Extermination #1 (spoilers/discussion thread)

[Triniking1234]

I got sidetracked. But yeah it was a good opening issue. Kinda reminded me of Days of Future Present. Having two Jeans and Rachel in the same book makes me feel like I'm being spoiled.

I saw someone saying that the time traveller should've been Hope Summers instead but this situation has the reader asking "what the hell is going on?" better.

[Digifiend]

Killing my favorite character was not cool.

Lol @ the fact that I think Angel only had one line in the entire issue. Poor Angel.

So, it seems that the O5 live in the school now.

That's probably a spoiler for Blue #36, which isn't out until next month.

How likely, do you folks think, the following ending for Extermination is ?

-----
Some X-character goes back in time to the exact point that old Hank went back, and brought the O5 with him. That X-person then convinces Hank how those actions resulted in a even worse future.
Hank agrees not to bring the O5 into the 'future' at all.
So in a end of Age of Apocalypse style 'reset', the O5 never came to the present and probably had their minds wiped (by said X-person or Prof X) at that point and everything is 'reset'
-----

Now the problem with this theory is that the O5 interacted and interfered with a lot of stories from 2012 onwards, so that would need to be handled, and I can't think how :/

Including Jean's resurrection. The events of Teen Jean's solo lead directly into Phoenix Resurrection, so if teen Jean was never around, adult Jean never came back to life. Not gonna happen.

Surely they are more like 19/20 by now? How long have they been in the present? Jean was in college at the start of Extraordinary, which was pre-Secret War's 16 month time hop. They would have been 17 at the least in the original timeline(Bobby was explicitly said to be the youngest at 16 in 1963's #1).

Extraordinary was AFTER that timeskip. But yeah, that makes her at least 18.

this date and her death were horrible and totally unnecessary. brought nothing to the plot. i would have liked if Bloodstorm was abscent and leaved the blue team at the end of blue. she could be alive for other writers to use if she didn't appeared in extermination.

edit:
Aren't vampires Immortal?
shouldn't she just come back after a while?

No - the weapon that killed her was silver. Vampires are weak to that.

[Ambaryerno]

No - the weapon that killed her was silver. Vampires are weak to that.

That, too. Apparently mutant/vampire hybrids are a common sight wherever this version of Ahab came from, so he had his harpoon laced with silver.

[Askani's Flame]

Including Jean's resurrection. The events of Teen Jean's solo lead directly into Phoenix Resurrection, so if teen Jean was never around, adult Jean never came back to life. Not gonna happen.

Did it though? I mean, there was this big lead-up to Jeen battling the Phoenix for her fate, but did that REALLY affect the storyline or plot to what was happening in Resurrection? Ghost Jean has NEVER been referenced again, BY ANYONE. Has anything from that solo book been referenced outside of it? Did it (the events in the Solo) even happen lol? Jeen had NO impact on Resurrection, that story was happening with or without her. It seems like Resurrection became the Bobby Ewing shower to the solo book....

But there is no way that someone simply telling Beast to not bring them back would resolve what has happened since. Everything from that point forward would get erased and we'd be back in 2013 (which in some cases might not be bad lol) with completely different outcomes to events given the involvement of the O5 since then.

[Uncanny X-Man]

Just finished issue one. VERY good first issue with excellent artwork - it's great to read the first chapter of a story that's not all setup and where something actually happens right away. I LOVE that Jean called Nathan her son, as I feel theirs is one of the most neglected relationships in the X-books.

Very curious to see where this is going and I'm definitely excited now to have Ed Brisson co-writing the Uncanny X-Men relaunch. It's funny how much housecleaning he's doing though, getting rid of all the duplicates one way or another, from the O5 to Bloodstorm to Old Man Logan. No duplicate character shall escape his fury!

[jyamen]

Cable hasn't been a very interesting character for awhile, so I welcome a change to the status quo by reintroducing him as a young brash punk. I remember the Ahab storyline fondly as a kid so nostalgia did its job in seeing him around again, although, it sticking the landing that I'm concerned about. As it is, I enjoyed this issue.

[Wiccan]

My point is she was more killed in order to get rid of an alt version. The fact that Cyclops has some angst over it (and he was literally the only one) seemed kind of secondary.

Tyke's reaction is in no way secondary if we're talking from an in-story perspective. The meta side of it(getting rid of AUs) is a whole other thing. I'm not really against her getting killed off or anything. I don't even personally care about how it was written, I just think it's fair to point out that it wasn't done in the best way imo.

But was Cable killed as motivation for Jean?

Yeah. And Cable was shot dead to give the Jeans and Rachel emotional motivation.

Err, I don't think I agree that Cable was fridged for Jean and/or Rachel. Compare the death scenes for Storm and him.

She dies out of nowhere as a shock value moment. The focus of the scene is how Tyke feels about it. There's not really that much of a storyline for her, it could have been someone else on her place and things could be pretty much the same, the killer has no connection to her. Cable gets to have a whole sequence for his death, we see him fighting against it, he has a meaningful interaction with his killer, who happens to be a younger version of himself, so it had to be him on that scene... Jean and Rachel's reactions are a part of the storyline, but not the whole thing.

[Master of Sound]

How long ago was Ahab really a threat? Decades ago. So it was cool to see him as he should be.

Btw, I don't remember however the Rory Campbell story ended. He was aware he would become Ahab and did all he could to prevent that.

Is this the Ahab we remember, or is this in fact the Rory of the current timeline and did he fail?

