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  1. #916
    Mighty Member KangMiRae's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tzigone View Post
    And I'm not into the mythology heavy allies and villains, either.
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  2. #917
    Mighty Member Uncanny Mutie's Avatar
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    G. Willow Wilson GETS Diana, but her run was still boring and forgettable.

    Xermanico is WAY underrated and is one of the BEST Wonder Woman artists I have EVER seen, but his art has been let down by the boring, forgettable stories that he had to draw.

  3. #918
    Mighty Member Uncanny Mutie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mathew101281 View Post
    2. Giganta should have actual mythological giant in her bloodline.
    Nah, I'll pass on that. Wonder Woman already has WAY too many Mythology heavy villains and supporting characters running around these days. What I want is for her to mix it up some, and go back to fighting more NON-Mythological adversaries.

    I get that Greek Mythology is a large part of who she is as a character, but it's gotten to the point where Mythology inspired characters are all she deals with nowadays, at least in her own book. She almost doesn't even feel like a SUPERHERO anymore, unless you catch her in a team book or event, like a Justice League story with Supes, Batman, Flash, and other A-listers.

    Even in Justice League Dark, the Greek Mythology stuff gets played up too much, because they know it's the only thing that ties her to magic and even gives her an INKLING of an excuse to be featured in the book, aside from, "Well, we need an A-list character to make the book sell."

  4. #919
    The Comixeur Mel Dyer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uncanny Mutie View Post
    Nah, I'll pass on that. Wonder Woman already has WAY too many Mythology heavy villains and supporting characters running around these days. What I want is for her to mix it up some, and go back to fighting more NON-Mythological adversaries.

    I get that Greek Mythology is a large part of who she is as a character, but it's gotten to the point where Mythology inspired characters are all she deals with nowadays, at least in her own book. She almost doesn't even feel like a SUPERHERO anymore, unless you catch her in a team book or event, like a Justice League story with Supes, Batman, Flash, and other A-listers.

    Even in Justice League Dark, the Greek Mythology stuff gets played up too much, because they know it's the only thing that ties her to magic and even gives her an INKLING of an excuse to be featured in the book, aside from, "Well, we need an A-list character to make the book sell."
    I think WW can battle godlike characters, without the characters being literal gods; in that much, we agree. Further, I'd like to see more of these types - Atomia, Clea, Adjudicator - than the toga/pteryges wearing set.

    The WW comic has its own Galactus, Doctor Doom and Luthor clones. She can afford to send a few togas on extended vacation.

    And Doctor Poison should be portrayed, as Greg gave her to us...Poison Alpha, the WW comics answer to Deathstroke.
    Last edited by Mel Dyer; 09-05-2019 at 02:13 PM.
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  5. #920
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mel Dyer View Post
    I think WW can battle godlike characters, without the characters being literal gods; in that much, we agree. Further, I'd like to see more of these types - Atomia, Clea, Adjudicator - than the toga/pteryges wearing set.

    The WW comic has its own Galactus, Doctor Doom and Luthor clones. She can afford to send a few togas on extended vacation.

    And Poison should be portrayed, as Greg gave her to us...the WE comics answer to Deathstroke.
    Being written as clones of more popular and better villains is not going to help them;. If anything, it will just make them seem even more inferior. If people want to read about Galactus, Doom, Luthor and Deathstroke, they'll read about those characters in the books they appear in, not look to WW for cheap knockoffs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Uncanny Mutie View Post
    Nah, I'll pass on that. Wonder Woman already has WAY too many Mythology heavy villains and supporting characters running around these days. What I want is for her to mix it up some, and go back to fighting more NON-Mythological adversaries.

    I get that Greek Mythology is a large part of who she is as a character, but it's gotten to the point where Mythology inspired characters are all she deals with nowadays, at least in her own book. She almost doesn't even feel like a SUPERHERO anymore, unless you catch her in a team book or event, like a Justice League story with Supes, Batman, Flash, and other A-listers.
    I don't get this logic. Why does having Diana deal with a specialized rogues gallery make her less of a superhero;. No one says this about Thor and his use of Norse myth so why does a focus on Greek myth make Diana less of a superhero?

    Quote Originally Posted by Uncanny Mutie View Post
    Even in Justice League Dark, the Greek Mythology stuff gets played up too much, because they know it's the only thing that ties her to magic and even gives her an INKLING of an excuse to be featured in the book, aside from, "Well, we need an A-list character to make the book sell."
    She's got more reason to be involved in this book than Batman, a guy who half the time is written as not even believing in magic.

