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  1. #16
    Astonishing Member stargazer01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phantom1592 View Post
    Oh... I LOVED season 1. It was everything I wanted a Super show to be... and that continued through the Tyler episodes of season 2... but after that it had a pretty steep downward curve ending where I can't even remember if I caught the finale of season 3 or just blew it off...
    For me, Season 1 was mediocre but with some solid episodes plus I liked the cast a lot.

    Season 2 I really liked! I loved the Kara/Mon-El romance.. I also thought Tyler Superman was pretty decent in the first episodes, but then the writers pretty much ruined his character in the season 2 finale when he declared Kara was a superior hero than him.. That was character assassination to me.

    But I still gave Season 3 a chance for the cast and to see Mon-El back and the Legion... Well all of them were a big disappointment for me and I never cared about the World Killers story. Even when Kara's mom turned out alive, the writers managed to pretty much disappoint me. What a waste of casting with Erika Durance.

  2. #17
    Astonishing Member phantom1592's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stargazer01 View Post
    For me, Season 1 was mediocre but with some solid episodes plus I liked the cast a lot.

    Season 2 I really liked! I loved the Kara/Mon-El romance.. I also thought Tyler Superman was pretty decent in the first episodes, but then the writers pretty much ruined his character in the season 2 finale when he declared Kara was a superior hero than him.. That was character assassination to me.

    But I still gave Season 3 a chance for the cast and to see Mon-El back and the Legion... Well all of them were a big disappointment for me and I never cared about the World Killers story. Even when Kara's mom turned out alive, the writers managed to pretty much disappoint me. What a waste of casting with Erika Durance.
    The romance was tedious for me. Along with her sister's romance... and J'onn's Romance... and all the whiny drama that was included.... Seriously, when I turn on a superhero show I want to see super-heroics... I don't want to see Kara curled up on a couch with a bucket of ice cream crying... and Mon-el was just useless that season.

    Season 3, Mon-el was at least a competent hero who had grown in his missing years... but everyone else was whiny and lame and yeah, the worldkiller plot was dull.. Manhunter's father getting alzheimers and dying... it was just so... moody.


    Season one was a bit mediocre.. but Kara was bright, she was happy. She was a superhero who didn't need dark drama to encourage her to save people, nor did she need to have extended training scenes as she learned her powers... Flash and Arrow took YEARS to become recognizable as Flash and Green Arrow.... but Kara was in full costume and flying and saving lives by the end of the pilot.

    It was SUCH a breath of Fresh Air.... now it's just as dark and moody and usually depressing high school drama as the rest of the CW.

    And yeah.. that was another problem with season 2 and 3.... That kind of high school drama is tolerated amongst random scientists and young adults on the OTHER shows... but by experienced aliens and top leading government agencies just felt... STUPID...

  3. #18
    Extraordinary Member superduperman's Avatar
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    Guys, I just had a terrible thought last night. What if they are going to kill him off? Think about it. There's plenty of incentive. They don't want her in his shadow anymore and WB has invested a lot in the movies. I'm sure they're not happy when the show uses him.
    Assassinate Putin!

  4. #19
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    doesn't look like this crossover is going to be a grand affair to match the previous one which was over the top. the first crossover was the best understated yet with enough action and interaction. I wonder if it will be called the reporter or something like the bat. does anyone know the title as the title of the first six episodes of the flash have been supposedly revealed.

  5. #20
    Astonishing Member stargazer01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phantom1592 View Post
    The romance was tedious for me. Along with her sister's romance... and J'onn's Romance... and all the whiny drama that was included.... Seriously, when I turn on a superhero show I want to see super-heroics... I don't want to see Kara curled up on a couch with a bucket of ice cream crying... and Mon-el was just useless that season.

    Season 3, Mon-el was at least a competent hero who had grown in his missing years... but everyone else was whiny and lame and yeah, the worldkiller plot was dull.. Manhunter's father getting alzheimers and dying... it was just so... moody.


    Season one was a bit mediocre.. but Kara was bright, she was happy. She was a superhero who didn't need dark drama to encourage her to save people, nor did she need to have extended training scenes as she learned her powers... Flash and Arrow took YEARS to become recognizable as Flash and Green Arrow.... but Kara was in full costume and flying and saving lives by the end of the pilot.

    It was SUCH a breath of Fresh Air.... now it's just as dark and moody and usually depressing high school drama as the rest of the CW.

