Wonder Woman Controversial Opinions Part 2

[Perseus]

Golden age antics and stories should mostly be left there. I don't mind taking rouges or some elements from that era and revamping them to fit a more modern style of storytelling. But there is a reason comics evolve and change.

[Alpha]

Golden age antics and stories should mostly be left there. I don't mind taking rouges or some elements from that era and revamping them to fit a more modern style of storytelling. But there is a reason comics evolve and change.

By Golden Age I'm gonna assume that you mean the Marston-Hummel Era. Of course it's a comic from the 40s so the writing style was very stiff, and the bondage obviously shouldn't come back, but I would go as far as saying that Diana was more interesting in that era than in most stories since. This was when the Wonderverse was as large as the entire Marvel Cinematic Universe, and yet the heart of the stories was just 2 powerful themes:
1 What does it mean to use power with virtue.
2 And why believing in something makes it be true

Everything in those stories was filtered through these two themes, and yet we had the most diverse and expansive lore in any comic at the time. There were all these different planets and civilizations with their own ideologies. There was an astral dimension that Diana could visit where the power of thought and emotion was even more pronounced, and where she would find certain villains. There was a microscopic kingdom lead by a queen with an army of automatons that was trying to conquer the much larger regular world.

And most of all, Diana was actually making some changes to society, by changing lives on person at a time, and the Holliday Girls were the prime example of this happening. These women were learning the ideology of the Amazons, not just in combat, but in science and spirituality, and they were on the path towards creating a small utopia within a college campus.

These are all the things missing in the modern stories of Wonder Woman. The massive unique lore on earth and in space, and the powerful ways Diana is changing the world. Of course I don't want them to write the action or the romance like they did in the 40s, but we have to recognize the power of these ideas and how essential they are.

[Agent Z]

By Golden Age I'm gonna assume that you mean the Marston-Hummel Era. Of course it's a comic from the 40s so the writing style was very stiff, and the bondage obviously shouldn't come back, but I would go as far as saying that Diana was more interesting in that era than in most stories since. This was when the Wonderverse was as large as the entire Marvel Cinematic Universe, and yet the heart of the stories was just 2 powerful themes:
1 What does it mean to use power with virtue.
2 And why believing in something makes it be true

The first one is still used in modern Wonder Woman stories (hell, just about every superhero story touched on it.)

I don't think the second one ever existed in Wonder Woman stories. At least, not to a particularly important extent.

Everything in those stories was filtered through these two themes, and yet we had the most diverse and expansive lore in any comic at the time. There were all these different planets and civilizations with their own ideologies. There was an astral dimension that Diana could visit where the power of thought and emotion was even more pronounced, and where she would find certain villains. There was a microscopic kingdom lead by a queen with an army of automatons that was trying to conquer the much larger regular world.

And most of all, Diana was actually making some changes to society, by changing lives on person at a time, and the Holliday Girls were the prime example of this happening. These women were learning the ideology of the Amazons, not just in combat, but in science and spirituality, and they were on the path towards creating a small utopia within a college campus.

These are all the things missing in the modern stories of Wonder Woman. The massive unique lore on earth and in space, and the powerful ways Diana is changing the world. Of course I don't want them to write the action or the romance like they did in the 40s, but we have to recognize the power of these ideas and how essential they are.

I prefer quality over quantity.

[Alpha]

If you can't appreciate these ideas and see how they could be reworked into fantastic modern stories, that's your loss

[Agent Z]

I appreciate some of them. A few were good for their time but a lot of the others either weren't that great to begin with or have aged pretty poorly.

[Stanlos]

sometimes I think Steve Trevor should be Susan Trevor and then sometimes I don't

I am partial to Sascha Trevor or Stacia Trevor

[marhawkman]

Diane's connection to the Amazons was more than enough reason for Steve to remain prominent post crisis, but writers obviously didn't see him as anything other than a love interest who'd lost that role. Which I'd chalk up to narrow-mindedness and soft sexism.

one description of it I remember reading years ago likened it to the inverse of the "Bat-god" problem. Diana's so super having a non-super sidekick needs clever writing.... or he gets pigeonholed as a love interest or Alfred/Lois Lane-like character. Which sort of works, but is a bit lame since Alfred is... well... a butler, and Lois a reporter, but Steve is a military pilot. that sort of role makes less sense for him.

