Was the controversy with Akira Yoshida the cause of Betsy Braddock’s reversion?

[Wolverine12]

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I mean yeah it's not hard to distinguish a thong 1piece bathing suit but they are facing different ways. So

That's not what I meant, earlier in the thread Tazirai mentioned that they were part of a round table type discussion about comics with Claremont and some other comic book people. I'd just like to see the whole discussion if it is available, I bet it's pretty neat.

[Selene]

That's not what I meant, earlier in the thread Tazirai mentioned that they were part of a round table type discussion about comics with Claremont and some other comic book people. I'd just like to see the whole discussion if it is available, I bet it's pretty neat.

Tazirai will say whatever suits his agenda in every post he makes.If the Lady Mandarin story came about only because Claremont's book was chosen as the Mandarin chapter for the Acts of Vengeance,who forced Claremont and Lee to involve Psylocke in it?It was clear before and after she crossed the Siege Perilous that her transformation,however radical,was meant to give her her innermost desire.It was character development,and the other reason it stuck was because it became extremely popular with the fans.

[Mia]

We know that writters attempt this before and it seems that the marvel offices has always denied. I personality don’t think that the body swap was a racist plot per say, but yes some writters do a terrible job in her characterization, portraying Psylocke as a cheap trope. So in this days of so much enlightening on social/ racial topics, and both Marvel and Disney embracing diversity as a core value, the most correct thing to the x-editor in chief, who has been in the center of a polemic regarding cultural appropriation, would be to end the psylocke controversy.

How was she a cheap trope? Would you have preferred her to have gone to Harvard on a scholarship. Good at Math and worked in finance while gigging as a concert pianist on the side? Until her rich parents in Hong Kong gave her allowance?

Tazirai will say whatever suits his agenda in every post he makes.If the Lady Mandarin story came about only because Claremont's book was chosen as the Mandarin chapter for the Acts of Vengeance,who forced Claremont and Lee to involve Psylocke in it?It was clear before and after she crossed the Siege Perilous that her transformation,however radical,was meant to give her her innermost desire.It was character development,and the other reason it stuck was because it became extremely popular with the fans.

Agreed. If it was just a matter of cosmetic changes then I wouldn't care for the swap back. But the body swap was a ground breaking change for her not only physically but psychologically/spiritually as well. To watch her go through it was lesson in resilience and very inspirational.

[Tazirai]

Do you have a video of the round table discussion you hosted/participated in? I'd very much like to see that.

No, just pictures.

You can see them on Curious World Photography My page. I haven't posted them yet Just publish my first "Psylocke" (PsiWoman) comic on Metrobay, been tied up.

https://www.facebook.com/curiosityneverends/



Buzz Aw, Trevor Von Eden, and Chris Visions. There we go.

[Tazirai]

Tazirai will say whatever suits his agenda in every post he makes.If the Lady Mandarin story came about only because Claremont's book was chosen as the Mandarin chapter for the Acts of Vengeance,who forced Claremont and Lee to involve Psylocke in it?It was clear before and after she crossed the Siege Perilous that her transformation,however radical,was meant to give her her innermost desire.It was character development,and the other reason it stuck was because it became extremely popular with the fans.

Tazirai will say it with Proof of what tazirai said. I get it Selene. You like her one way, other people another.
BUT one thing I do not do is make **** up.

When I say I spoke to Claremont I did. Because we are in the same Closed X-men group, I even posted about it in the Psylocke thread.

When I say I spoke to Cullen Bunn about Psylocke and her changes and it got turned into News Articles, that's because it did.
Literally if you Google "Tazirai Cullen Bunn", guess what happens?

Tazirai Cullen Bunn

When I say I was part of a panel that spoke about Representation, that's because I was. I took the pictures. Now I wish I would have videotaped it.


You want me to post the email from Trevor von Eden? I can.

So please don't speak trash on me. I don't need that in my life, is that okay with you?

My Agenda is like everyone else's. Who exists on Earth that doesn't have an agenda?

[Selene]

Taz,I should have chosen better wording in my post,but you stated that she was only recrafted into an Asian ninja at the whim of Jim Lee and that she lost her cultural identity in the process,neither of which is true.There is nothing wrong about revelling in her going back to her roots,but why the need to denigrate her post-1989 development in such a way?

[Triniking1234]

Question: When did Psylocke learn that Magneto survived her assassination attempt? It was kind of a big character arc for her, so I'm curious if there was a story payoff.

