it’s almost like there may have been a development unrelated to either WW, Captain Marvel, or Black Widow or their respective “feats” in between December and July that would encourage audiences to go to theaters again.

  5. #4265
    Astonishing Member WonderLight789's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primal Slayer View Post
    You said we are in the same place in the world COVID wise as we were during the release of WW84. That is simply false.
    Oh. So you won't try to denby that WW is still portrayed as weaklink currently? Intersting.


    As for covid. The virus is still affecting the planet and cinemas big time. Maybe not as hard as 2020. But still pretty hard. WW84 wouln't have faced much better now. Because the movie had very bad word of mouth. It had no chance. A very poorly executed film. And yet again a very weak WW with weak action scenes on top of messy plot holes and inconsistencies. So it had nothing to help the film have legs.

  6. #4266
    Fishy Member I'm a Fish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mystical41 View Post
    Pandemic is still going strong. And it would have ever been a hit with the poor word of mouth that it got. It was bad reviews from cvritics plus bad word of mouth. In China it barely did 23M. When 75% of the theaters capacity was working there at the time.

    JL and BvS were flops. Being a flop does not mean bad treatment. Portraying WW as fodder to the high tiers is bad treatment. And that is what happened in JL. And in bvs she did nothing to doomsday without her gear. Didn't even take one direct attack in her body without gear. A glorified super human and nothing more. While CM was a big powerhouse in her movie and endgame. Marvel has proven they are willing to put their money where their mouth is and portray a woman as a big powerhouse. Wonder Fodder wishes she had that treatment nowadays. Look at her performances in different comics and movies. That says it all.


    Nice try. Many other users comment frequently about WW being portrayed as weak nowadays.
    First off, Black Widow has not been released in China yet. So you cannot make an accurate comparison of the data when only WW84 was released in China. That's bad math.

    Second, China also has a notorious piracy problem (so does America TBH). Streaming movies make it very easy to pirate them, that is why WB release's their movies globally a week before they release it in America, because HBO Max is only available in America and it was an attempted to curb some of the money loss due to piracy.

    Black widow is also being effected by piracy , that was why the move had a 69% box office drop it's second week.

    Which is coincidently very similar to WW84 second week drop off of 67%.

    Not to mention, it's cheaper to see Black Widow in theaters since it's an extra $30 to purchase it on Disney +. While WW84 was free to many depending on their service provider, or came at no extra charge to those with HBO Max and was the most watched movie Christmas day.

    And became the most streamed movie in 2020 in one week (from December 21-27). There was a reason the movie was approved for a sequel only 2 days after its debut.

    The truth is, it is unfair to judge the success of both movies or any movie released during the pandemic because of piracy and in the case of WW84 especially, no vaccines being available to the public. Also, Black Widow is not released in China, so I don't know how you can make a comparisons when both movies where released under widely different circumstances.
    Last edited by I'm a Fish; 07-31-2021 at 12:04 PM.
    ~I just keep swimming through these threads~

  7. #4267
    Extraordinary Member Primal Slayer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mystical41 View Post
    No. I am comparing the will between companies to actually portray a female as a powerhouse. CM was made into a big one. DCEU WW is a massive weaklink without gear. Even Spiderman almost got the same level of power in terms of physical stats feats. People can tr to find excuses all they want. Marvel was the first to introduce a big female powerhouse with CM on the silver screen. WW came nowhere close to that. Marvel was the first to have a female lead comic moviue grossing over a billion. The so callerd most important female hero came nowhere close to that. in just one movie and a half. CM already has a bigger presence in her universe than DCEU WW has in hers. Facts only.
    Again, to compare WWs box office to Captain Marvel....you are comparing apples to oranges almost. Captain Marvel is part of a greater universe that was built upon, where every movie is one big TBC, has immense good will with the audience. WW had none of that. She had to fight against bad word of mouth from a half-assed universe. She still managed to make more than Man of Steel, Suicide Squad, Shazam, basically BvS, so that is still a major win.

    And if we are talking about reviews...Wonder Woman has a 93% RT average. Captain Marvel is at 73%.

    Quote Originally Posted by mystical41 View Post
    Oh. So you won't try to denby that WW is still portrayed as weaklink currently? Intersting.


    As for covid. The virus is still affecting the planet and cinemas big time. Maybe not as hard as 2020. But still pretty hard. WW84 wouln't have faced much better now. Because the movie had very bad word of mouth. It had no chance. A very poorly executed film. And yet again a very weak WW with weak action scenes on top of messy plot holes and inconsistencies. So it had nothing to help the film have legs.
    We've gone round and round with this rodeo from her live action to he Justice Society. If I want to comment on her strength, I'll do so in the power complaints.

  8. #4268
    Leftbrownie Alpha's Avatar
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    Black Widow is also being trashed (I actually quite liked the movie)

  9. #4269
    Astonishing Member WonderLight789's Avatar
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    The pandemic now is still hitting hard. BW has done better because even though things may be in a better place regarding covid(but not by much). TYhe movie also has what WW84 duid not. Good word of mouth thsanks to a more consistent plot and better action scenes. WW84 had nothing. Messy plot and weak action. No entertaining value whatsoever.

