The Rectangle: Jean/Scott/Emma/Logan Discussion

[spirit2011]

Just showing who's the problem in their relationship.

that can only be Scott

[AHRNIHAL]

Quesada was the editor in chief for 12 years, so he made sure to only hire writers that have the same vision that he had about Scott and Jean.

Talking about insecurities.

[Hizashi]

Quesada was the editor in chief for 12 years, so he made sure to only hire writers that have the same vision that he had about Scott and Jean.

I'm pretty sure it would be interesting having Jean alive for 14 years. But I also would like to know how Cyclops fans would react to Jean having a new relationship, they didn't even like jean/longan on renew your vows and that is a cheap AU.

For toher side maybe it was better have her death for a while, because I'm pretty sure her character would have been destroyed to help Emma/Cyclops




I don't know what kissing Logan has anything to do with it, or Scott refusing Emma( he didn't refused at all or they wouldn't have a affair)

There is nothing of mental manipulation. I think that Jean was probably tired of Scott projecting his own insecurities on her

If he chose to hire writers who agreed with his (poor IMO) vision, that’s also on him. Speaking only for myself Jogan in RYV only bothered me for two reasons: 1) the ridiculous rationale for the dissolution of Jott and 2) the fact that Scott was a sad sack in that story. Making Jogan without dumping on Scott isn’t an unreasonable request. I would have no problem with Jean being with someone else as long as Scott isn’t crapped on by it - don’t bring him up in that relationship, there, simple.

Jean kissing Logan matters because she knows she isn’t confronting their problems either and she doesn’t let Scott truly express his worries when he tries, she dismisses them. Scott’s refusal matters because he refused a physical affair, and you can feel how you feel but none of the characters, not even Jean, feels that a psychic affair is as bad as a physical one.

[AHRNIHAL]

that can only be Scott

Jean,who was not a wife to Scott.
Or just wanted to be his wife for sexual purpose.

[spirit2011]

Jean,who was not a wife to Scott.
Or just wanted to be his wife for sexual purpose.

If she wanted just sex, that still more than Scott that didn't even want sex with her

[PrezValentine]

If he chose to hire writers who agreed with his (poor IMO) vision, that’s also on him. Speaking only for myself Jogan in RYV only bothered me for two reasons: 1) the ridiculous rationale for the dissolution of Jott and 2) the fact that Scott was a sad sack in that story. Making Jogan without dumping on Scott isn’t an unreasonable request. I would have no problem with Jean being with someone else as long as Scott isn’t crapped on by it - don’t bring him up in that relationship, there, simple.

Jean kissing Logan matters because she knows she isn’t confronting their problems either and she doesn’t let Scott truly express his worries when he tries, she dismisses them. Scott’s refusal matters because he refused a physical affair, and you can feel how you feel but none of the characters, not even Jean, feels that a psychic affair is as bad as a physical one.

I'm amazed that you even bother. Many times in this forum I had to rethink my vision of certain characters and events. I guess I shouldn't expect the same lack of attachment to established views from others.

I think I'm done. You and SpiderClops pretty much voice all my thoughts and I don't think I have anything to add.

[TheCape]

Outside of one consensual kiss and one not in the late 80's/90's I think of any time Jean showed more depth of emotions for Logan than Storm or Professor-X. I considered Psylocke with Scott more of a triangle than Logan with Jean.

Try to tell that to some fans, originally Logan was the Namor of the Jean/Scott pairing in the first few years of his run, a third suitor with no hope of suceding that only existed to be a minor obstacle to Cyclops. Thanks to Byrne he became bigger than that and the subplot was dropped (plus Logan started a romance with Mariko at the same time), but thanks to some things that CC said and wrote (and the whole thing with Maddie) and of course the movies, people think that it was a bigger deal than what it actually was, the true? Logan has always been a very tangential factor in all this.