[PopQuezy]

one description of it I remember reading years ago likened it to the inverse of the "Bat-god" problem. Diana's so super having a non-super sidekick needs clever writing.... or he gets pigeonholed as a love interest or Alfred/Lois Lane-like character. Which sort of works, but is a bit lame since Alfred is... well... a butler, and Lois a reporter, but Steve is a military pilot. that sort of role makes less sense for him.

You could just give Steve his own rogues. Circe, Cheetah, Dr. Psycho are great for Diana. The Mask, Cadulo, and someone low tier like Angle Man are great for Trevor. Rucka did something along those lines with Colonel Poison and Team Poison.

[phonogram12]

sometimes I think Steve Trevor should be Susan Trevor and then sometimes I don't

I would've preferred this than how they aged him up post-Crisis. Although I would've changed their name to Stephanie.

If you can't appreciate these ideas and see how they could be reworked into fantastic modern stories, that's your loss

I concur.

[Alpha]

You could just give Steve his own rogues. Circe, Cheetah, Dr. Psycho are great for Diana. The Mask, Cadulo, and someone low tier like Angle Man are great for Trevor. Rucka did something along those lines with Colonel Poison and Team Poison.

The less we say about that version of Poison the better.

In regards to Steve having his own adventures, I still don't see what would be so interesting. Steve doesn't really have a distinct personality (which is true of many of Diana's supporting characters over the years). Why spend page space on things the real Etta Candy could be doing?

Isn't he in the Checkmate comic? What has he been like on that team?

[phonogram12]

In regards to Steve having his own adventures, I still don't see what would be so interesting. Steve doesn't really have a distinct personality (which is true of many of Diana's supporting characters over the years). Why spend page space on things the real Etta Candy could be doing?

IDK, I think it would be a nice place where he could be developed more. Maybe as a backup story?

Isn't he in the Checkmate comic? What has he been like on that team?

Very Bendis-y. That said, I like Bendis. Your mileage may very.

[PopQuezy]

The less we say about that version of Poison the better.

In regards to Steve having his own adventures, I still don't see what would be so interesting. Steve doesn't really have a distinct personality (which is true of many of Diana's supporting characters over the years). Why spend page space on things the real Etta Candy could be doing?

Isn't he in the Checkmate comic? What has he been like on that team?

Personality is built through seeing people in a variety of situations. Having his own rogues and going on adventures with Diana - not separate adventures. Although he can do that, too - would allow us to see him in a variety of situations.

We know Steve has a sister and a niece and/or nephew - we see this in his one shot in Justice League vs. Suicide Squad. Allowing us to see him in some panels with them could be beneficial for a personality.

More scenes with Steve/Etta could be beneficial for a personality. It also could allow us to see his and Etta's perspective on the world in a way we may not when they share scenes with Diana.

What is Steve's relationship with Artemis/Yara/Nubia/Circe/Maxwell Lord, etc?

For Steve to have a personality, he actually does need some investment. It does seem like Cloonrad are interested in giving him investment since they are obviously building up to Steve/Diana's first meeting now that she's back from the dead.

[Alpha]

Developing a personality isn't the same thing as giving him one. I can't understand the notion that we oughta invest even more time into a character that hasn't had a personality despite being around for 80 years, specially when there are so many better characters in the wonderverse that are being badly served (or not used at all).

I think one of the biggest problems with the Wonderverse is that most of the supporting characters are only defined by being good or bad, confident or insecure, loving or closed off. Steve is one of the prime examples of this. He never had his own distinct way of looking at the world, his own interesting drive to act, his own distinct way of speaking. There are so many better love interests or allies Diana could have.

[Gaius]

Golden age antics and stories should mostly be left there. I don't mind taking rouges or some elements from that era and revamping them to fit a more modern style of storytelling. But there is a reason comics evolve and change.

Building off this but LoWW Etta Candy is the only time a Golden Age variant of that character has been interesting.

[Alpha]

Building off this but LoWW Etta Candy is the only time a Golden Age variant of that character has been interesting.

You don't think a hedonist, self affirming chaotic adventurer who looks at the world as an absurd place she has to give a good spanking to is interesting?

If you need some entertainment I would recommend you check out the NPR concert by Lizzo. You don't even need to watch it, just listen. What she says in between songs is hilarious, and everything a live action Etta Candy should be.

Check this out between 9:20 and 11:10