    If anything, it's strange that it took this long for her to be placed on a magic based team.
    Last edited by Agent Z; 09-05-2019 at 02:18 PM.

  6. #921
    Mighty Member Tzigone's Avatar
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    I don't get this logic. Why does having Diana deal with a specialized rogues gallery make her less of a superhero;. No one says this about Thor and his use of Norse myth so why does a focus on Greek myth make Diana less of a superhero?
    I don't read Thor, either.

    For me, it's not just the villains aspect - it's everything being tied up mythology. Not just enemies, but allies. Her supporting cast not having enough regular people, etc. And all the gods' personal conflict. I'm not into the politics of fictional societies - something that comes up with Aquaman frequenhtly (and repetitively - how many times can he lose the throne?), and used to in old Inhumans stories I read. I like the lead characters there, but the stories themselves are not to my taste. And the Greek pantheon is often treated similarly. But yes, even as villains, that's the sort I'd only want occasionally. It's not necessarily the villains being specialized - it's that I'm not interested in that flavor of specialization. And also that those sorts of stories tend to take Diana away, remove her from, the ordinary world more often than other types might, and the "ordinary" world is the setting I prefer.
    Last edited by Tzigone; 09-05-2019 at 03:09 PM.

  7. #922
    Mighty Member KangMiRae's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    I don't get this logic. Why does having Diana deal with a specialized rogues gallery make her less of a superhero;. No one says this about Thor and his use of Norse myth so why does a focus on Greek myth make Diana less of a superhero?
    That's why I don't read Thor nor like any of the Asgardian stuff.

    I stick with Wonder Woman despite doing almost the same thing because:

    a). I like her character

    b). She's a member in other team books typically, like Justice League

    c). I just naturally find Diana more interesting than Thor

    Also, I don't think she's any less of a hero. As a matter of fact, I think it really falls on my indifference towards Greek mythology in general.
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  8. #923
    Extraordinary Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
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    With Diana new with the fact we have Banas they should play a bit with the Egyptian myths. Also one of Diana’s entries was a Valkyrie

  9. #924
    Extraordinary Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    I don't get this logic. Why does having Diana deal with a specialized rogues gallery make her less of a superhero;. No one says this about Thor and his use of Norse myth so why does a focus on Greek myth make Diana less of a superhero?
    Diana isn't Thor, and even Thor fights the likes of characters that cannot be found in Norse myth like the Wrecking Crew, Ego the Living Planet and Marvel exclusive Norse characters like the Enchantress, the Executioner and the Destroyer. Also the WW fans who want to see her have more variety in her threats and stories aren't necessarily thinking of Thor either way, he isn't a concern.

    Mixing myth with her DC-exclusive antagonists can be a good idea, like the Rebirth origin of Dr. Cyber. Hypothetically tying in Giganta to a myth based source is also sound, but it shouldn't be a prerequisite for her villains. Nobody wants the myth stuff to go away, just not be over used. She has a variety of locations and antagonists in her history that could be used once and a while for variety.


    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    She's got more reason to be involved in this book than Batman, a guy who half the time is written as not even believing in magic.

    If anything, it's strange that it took this long for her to be placed on a magic based team.
    Frankly, while she fits in better than Batman, neither one of them really need to be on that team. Does Batman even appear in that title?
    Diana isn't really an overly magical character. Outside of having a villainous spellcaster like Circe, magic doesn't play a huge role in her mythos. The Amazons get benefits from the Gods but are not magical themselves. Maybe it's just me, but I tend to think of sword-and-sandal characters in a myth based setting like Diana as being distinct from magical users like Zatanna or Constantine even if there is some small overlap.

  10. #925
    Mighty Member Uncanny Mutie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    Diana isn't Thor, and even Thor fights the likes of characters that cannot be found in Norse myth like the Wrecking Crew, Ego the Living Planet and Marvel exclusive Norse characters like the Enchantress, the Executioner and the Destroyer. Also the WW fans who want to see her have more variety in her threats and stories aren't necessarily thinking of Thor either way, he isn't a concern.

    Mixing myth with her DC-exclusive antagonists can be a good idea, like the Rebirth origin of Dr. Cyber. Hypothetically tying in Giganta to a myth based source is also sound, but it shouldn't be a prerequisite for her villains. Nobody wants the myth stuff to go away, just not be over used. She has a variety of locations and antagonists in her history that could be used once and a while for variety.