You should've asked this in the real Betsy Braddock thread.

Psylocke and Magneto haven't crossed paths since she "killed" him.

[Novaya Havoc]

Tazirai will say whatever suits his agenda in every post he makes.If the Lady Mandarin story came about only because Claremont's book was chosen as the Mandarin chapter for the Acts of Vengeance,who forced Claremont and Lee to involve Psylocke in it?It was clear before and after she crossed the Siege Perilous that her transformation,however radical,was meant to give her her innermost desire.It was character development,and the other reason it stuck was because it became extremely popular with the fans.

Exactly. This was set up in that Annual issue where she husked her weakness away and was a femme-bot. She was juiced up with combat skills (see: Kitty Pryde, this isn't new) and the whole "psychic blade" business.

Claremont may SAY he planned to revert her body back but even if so she would have kept that powerset because, duh, he needed to set her apart from the other redundant telepaths of the X-Men Gold/Blue and Excalibur eras (Jean Grey, Prof. X, Phoenix).

[TimberWolf]

Will Betsy also revert to the "prim and proper British Lady" personality now? I say that because her personality was completely changed along with her body. The most egregious of Marvel's handling of Psylocke involve changing her culture into that of a Japanese woman.

[Flameworthy]

Will Betsy also revert to the "prim and proper British Lady" personality now? I say that because her personality was completely changed along with her body. The most egregious of Marvel's handling of Psylocke involve changing her culture into that of a Japanese woman.

This is what always bothered me the most about the body swap. She never received any of Kwannon's memories only her fighting skills. Why all of sudden would she start appropriating Japanese culture and style when she had never show interest in that prior to the body swap?

[crimsontt]

How was she a cheap trope? Would you have preferred her to have gone to Harvard on a scholarship. Good at Math and worked in finance while gigging as a concert pianist on the side? Until her rich parents in Hong Kong gave her allowance?

.

Easy, I’m also an orphan of eurasian betsy...much cooler visiuals and interesting layer in her character


I’d rather have her portrayed as the british lady she has always been depicted before the body swap. The way remender, bunn and spurrier did. But others writters always went for the mindless hot asian chick, who did nothing rather than angry faces and was nothing but a subservient ninja pawn. Also everytime we had japanese deco, clothing backgrounds, typography around psylocke. It’s like she was the ultimate representation of japan in x-men without even being japanese.... that’s the controversy I’d pass...she could be living in a asian body... but not the poster girl for oriental culture...

Once again it’s more a consequence of poor lazy writting than the body swap itself

[WhiteQueenEmmaFrost]

This is what always bothered me the most about the body swap. She never received any of Kwannon's memories only her fighting skills. Why all of sudden would she start appropriating Japanese culture and style when she had never show interest in that prior to the body swap?

There really wasn't much that was "appropriated" anyway...she'd sometimes dress and decorate her spaces in a Japanese sort of way...but even that I would put on the artist rather than the character. She didn't change how she spoke, acted, or behaved.

The "cultural appropriation" is such a BS argument because it focuses on things that are in essence some horrible stereotype that doesn't apply. It's like on House Hunters when they want to "feel like I'm in X country"...sorry to disappoint you, but modern people live in modern houses and globally people aren't that different.


I think this has more to do with Marvel changing how they center their stories. Something like this would've happened in a core book in the past, but this is something major happening in a limited series that is a tie-in to a Wolverine event. The New Mutants LS was actually pretty good, but didn't necessarily need an ongoing. I'd be fine if Marvel focused on these higher quality LS instead of a feeble poor written ongoing.

[Triniking1234]

Wolverine pulls off Japanese culture better than Betsy. Brother was practicing calligraphy to write love letters to his girl.

[WhiteQueenEmmaFrost]

Wolverine pulls off Japanese culture better than Betsy. Brother was practicing calligraphy to write love letters to his girl.

Logan had a legit reason, love. I have a bigger problem with Kitty trying to be a Ninja than Psylocke.

Let's be honest...comics are largely a horrible place filled with stereotypical elements and false depictions of other cultures written by white men who have never been outside the US and don't speak anything other than English. That said....Kabuki is a really good comic with an Asian female lead written by a white male.

[TheCape]

Wolverine pulls off Japanese culture better than Betsy. Brother was practicing calligraphy to write love letters to his girl.

True

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