    And yeah.. that was another problem with season 2 and 3.... That kind of high school drama is tolerated amongst random scientists and young adults on the OTHER shows... but by experienced aliens and top leading government agencies just felt... STUPID...
    Well the CW also focuses on the personal lives of the characters, including the heroes. We are supposed to care about them as people not just superheroes saving the world. Even the movies and comics show them as real people with real problems and desires (some more than others). The CW is geared for the young adults so the 'whiny drama' is part of it. Besides they don't have big budgets so they can't just show superheroics all the time. It's part of the package. My problem is when the writers don't do a good job at that part. When they don't write characters to care for and root for.

    And yes Mon-El was overall pretty useless in Season 2, but so was every male hero, because noone can be better or as amazing as Supergirl or even Alex... In this show girls are superior to men because they have an strong feminist agenda.

  6. #21
    Astonishing Member stargazer01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by superduperman View Post
    Guys, I just had a terrible thought last night. What if they are going to kill him off? Think about it. There's plenty of incentive. They don't want her in his shadow anymore and WB has invested a lot in the movies. I'm sure they're not happy when the show uses him.
    They better NOT do the Death of Superman yet again!! We've had plenty of stories about that recently.......... it's getting ridiculous..

    But if they kill him some other way, yeah, I don't mind. I'm not expecting him to be awesome or anything close because the writers always make sure to remind us that Kara is just better than him. I won't be surprised when Lois Lane also tells Kara just how amazing she is...

  7. #22
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    I'm REALLY looking forward to seeing Superman interact with the other heroes. Superman and Green Arrow in particular - especially given that this is a Superman who apparently knows Batman. It'll be interesting to see Clark say something like "You remind me of an old friend of mine" to Oliver and totally know how to deal with his broodiness because he's got experience.

    Lois Lane being part of the CW crossover is interesting as well, mainly because...well, I dunno how to explain it but the Arrowverse has always felt very much like an 'alternate DCU'. Its got DC characters, but they're very different from the comics or any 'classic' adaptation. The Flash is probably closest to the comics, and even its pretty different. Arrow feels like a very different beast to the comics, and LoT, well... But seeing Lois Lane, one of the most iconic DC characters ever, appearing in a CW crossover will just drive home the point that this IS a classic DC Universe story! Sure, it may have Green Arrow as a lethal vigilante who's married to Felicity Smoak. Sure, it may have Flash, Killer Frost and Vibe working together as a team. Sure, it may have Martian Manhunter as the head of DEO and Supergirl as one of its agents. But we've not only got Superman, but LOIS friggin' LANE as well - which gives this particular corner of the DC Multiverse some connective tissue with other more widely known DC adaptations and stories.

  8. #23
    Ultimate Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by superduperman View Post
    Guys, I just had a terrible thought last night. What if they are going to kill him off? Think about it. There's plenty of incentive. They don't want her in his shadow anymore and WB has invested a lot in the movies. I'm sure they're not happy when the show uses him.
    I could easily see it. WB/DC has absolutely no filter when it comes to Superman and the Death storyline. It would be that much of an added bonus to get to regurgitate that plot once again when the main goal would be to make Supergirl numero uno (not saying that in of itself is wrong, it is her show, she should be front and center).
    "They can be a great people Kal-El, they wish to be. They only lack the light to show the way. For this reason above all, their capacity for good, I have sent them you. My only son." - Jor-El

  9. #24
    Astonishing Member Dispenser Of Truth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by superduperman View Post
    Guys, I just had a terrible thought last night. What if they are going to kill him off? Think about it. There's plenty of incentive. They don't want her in his shadow anymore and WB has invested a lot in the movies. I'm sure they're not happy when the show uses him.
    I doubt it, given that would take so much focus off this being Batwoman's debut.
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  10. #25
    Ultimate Member Jackalope89's Avatar
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    I would like for Batwoman to come from Earth 38 personally. Would give that Earth another character to explore, and with Batman already there, it just makes sense.