    Frankly, while she fits in better than Batman, neither one of them really need to be on that team. Does Batman even appear in that title?
    Diana isn't really an overly magical character. Outside of having a villainous spellcaster like Circe, magic doesn't play a huge role in her mythos. The Amazons get benefits from the Gods but are not magical themselves. Maybe it's just me, but I tend to think of sword-and-sandal characters in a myth based setting like Diana as being distinct from magical users like Zatanna or Constantine even if there is some small overlap.
    YES!!! Thank you for saving me a long, drawn out response of a post!!! Haha

  11. #926
    Extraordinary Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
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    I often wonder what if some of the Amazons did learn magic? To help with Circe? When they locked her away? This shouldn't be a common skill. Rather for selected few. Maybe a 100

  12. #927
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    Frankly, while she fits in better than Batman, neither one of them really need to be on that team. Does Batman even appear in that title?
    Diana isn't really an overly magical character. Outside of having a villainous spellcaster like Circe, magic doesn't play a huge role in her mythos. The Amazons get benefits from the Gods but are not magical themselves. Maybe it's just me, but I tend to think of sword-and-sandal characters in a myth based setting like Diana as being distinct from magical users like Zatanna or Constantine even if there is some small overlap.
    The Amazons are immortals created by the gods from the souls of murdered women. A number of them have been sorceresses over the years like Magala. Diana herself was previously a clay statue brought to life by gods before being made a demigod. Her three most well known enemies (Ares, Cheetah and Circe) are also mystical beings. The overlap is a lot bigger than your saying.

    Batman was featured in the first issue of the series (the one written during the New 52). He was also used in the animated movie.

  13. #928
    Extraordinary Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    The Amazons are immortals created by the gods from the souls of murdered women. A number of them have been sorceresses over the years like Magala. Diana herself was previously a clay statue brought to life by gods before being made a demigod. Her three most well known enemies (Ares, Cheetah and Circe) are also mystical beings. The overlap is a lot bigger than your saying.

    Batman was featured in the first issue of the series (the one written during the New 52). He was also used in the animated movie.
    The reincarnation angle is only present in one version. Diana's origin is more consistently mystical before we bring Zeus into the picture, but beyond that she's not known for doing magical things herself. She has some magical tools, but she and her people are also known for having sci-fi tech like the Plane and the Purple Ray.

    Magala is a very minor character in the grand scheme of things and isn't even canon anymore. What other prominent sorceresses are there? The Amazons otherwise are known for relying on boons from the Gods, using Bronze age tech or advanced sci-fi tech, and spellcasting really isn't as consistently visible as any of that.
    Ares is a God, which I find distinctive from being a mystical character, but that's just me. Cheetah does fit it in somewhat with Circe though.

    My mistake, I thought we were only discussing the Rebirth one. But just because some of us don't think WW really needs to be in the title means we think Batman does. I don't think either of them needs to be there, though she is the more preferable and fitting of the two.

  14. #929
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    The reincarnation angle is only present in one version. Diana's origin is more consistently mystical before we bring Zeus into the picture, but beyond that she's not known for doing magical things herself. She has some magical tools, but she and her people are also known for having sci-fi tech like the Plane and the Purple Ray.

    Magala is a very minor character in the grand scheme of things and isn't even canon anymore. What other prominent sorceresses are there? The Amazons otherwise are known for relying on boons from the Gods, using Bronze age tech or advanced sci-fi tech, and spellcasting really isn't as consistently visible as any of that.
    Ares is a God, which I find distinctive from being a mystical character, but that's just me. Cheetah does fit it in somewhat with Circe though.

    My mistake, I thought we were only discussing the Rebirth one. But just because some of us don't think WW really needs to be in the title means we think Batman does. I don't think either of them needs to be there, though she is the more preferable and fitting of the two.
    I think the Amazons are a lot more known receiving boons from the gods than sci fi tech these days. And the former is more in the realm of magic and mysticism.

    To be clear, I don't think Diana needs to be in JLD. I'm just surprised it took so long for her to be featured in such a team.

  15. #930
    Extraordinary Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    I think the Amazons are a lot more known receiving boons from the gods than sci fi tech these days. And the former is more in the realm of magic and mysticism.

    To be clear, I don't think Diana needs to be in JLD. I'm just surprised it took so long for her to be featured in such a team.
    And it's a shame that they've gotten nerfed in that regard while the rest of the DCU hasn't, though thankfully Orlando seems to like the sci-fi stuff so hopefully he will make use of it. Their relationship with the Gods should never go away of course, but that's still not something innately mystical about the Amazons. I think both the Gods and sci-fi stuff should go hand in hand to have a fully formed WW mythos instead of this half-formed stuff we've been getting.

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