Batman and Batfamily Solicitations for November 2018

[MASTER-OF-SUPRISE]

I've determined that Scott Lobdell takes place on a different earth.

Also, I don't think the explicitly stated the Penguin was dead. I thought Batman said he was in the hospital and Jason would have to answer for it if he died?

It does seem like RHATO is it's own thing really (at least at times anyway) and I really think it works better with that set up then having it attached at the hip to the rest of the Bat titles. Maybe that's what the new direction is attempting to do and if it is then I'm all for that.

Penguin was in a coma last I checked not dead but he really shouldn't be up and about yet either, which is what the complaint is basically about.

It certainly seems to take place on another Earth. So I wouldn't be too surprised but then we get the characters appearances with other books. So it could just be a case of the right hand not knowing what the left is doing.

[Sergard]

The solicits even seem to hint at a possible death for Oswald at the hands of the shadowy operator who is clearly Bane if one just examines the outline. Should that happen then it would be bigger eff you imo.

I wouldn't be mad about that. Penguin is a Batman villain, not a Red Hood villain. Maybe I'm a little too sentimental since it's only a fictional character but I think if a well-known character dies it should happen in a closely related title - just out of respect for the character and its fanbase. (Another reason why I don't like HiC).

And I'm glad that Penguin didn't die in RHaTO. Jason would have killed him for the wrong reasons. He even shows regret afterwards. Jason has definitely learned something through this encounter - not only about himself but also about Bruce.

[Armor of God]

King has posted Penguin art and Oswald is wearing an eye patch. Bullet proof monocle for the win.

[Rise]

I wonder if the pic he posted is related to what happened to him in Rhato or not because this sure is interesting.

[Frontier]

2- That Catwoman cover is weird as heck.

And very non-indicative of the content. You'd think with a solicit like Catwoman in jail that they'd have a cover with her behind bars or something.

Most of them would probably be off-limits for that though and that's what I was getting at. DC isn't going to let Jason permanently kill any of Batman's rogues and that's the end of it.

I don't think they'd be more off-limits then Penguin is.

At the very least those deaths would probably not stick, but wouldn't be as immediately undone as what happened to Penguin.

Honestly, unless you've read Batman: Eternal most people probably already think Falcone is dead by now .

[JasonTodd428]

The solicits even seem to hint at a possible death for Oswald at the hands of the shadowy operator who is clearly Bane if one just examines the outline. Should that happen then it would be bigger eff you imo.

I doubt he's gonna be killed in the story though so I don't see any reason to get bent out of shape over it. Like I said I pretty much expected Oswald would not be down for long anyway because of being a prominent Batman villain. Now if there was any kind of serious attempts at cohesion between say Batman and RHATO then King would have had Bane be the mastermind behind manipulating Jason into shooting Oswald as a part of his shadowy plot to kill Cobblepot and he would be maybe the head of this Underlife organization Jason's going up against.

[JasonTodd428]

I don't think they'd be more off-limits then Penguin is.

At the very least those deaths would probably not stick, but wouldn't be as immediately undone as what happened to Penguin.

Honestly, unless you've read Batman: Eternal most people probably already think Falcone is dead by now .

I'm going to have to disagree with you there. If the villain is to obscure then the whole premise of this new direction completely falls apart IMHO. The villain, therefore, needed to be someone with enough cred to have the shooting carry emotional resonance and more importantly it had to be someone with a connection to Jason's past that would make sense insofar as a personal vendetta goes. There are very few villains who would qualify in that regard.

[Aahz]

I don't think they'd be more off-limits then Penguin is.

They are at least imo villains, where they wouldn't loose much by killing them of. These villains are not really iconic or don't really work well as recurring villains.

[G-Potion]

I doubt he's gonna be killed in the story though so I don't see any reason to get bent out of shape over it. Like I said I pretty much expected Oswald would not be down for long anyway because of being a prominent Batman villain. Now if there was any kind of serious attempts at cohesion between say Batman and RHATO then King would have had Bane be the mastermind behind manipulating Jason into shooting Oswald as a part of his shadowy plot to kill Cobblepot and he would be maybe the head of this Underlife organization Jason's going up against.

Putting my dislike for King treating Jason aside, I feel that turning what Jason did and is going to do into part of Bane's manipulation takes away the character's agency and does a huge disservice to the personal struggle Jason has been going through in his book.

[Armor of God]

LOL, while I dont see both storylines converging I can see DC sort of tying it in the sense that Bane systematically manipulated Bruce's closest family to be estranged from him.

[Sergard]

I don't think Bane plays a part in Jason trying to kill Penguin. But maybe he'll use the incident to his advantage.
But I wonder if Bane will have any connection to HiC since the Riddler is in it - and Riddler seems to be on Bane's side, or?

I would wish that DC mirrors the cover of Batman #58 so that the "right" eye of Penguin is covered by Batman.

[JasonTodd428]

Putting my dislike for King treating Jason aside, I feel that turning what Jason did and is going to do into part of Bane's manipulation takes away the character's agency and does a huge disservice to the personal struggle Jason has been going through in his book.

I'm not sure I agree with you there. I think it would depend on how it was handled to be honest and it isn't as if Bat characters haven't fallen for manipulations before Catwoman being the most recent example of that. Also if you want to get technical about it Bane was manipulating Batman himself during Knightfall by forcing him to face all those foes in order to wear him down.

In any case its doubtful that there will be any meaningful mention or resolution to the events in RHATO #25 in any other Bat book so its a moot point anyway.

[Frontier]

I'm going to have to disagree with you there. If the villain is to obscure then the whole premise of this new direction completely falls apart IMHO. The villain, therefore, needed to be someone with enough cred to have the shooting carry emotional resonance and more importantly it had to be someone with a connection to Jason's past that would make sense insofar as a personal vendetta goes. There are very few villains who would qualify in that regard.

I think there's a middle ground when it comes to villains, and writers could probably construe a connection with Jason if they were so interested in doing so.

[Godlike13]

Lobdell has had more then enough time to create and establish a credible new villain that could carry an emotional weight for Jason to ultimately kill. He’s been on the character for years now.

[JasonTodd428]

Lobdell has had more then enough time to create and establish a credible new villain that could carry an emotional weight for Jason to ultimately kill. He’s been on the character for years now.

There was the Untitled back during the N52 period which could have been developed as such. Jason was supposed to be hunting them down for killing all of the All Caste originally and that was supposed to take a long while owing to the fact that they could literally hide in plain sight. I could see there having been perhaps some heretofore undiscovered member of the group coming after Jason for killing all of the Untitled at a later date and perhaps killing someone close to him in retailiation. The thing is Lobdell eventually left the book before anything could come of it and then Tynion came along who made such a mess of the Untitled and the other concepts connected to it that Lobdell is no longer interested in even using the concepts he himself invented. Also I seem to remember Lobdell mentioning he had other plans for the start of the Rebirth book but editorial insisted that he use Black Mask for the big bad in the first arc instead so its not as if he's completely free to just create a new villain when he's got editorial breathing down his neck to used established ones in his run.