[gotunandan]

How long ago was Ahab really a threat? Decades ago. So it was cool to see him as he should be.

Btw, I don't remember however the Rory Campbell story ended. He was aware he would become Ahab and did all he could to prevent that.

Is this the Ahab we remember, or is this in fact the Rory of the current timeline and did he fail?

I don't think we ever saw how Rory Campbell became Ahab on panel. Unless the Ahab (Apocalypse horseman) from the Twelve storyline was 'present' Rory Campbell changed to Ahab.

[Havok83]

Did it though? I mean, there was this big lead-up to Jeen battling the Phoenix for her fate, but did that REALLY affect the storyline or plot to what was happening in Resurrection? Ghost Jean has NEVER been referenced again, BY ANYONE. Has anything from that solo book been referenced outside of it? Did it (the events in the Solo) even happen lol? Jeen had NO impact on Resurrection, that story was happening with or without her. It seems like Resurrection became the Bobby Ewing shower to the solo book....

But there is no way that someone simply telling Beast to not bring them back would resolve what has happened since. Everything from that point forward would get erased and we'd be back in 2013 (which in some cases might not be bad lol) with completely different outcomes to events given the involvement of the O5 since then.

IA. Teen Jean was rather irrelevant. The PF wanted Jean back and it would have resurrected her without teen Jean as its done in the past. She did not affect that outcome

[Jackraow21]

Cable hasn't been a very interesting character for awhile, so I welcome a change to the status quo by reintroducing him as a young brash punk. I remember the Ahab storyline fondly as a kid so nostalgia did its job in seeing him around again, although, it sticking the landing that I'm concerned about. As it is, I enjoyed this issue.

I find grizzled old soldiers more interesting than young brash punks. Maybe it's my age.

[Beetle]

Yeah no Bloodstorm was definitely fridged and I agree that it's a waste. I'm just placing most of the blame on Jordan White and Brisson instead of Bunn.

That, too. Apparently mutant/vampire hybrids are a common sight wherever this version of Ahab came from, so he had his harpoon laced with silver.

Bloodstorm was a bit different compared to most vampires. At the very least she never had trouble with sunlight or needing to be invited before entering a residence, so she may have been a daywalker.

And when she died she didn't burn up or turn into dust like other vampires. It's weird.

[Uncanny X-Man]

Was it ever confirmed that Ahab was really Rory Campbell? It was basically explicitly said it was going to happen in Lobdell's and Ellis' Excalibur runs, but I guess it's always just one of the possible futures until it really happens...

[Askani's Flame]

IA. Teen Jean was rather irrelevant. The PF wanted Jean back and it would have resurrected her without teen Jean as its done in the past. She did not affect that outcome

I still question if anything from that book actually is canon at this point. From Ghost Jean never being a thing, to Emma's quick recovery and failure to mention anything of a Phoenix threat, to any of her adventures with Marvel characters it has remained like it was fan fic.

Meanwhile it's unclear which Ahab this is. There have been three thus far:
1) Original Ahab who appeared in "Days of Future Present" and enslaved Cyclops and the Invisible Woman, and then again in "Days of Futures Yet To Come" where Excalibur goes to Rachel's timeline and she gets to fix Mastermold and the Sentinel problem (with TANGERINE!!!);
2) Rory Campbell becoming Ahab (with no explanation) during the 12 storyline becoming "Famine" (although somewhere it was claimed he merged with 811 Ahab?)
3) A new version of Ahab that appeared in Uncanny Avengers and AXIS and only wanted to hunt Havok

Maybe this is a 4th, or one of the other 3 versions.

Was it ever confirmed that Ahab was really Rory Campbell? It was basically explicitly said it was going to happen in Lobdell's and Ellis' Excalibur runs, but I guess it's always just one of the possible futures until it really happens...

Originally Cable was going to be revealed to be Ahab (as hinted in Uncanny X-Men Annual 14), but they dropped that when he became Cyclops' son. Then Rory was introduced in Excalibur and he saw his potential fate when Rachel entered the timestream #75. I think eventually they saw he became Ahab in the 12 storyline.

[Tunasammiches]

Yes!!! Rachel's first big participation in an X-Crossover since Days of Future Present! I'm so glad she's finally going to be part of the action. Only one missing here is (older) Cyclops. Wish he was here for this one. Still, it's always amazing getting to see Ray interact with her family. I'm heartbroken for her reaction at Cable's death, since they were super close (even though the writers didn't allow them to interact for almost 10 years). Also glad that Jean fans got Jean's reaction to this event as well. It could have been more, but it was still there.

As for Cable, it was actually nice to see him get some page time with the 05, something I didn't realize has never happened until now, but I just wish that we saw him interacting with the OG 05 at all, to merit a reaction from Jeen and Tyke. If there are only one interaction prior to this. I'm sad this version of Cable is dead. I wish he got more time to play with the cast rather than be taken out so early in the story. Also, I'll be sad if young Cable is Tyke and Jeen's kid from the future because that would mean that despite years of thinking that if Jean and Scott had a child, it would have been Rachel instead of Nathan, who is Madelyn Pryor's kid. But Madelyn or no, Rachel would never have been born in this reality, despite Madelyn Pryor being Cable's actual mom. Poor Ray. She's a tragic character through and through. Lost in time and dimensions, ex-slave hound all through childhood, no real family now... I love this Rachel forever, but I think after all she's been through, she at least deserves to be born as a real 616 character one day.

Also, I'm oddly happy to see Ahab in the books as a baddie again!