Astonishing X-Men Annual 1 (2018)

[Abbz_A]

All I'm saying is, Emma was created to be a counterfoil of Xavier in the first place. Both were rich white telepaths. Both ran schools. Both had dreams. Xavier built his school to train superheroes to save the world, to prove to humans that mutants were useful and should be accepted. Emma built her school to turn mutant children into commodities to be bought and sold for the wealth and power of the Inner Circle of the Hellfire Club. It's that simple.

Xavier has done a lot of messed up things, but almost always he was actually looking out for the greater good. And he didn't act out on his most base of being the vast majority of the time, even though he could and make it so that no one would even know.

I thought this issue was a better use of this new edgy "X", reiterating the main story in 1-12, but aside his first students. And Lucifer was actually a huge deal in the original run, moreso than Magneto even. He's from Sirius or something, the whole big plot focuses on him and a lot of other aliens in the original run. Mutants as a concept are rather vaguely distinguished at that point. Lots of random underground societies, monsters of the week, etc type of plots back then. It's kinda interesting, no one plays with those themes anymore, so it was cool to see that bought up again in this issue.

Yea I know, that’s why Emma .. isn’t a hypocrite n people don’t get mad when she manipulate folks becuz that’s how she started.
And Xavier is suppose to be “all good” .. so when he does shady things, he seems like a hypocrite.

But I agree, I wanna see how things will unfold. Let’s hope the following issues are better than this. So the next issue will be Astonishing 14 right?

[yogaflame]

But I agree, I wanna see how things will unfold. Let’s hope the following issues are better than this. So the next issue will be Astonishing 14 right?

This team and X are completely scrapped in the next arc, though. Now it's Alex's band of losers, no X in sight.

[Abbz_A]

This team and X are completely scrapped in the next arc, though. Now it's Alex's band of losers, no X in sight.

This issues was suppose to be before Red, right?

Btw lol’ed so hard at ur “Alex’s band of losers” xD lmao. That’s exactly how I feel haha

[yogaflame]

This issues was suppose to be before Red, right?

Btw lol’ed so hard at ur “Alex’s band of losers” xD lmao. That’s exactly how I feel haha

There is no continuity anymore, but sure, let's pretend this happened before Red starts, which is somehow after Gold, but before Rogue and Gambit get married in Gold.

[jollygoldfish]

All I'm saying is, Emma was created to be a counterfoil of Xavier in the first place. Both were rich white telepaths. Both ran schools. Both had dreams. Xavier built his school to train superheroes to save the world, to prove to humans that mutants were useful and should be accepted. Emma built her school to turn mutant children into commodities to be bought and sold for the wealth and power of the Inner Circle of the Hellfire Club. It's that simple.

Xavier has done a lot of messed up things, but almost always he was actually looking out for the greater good. And he didn't act out on his most base of being the vast majority of the time, even though he could and make it so that no one would even know.

I thought this issue was a better use of this new edgy "X", reiterating the main story in 1-12, but aside his first students. And Lucifer was actually a huge deal in the original run, moreso than Magneto even. He's from Sirius or something, the whole big plot focuses on him and a lot of other aliens in the original run. Mutants as a concept are rather vaguely distinguished at that point. Lots of random underground societies, monsters of the week, etc type of plots back then. It's kinda interesting, no one plays with those themes anymore, so it was cool to see that bought up again in this issue.

Don't worry. Once Xavier becomes a villain he'll be celebrated just as much as Emma and Magneto. Especially since you can argue he's done more good for the world than either of them. Once he teams up with Magneto and Emma "for the good of the world", the backstabbing and mindraping between the 3 of them can start. You know, since consent means so little to all of them. In fact, this is something I'd like to see.

[Abbz_A]

Don't worry. Once Xavier becomes a villain he'll be celebrated just as much as Emma and Magneto. Especially since you can argue he's done more good for the world than either of them. Once he teams up with Magneto and Emma "for the good of the world", the backstabbing and mindraping between the 3 of them can start. You know, since consent means so little to all of them. In fact, this is something I'd like to see.

This does not sound bad. Make it happen.