  11. #26
    Death becomes you Osiris-Rex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sacred Knight View Post
    I could easily see it. WB/DC has absolutely no filter when it comes to Superman and the Death storyline. It would be that much of an added bonus to get to regurgitate that plot once again when the main goal would be to make Supergirl numero uno (not saying that in of itself is wrong, it is her show, she should be front and center).
    I doubt it. They like having Big Blue show up once in a while without taking too much away from Supergirl. I kind of think the CW would have liked to have Superman show up in season three but WB wouldn't allow it because
    of the Justice League movie. WB probably thought JL would be a big hit and they could use Superman more. But with no plans for a JL2 or a MoS2 anytime soon, Supergirl is free to use Superman for the next few years.
    I could even see Superman showing up a few more times this next season on Supergirl. Maybe Lois Lane too, with Kara and Lois working together on a big story.

  12. #27
    Astonishing Member phantom1592's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stargazer01 View Post
    Well the CW also focuses on the personal lives of the characters, including the heroes. We are supposed to care about them as people not just superheroes saving the world. Even the movies and comics show them as real people with real problems and desires (some more than others). The CW is geared for the young adults so the 'whiny drama' is part of it. Besides they don't have big budgets so they can't just show superheroics all the time. It's part of the package. My problem is when the writers don't do a good job at that part. When they don't write characters to care for and root for.
    This is the key here. I don't mind personal lives... in fact I'm always pushing for MORE supporting characters and secret ID stuff in the actual books. However, the Supergirl writers are just.... BAD at it. They have found a way to out-angst Arrow... Flash... and even Smallville. After the mindless crying and whining with the Alex/Maggie, Kara/Mon-el/Jimmy/Wynn and even J'onn/M'gann…. I was longing for the well written 'drama' of the Clark/Lana relationship of Smallville ;P



    Quote Originally Posted by stargazer01 View Post
    And yes Mon-El was overall pretty useless in Season 2, but so was every male hero, because noone can be better or as amazing as Supergirl or even Alex... In this show girls are superior to men because they have an strong feminist agenda.
    Honestly, It is SUPERGIRL'S show. And she's Kryptonian. I really have no issue with the idea that she's head and shoulders more amazing than anyone else on that show. As long as the characters act somewhat professional and realistic. The idea of Jimmy putting on some armor and thinking he can stand next to Kara is ridiculous. Alex... is just a terrible character. 90% of her character would be more believable if she was between a Junior in highschool and a freshman in college. The idea that she's #2 and sometimes #1 super agent of the DEO while throwing temper tantrums during epic alien invasions that her girlfriend isn't returning her calls just gives me brain pain. I just can't imagine Amanda Waller or Nick Fury having this kind of writing.


    Personally, there is a serious issue that CW has done with it's character/shows as it is. It's turned them all into teams. There needs to be a supporting cast of course... but it should always be the star's show. The show is called FLASH. and ARROW. and SUPERGIRL... Not FLASH/Kid Flash/Elongated Man/HR of the week/VIbe/Killer Frost and the Iris show... Too many people crammed into the shot and either everyone has to spread out the spotlight to the point it drags.... or the main character looks useless because he/she needs an army to tell the simple solutions.

    And yeah, there are enough complaints about the later seasons that I usually just skip the blatant agendas that they throw ALL the time... but yeah, that wears thin on me too.
    Last edited by phantom1592; 08-23-2018 at 03:28 PM.

  13. #28
    Incredible Member regg215's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stargazer01 View Post
    Season 2 I really liked! I loved the Kara/Mon-El romance.. I also thought Tyler Superman was pretty decent in the first episodes, but then the writers pretty much ruined his character in the season 2 finale when he declared Kara was a superior hero than him.. That was character assassination to me.
    .

    Yup, that was the most blatant character assassination I have seen on TV (for Superheros). He basically was brought on the show and existed in the Arrowverse as the show's way of saying "look Supergirl is better". I mean he gets trashed in an fight when he supposed to be the veteran Superman and she is still supposed to be learning. And then just to make sure that you don't in any way confuse that maybe Superman was feeling off during the fight or not going all out, they make him come out and grovel that Kara is better than him. Still can't believe DC did that to the guy who literally defines the entire genre. I get that they want to make Supergirl powerful and send an empowerment message and that's fine but using Superman as a ragdoll to elevate her was not the way to do that.
    "You know, there are some words I've known since I was a schoolboy: "With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably.. The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged"- CAPT. Picard

  14. #29
    Astonishing Member phantom1592's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by regg215 View Post
    Yup, that was the most blatant character assassination I have seen on TV (for Superheros). He basically was brought on the show and existed in the Arrowverse as the show's way of saying "look Supergirl is better". I mean he gets trashed in an fight when he supposed to be the veteran Superman and she is still supposed to be learning. And then just to make sure that you don't in any way confuse that maybe Superman was feeling off during the fight or not going all out, they make him come out and grovel that Kara is better than him. Still can't believe DC did that to the guy who literally defines the entire genre. I get that they want to make Supergirl powerful and send an empowerment message and that's fine but using Superman as a ragdoll to elevate her was not the way to do that.
    I could work with that. First of all, it was HER show. She really does need to WIN that fight... and he was mind controlled or something, so I can live with her winning.