[AHRNIHAL]

If she wanted just sex, that still more than Scott that didn't even want sex with her

And Scott wanted to talk to about her phoenix persona,and you said it she was too tired to talk about his concerns.


Edit:Bye.See you soon.Gotta go.

[Disciple of Redd]

Except that they didn’t propel Scott’s narrative based on “Jean’s dead”, and the comics don’t support that; his characterization was centered around the extinction crisis and the Phoenix Force, not Jean. His personal life is a different matter, but his character trajectory didn’t benefit from Jean’s death.

What have editors said exactly?

Quesada himself once said Jean could not come back because Scott was with Emma. I looked for the old Q&A session where he was asked and can't find it now.

The toxicity in such a view is sad and damn-near prehistoric but the Q&A was in 2009 at the earliest.

[Abbz_A]

Well, Jean had her own thing going on. Sorry if she wasn't the sex doll Morrsion wanted Jean to be. She tried to help Scott and Scott refused, she wasn't his mom to be 100% of her time on him.

For me it was Scott that wasn't being Jean's husband, that was on the books instead of what Morrison said on interviews. This talks more about how the writer view and live his relationships

If my husband went thro psychological issues n is suffering PTSD. I’ll drop everything that’s going on with my life until he’s fully healed. That’s what married couples should do.

Scott was going thro something psychologically n emotionally ... also he always repressed himself. Jean as a telepath should’ve just helped but she wasn’t having it.

Man i had to say, that Jean and Scott really hit the emotional bottom in Morrison, they were so mess up that they went to Logan at all people for some sort of comfort, the only difference is that Scott didn't kiss Logan... hmmm.... maybe Morrison should have explore that instead

I love you for this!!

[phoenixzero23]

Currently there is no love triangle/square.
there was one very short lived between Jean/Scott/Logan, it ended with Jean and Scott together.
then there was one between Jean/Scott/Emma, it ended when Jean died.
If Jean dates Logan, there is still no love triangle because Scott is dead.

regarding Jean and Scott, they were having serious marital problems, doesn't mean they didn't love each other though according to Morrison the flame was fading. Some people blame Jean for kissing wolverine, yes that happened under those circunstances maybe not be the best course of action but Scott had telephatic sex with Emma, that was wrong too. Both things were wrong and i understand that some fans of each character feel cheated. Currently as of this year it looks like Marvel stand seems to be that Scott was the one who messed up worse and he is sorry. for years it wasn't but currently that's the case.
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[spirit2011]

How does it contradict what he was trying to do? Please explain.

That she still cared about the marriage and about Scott? that she was trying to be a wife to Scott?

Go ahead and only focus on Scott’s lesser qualities, that’ll lend you plenty of credibility in this argument. Her death happened in the penultimate arc of his run, she was involved in the run. Marvel chose not to do anything with Jean later, that’s on them not Morrison or Scott. Just because he didn’t extoll the virtues of Jean doesn’t mean she’s superfluous.

Morrison choose to kill Jean, because he didn't need her on future stories. He wanted to keep her dead because that is how dark phoenix should end.

Their marriage was strained, that was the point of the story. He couldn’t be supportive because they were both straining their marriage. I’ve given both characters equal consideration - you refuse to do so.

I don't think I refuse to do , it's just that one character was really on the wrong.

[TheCape]

I love you for this!!

Let's be honest, is what this forums want to see

[Disciple of Redd]

But I also would like to know how Cyclops fans would react to Jean having a new relationship, they didn't even like jean/longan on renew your vows and that is a cheap AU.

Do you see these threads? They would freak the heck out, which is a top 10 reason she should be in a new ship. Bring the sexist "Cyclops owns her and she should be either with him or dead" rule to a screeching, screaming end, man-babies be damned.

This is one of those progressive things that needs to happen for story AND meta reasons.

Really bring this franchise into 2018.

[phoenixzero23]

Let's be honest, is what this forums want to see

Yes!
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