[yogaflame]

Don't worry. Once Xavier becomes a villain he'll be celebrated just as much as Emma and Magneto. Especially since you can argue he's done more good for the world than either of them. Once he teams up with Magneto and Emma "for the good of the world", the backstabbing and mindraping between the 3 of them can start. You know, since consent means so little to all of them. In fact, this is something I'd like to see.

It's the logical conclusion at this point. Erik pins people down with their iron, and then Emma and X go to town. Fandom salivates in ecstasy.

[King_Thor13]

Thank you.

Np.

So when Emma goes from cackling villain trying to rule the world and make slaves of anyone who stands in her way, to "fighting to prove loyalty to the team", and then mind controls the team into being her slaves, and switches back to being a villain, it's not hypocritical. But when Xavier coerces the team into taking out a literal alien thought demon who would have taken over the whole world, and then mindwipes them into being happy instead of bitchy douches, he's evil incarnate? Ok, gotcha.

You're exaggerating. Emma Frost isn't Selene. As for her heelturn in IvX, that was a poorly written event and most fans thought it was a disservice to her character. Even so, she had just lost the love of her life and dealing with that trauma obviously broke her. The next time we saw Emma Frost in X-Men Blue, she came to her senses and aided the O5, turning on Miss Sinister, Bastion and an inverted Havok. She's apologetic, and she doesn't attempt to mindwipe everyone's memories of the event or change their personalities entirely. The way Xavier went about this wasn't heroic; he could have simply asked for help, and didn't need to remove their memory of it happening afterwards. And is that really a service, in mucking with their minds in order to "make them happy". That's not a gift in my opinion. As for them being "bitchy douches", as you've put it, the immense trauma and grief they've had to go through are grounds for them to be unhappy or depressed. That's normal. It doesn't give Xavier the right to take that away, even if its "for their own good"

The whataboutism argument does not change the fact that Xavier took the O5s autonomy away from them which is what is so awful in this issue. Their lives are due to him making that decision for them. He controlled them literally, and emotionally down to what they wear and think. They are his mind, body, and soul.
The X-Men was founded on a grubby old man's perversion.

The whatsboutism argument is a lazy one.

Exactly. He's taken away their right to choose, and taken away their memories. It's an extreme perversion. It's theft in a way, without them even having known what they've had stolen from them. Besides, the mindwiping was, I think, more about X acting out of self-interest and covering his tracks (as he did in Astonishing #12) rather than a act of genuine good intent.

I’m beginning to think so too.

I really hope not. The sooner we can be rid of X the better in my opinion. I'd much rather have Betsy and Warren among my beloved X-Men, rather than being Xavier's pawns.

If Xavier hadn't acted:

Scott would have been manipulated by a diamond-skinned telepath into a life of petty crime. Facts.

Hank would have been enslaved by the Conquistador. Facts.

Bobby would have been lynched by his townspeople with the help of the police. Facts.

Jean would have stayed in a catatonic stupor. Facts.

Maybe Warren would have been okay on his own, but not the others.

Further, the entire world would have been destroyed by the Z'Nox aliens if he hadn't gone into seclusion and prepared a plan that utilized his expertly trained 'child soldiers'(who were all over 18 by then) in perfect tandem.

These aren't facts. We don't know that for sure, because those events never played out with Xavier's intervention. They might have been better off. All of them have died at least once, and lost friends, family and pieces of themselves along the way. He saved them, sure, but it doesn't necessarily mean that he gave them better lives.

At least most of Xavier's students are still alive....

Are we forgetting Sway, Petra, Thunderbird and the countless times his students have died? Just because most of those deaths were undone doesn't mean they didn't happen.

I don't get what this story was trying to accomplish. Will there be a follow-up?

It may connect to Uncanny X-Men, and also to whatever is next for X. I don't know why it was an Astonishing Annual, as it doesn't connect at all to the team in that title rn.

This team and X are completely scrapped in the next arc, though. Now it's Alex's band of losers, no X in sight.