    BW and CM have better action moments than WW. That is a factor too since people expect a certain level of entertaiment from these types of movies. CM is a real powerhouse. DCEU WW is a character that even MCU Spiderman can cx¡ompete with in terms of physical feats. While having better action sequences in his movies too. You like WW being a weaklink? Finre. I don't. And i won't make the excuse that oh story is more important. Because both things are equally important. And WW has been far from creating any groundbreaking stories in these past years anyway. A solid debut origin film can not create miracles. When you are in a company that does everything in their power to portay an amazon Goddess as a pathetic weaklink that any heavy hitter can overpower.

  10. #4270
    Astonishing Member WonderLight789's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primal Slayer View Post
    Again, to compare WWs box office to Captain Marvel....you are comparing apples to oranges almost. Captain Marvel is part of a greater universe that was built upon, where every movie is one big TBC, has immense good will with the audience. WW had none of that. She had to fight against bad word of mouth from a half-assed universe. She still managed to make more than Man of Steel, Suicide Squad, Shazam, basically BvS, so that is still a major win.

    And if we are talking about reviews...Wonder Woman has a 93% RT average. Captain Marvel is at 73%.



    We've gone round and round with this rodeo from her live action to he Justice Society. If I want to comment on her strength, I'll do so in the power complaints.
    AQ far outgrossed WW. And he was portrayed as a more serious heavy hitter than WW. DCEU AQ is more durable and far stronger than DCEU WW based on quantifiable feats. No need to say more. WW is weak because her company wants her that way.

  11. #4271
    Extraordinary Member Primal Slayer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mystical41 View Post
    AQ far outgrossed WW. And he was portrayed as a more serious heavy hitter than WW. DCEU AQ is more durable and far stronger than DCEU WW based on quantifiable feats. No need to say more. WW is weak because her company wants her that way.
    So you agree that WW was better than CM and seen as the superior film? Great.

  12. #4272
    Astonishing Member WonderLight789's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by I'm a Fish View Post
    First off, Black Widow has not been released in China yet. So you cannot make an accurate comparison of the data when only WW84 was released in China. That's bad math.

    Second, China also has a notorious piracy problem. Streaming movies make it very easy to pirate them, that is why WB release's their movies globally a week before they release it in America, because HBO Max is only available in America and it was an attempted to curb some of the money loss due to piracy.

    Black widow is also being effected by piracy , that was why the move had a 69% box office drop it's second week.

    Which is coincidently very similar to WW84 box office drop of 67%.

    Not to mention, it's cheaper to see Black Widow in theaters since it's an extra $30 to purchase it on Disney +. While WW84 was free to many depending on their service provider, or came at no extra charge to those with HBO Max and was the most watched movie Christmas day.

    The truth is, it is unfair to judge the success of both movies or any movie released during the pandemic because of piracy and in the case of WW84 especially, no vaccines being available to the public. Also, Black Widow is not released in China, so I don't know how you can make a comparisons when both movies where released under widely different circumstances.
    Not very different circumstances. A lot of cinemas worldwide are still closed. BW did in the same time frame far better than WW84. There is no way to deny it. And of course she will stomp WW84 in China. It is not difficult to do better than 23M. LOL that was a big embarrassment. Even super controversial Mulan did better. DCEU WW has nothing going for her. She got lucky in her debut film and nothing after that. She is super weak. Boring. Barely any development as a character after 4 movies. Still crying over a man 100 years later. Giving up popwers just for the same guy she met for a brief moment. Willing to steal another man's body to stay with her dead lover. A canon fodder that sm puts in her place in 2 hits. A boring mness whicch is why she has been flopping outside of her lucky shot in 2017. And rigthfuly so. A character like her deserves far better than the treatment she got. So if they will continue that path. I hope she keeps flopping.

  13. #4273
    Astonishing Member WonderLight789's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primal Slayer View Post
    So you agree that WW was better than CM and seen as the superior film? Great.
    And you agree that WW is weak and most characters with super human stats have greater power than her? Great.

  14. #4274
    Astonishing Member WonderLight789's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius View Post
    Well, in fairness. given how long animation can take I imagine those shows were already in production when Didio was still around (and I'm not sure how much control he or DC higher ups have on greenlighting entire shows) so I'm not sure how much that's indicative of the current management in the comics department

    But yeah, complete nonsense those two get their latest millionth shows announced on the same day and the closest thing WW got that day was NRS and Taylor's Wonder Simp in Injustice while also coming out in her anniversary month.
    In fairness, it is amsazing all the effort people make to come up with excuses for WB and DC and they way they treat the WW lore. It has been more than 60 years. And we are still here looking at excuses to why they may not be treating WW as bad as we think they are. What an effort guys.

  15. #4275
    Extraordinary Member Primal Slayer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mystical41 View Post
    And you agree that WW is weak and most characters with super human stats have greater power than her? Great.
    You're weak and my weak are two different weaks. But 93% vs 73% in reviews are different

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