    I also didn't have a problem with what he said.

    Superman: You okay?
    Supergirl: Of course. I did the right thing.
    Superman: I... think it goes far beyond the right thing. I couldn't have done it, Kara.
    Supergirl: You don't have to try to make me feel better.
    Superman: I'm not. I'm humbled by you. I'd like to think that if it came down to a choice between Lois and the world, but... I don't think I could. You are so much stronger than me. Stronger than I ever will be.


    I don't see anything false in that statement. I can't picture a situation where Superman would ever chose to abandon/kill/exile Lois to save the world. He wouldn't let that choice happen. He'd find a way to save both.... but if push comes to shove, I don't believe Clark can even fathom making that choice. It just doesn't process for him.

    I just can't picture Superman standing there with his hands on his hips saying "yeah, I would have done the same thing! Needs of the many over the needs of the few and all that!" Clark is just too humble for that. Even if he didn't really MEAN it. Even if he felt there SHOULD have been a way to save both... he wouldn't have said that Kara then and there. He's not a 'kick her when she's down' kind of guy.


    They could have handled the dialoge better. You can certainly take offense to the concept that Supergirl wins the day... but I really don't see a better way for this 'torchpassing' show to done this AND kept Clark humble and nice and heroic.

  15. #30
    Incredible Member regg215's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phantom1592 View Post
    I could work with that. First of all, it was HER show. She really does need to WIN that fight... and he was mind controlled or something, so I can live with her winning.


    I also didn't have a problem with what he said.

    Superman: You okay?
    Supergirl: Of course. I did the right thing.
    Superman: I... think it goes far beyond the right thing. I couldn't have done it, Kara.
    Supergirl: You don't have to try to make me feel better.
    Superman: I'm not. I'm humbled by you. I'd like to think that if it came down to a choice between Lois and the world, but... I don't think I could. You are so much stronger than me. Stronger than I ever will be.


    I don't see anything false in that statement. I can't picture a situation where Superman would ever chose to abandon/kill/exile Lois to save the world. He wouldn't let that choice happen. He'd find a way to save both.... but if push comes to shove, I don't believe Clark can even fathom making that choice. It just doesn't process for him.

    I just can't picture Superman standing there with his hands on his hips saying "yeah, I would have done the same thing! Needs of the many over the needs of the few and all that!" Clark is just too humble for that. Even if he didn't really MEAN it. Even if he felt there SHOULD have been a way to save both... he wouldn't have said that Kara then and there. He's not a 'kick her when she's down' kind of guy.


    They could have handled the dialoge better. You can certainly take offense to the concept that Supergirl wins the day... but I really don't see a better way for this 'torchpassing' show to done this AND kept Clark humble and nice and heroic.
    I completely get that the show was going to have Supergirl win the fight. At the end of the day it is intended for a female empowerment type audience and the show has basically set out to ensure that is the theme the show focuses on. Given how many male-centric shows there are, I get that there is a need for that. It may not be a show that I enjoy but I do know there are people out there who need a show like this and in that way I can't complain too much. My only real gripe is that is seemed like the only reason they brought clark on the show was to have him get beat down as a way to build up Kara and I absolutely hate that. The dialogue was cringe worthy in my opinion but I do agree that Clark certainly would say something close to what he said, Clark is always gonna be humble and compliment others, the whole "stronger than I ever will be" part was really what got me, kinda felt like the show was trying way to freaking hard to say "see even Superman admits that Kara is better than he is". In the end, I just think bringing on the character who is the reason the show even exists in the first place so that you can have him get whooped was a very poor choice.
    Last edited by regg215; 08-23-2018 at 09:02 PM.
    "You know, there are some words I've known since I was a schoolboy: "With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably.. The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged"- CAPT. Picard

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