Thankfully we don't have to put up with his nonsense for a while. And would this be a bad time to point out that this group of characters (despite me loving the 05) are all white, and only one woman is among them? I'd be annoyed if it wasn't scrapped and they had continued with them operating as a team. It's not 1963. And what do you have against Havok, Colossus, Banshee, Beast, Warpath and Dazzler? Are there any X-Men you do like?

Don't worry. Once Xavier becomes a villain he'll be celebrated just as much as Emma and Magneto. Especially since you can argue he's done more good for the world than either of them. Once he teams up with Magneto and Emma "for the good of the world", the backstabbing and mindraping between the 3 of them can start. You know, since consent means so little to all of them. In fact, this is something I'd like to see.

That's an unusual perspective. I don't think Xavier has ever had a particularly large fanbase, so I don't see how him becoming a villain (some would consider him one now) would make him more likable. And there's no way that Magneto and Emma would willingly work together, as Erik despises Emma for what she's done to him, and set out on a crusade of vengeance not too long ago. Hell, I'm sure both of them would be hesitant to work with X, as he isn't the man they once knew, and they never saw eye-to-eye with him anyway.

[Heroine Addict]

Wow, some pretty heady stuff, and a tad unsettling. So Xavier's out to settle some old scores, and get his woeful, wide-eyed waifs to see the forest for the trees, in the process. Nice character work, combined with that signature bit of eldritch atmosphere, I liked it. Chuck's become a more conflicting character than ever, and the 04's damaged miX provides unparalleled chemistry, as always. Approved of the subteXtual commentary, also. Warren's dark Angel moment was rather riveting, as well - kudos!

[Tazpocalapse]

This X character still feels a little off or incomplete. I don't mind the return of "Professor Jerk" but i hope they don't pull another Deadly Genesis debacle and turn him into a irredeemable character. I'm wondering if Phantomex body maybe somehow affecting how X is acting he seems to be using alot of deception and misdirection in this issue.

[Factor]

So they've regressed Archangel yet again? What are X-editors for? The last time Warren was fixed was during X's introduction. They're following X's last appearance but ignoring that in that same issue he "fixed" Archangel again? (Let's not even mention how Bunn had already done that before)

[Heroine Addict]

... Now it's Alex's band of losers, no X in sight.

... Btw lol’ed so hard at ur “Alex’s band of losers” xD lmao. That’s exactly how I feel haha

From the top floppy copies ordered by retailers, in July:

33. Astonishing X-Men #13 - 48,504
42. X-Men Red #6 - 36,808
47. X-Men Gold #31 - 34,842
48. X-Men Gold #32 - 34,409
62. X-Men Blue #31 - 29,346
65. X-Men Blue #32 - 28,839
96. Weapon X #20 - 21,428

IDK, looks like they're the winners there, when it comes to current X-teams. Be careful, butthurt can become you.

[Heroine Addict]

... I'm wondering if Phantomex body maybe somehow affecting how X is acting he seems to be using alot of deception and misdirection in this issue.

That's what I'm assuming.

... What are X-editors for?...

Being asleep at the wheel, apparently.

[DDM]

It's the logical conclusion at this point. Erik pins people down with their iron, and then Emma and X go to town. Fandom salivates in ecstasy.

Now that’s a hot 3-way. Already salivating.

[Fokken]

You're exaggerating. Emma Frost isn't Selene.

Yes. This. So much this.

As for her heelturn in IvX, that was a poorly written event and most fans thought it was a disservice to her character. Even so, she had just lost the love of her life and dealing with that trauma obviously broke her.

I feel the same about it being a disservice to her character. What I find amusing about that whole "Emma blows up a bunch of red-shirt-Inhumans" is the alarming number of x-fans who regularly spat venom at the Inhumans, blaming ALL of them for a SELECT few's reprehensible actions that resulted in unnecessary pain and death-- essentially demanding their heads and then when it actually happens, many of those "RaaarrrHateInhumans" folks were like "NAW dude! Character assassination!!" I guess its one of those be careful what you wish for situations. <shrug>

That being said, in OUR House we STAN Emma Frost for always, and I look forward to her returning as the Avenging Angel she is.