Superman and Lois Lane are joining the CW Fall crossover

[stargazer01]

To me the CW Superman is already dead, so if they kill him for realz, I'll cheer.

[Dispenser Of Truth]

I can't really get onboard for the prospect that they'd break the 'embargo' and bring Superman back in a huge way, with a death that would be at best fighting for space, likely overshadowing entirely the debut of their new hero, all so that they WOULDN'T use him again, rather than just...not using him again, like they've been doing.

[superduperman]

From the very beginning, the Supergirl TV show has struggled with trying to make her the star while also trying to contrive ways around not involving her cousin, whose entire shtick is being the World's Greatest Hero. They failed miserably at this in the first season, but they tried to solve this in the second by finally introducing Superman. They did a pretty good job of giving audiences a fast-forwarded nugget of their close relationship at the start of the season, but then whiffed it in the finale by giving us a great fight scene, but one that did a disservice to Superman in order to maintain Supergirl as the main star, as she should be since the show isn't called "Superman".

For the third season, they went back to completely ignoring him, which again felt like a cheat, so it makes sense that they'd want to bring back Superman one last time to course correct and give the character one last big adventure in which he can finally interact with The Flash, Green Arrow and the rest, then take him off the table for good in a way that gives their protagonist, Kara, some real emotional hooks to play with. The fact that the death of Superman has been overplayed is unfortunate, but killing him off is really the Supergirl TV show's best option to dig themselves out of the narrative hole they keep getting stuck in.

Another option is that Superman leaves the Earth on some long odyssey in which he won't return for an extended period of time, perhaps into space, the 30th Century, or an alternate Earth in Crisis that will become sealed off from the rest of the CW Multiverse. Either way, Supergirl co-existing on the same Earth as her cousin is no longer tenable.

I certainly wouldn't mind if they sent him into space because at least then he'd still be alive. Plus, that's what I thought they should have done at the beginning of the series. Have him disappear and she has to take over for him. Two birds and one stone sort of thing. And he can always come back when the "embargo" is lifted. Or the series finale, whichever comes first. I'd still love to see him get his own series but I don't think we'll see one as long Supergirl is on the air.

[Clark_Kent]

Now that Walter Hamada is in charge it could be the rules are loosening up. We may never see Wonder Woman on TV until we do. Legends of Tomorrow did have a scene where Helen of Troy was taken to Themyscira.
Suicide Squad on Arrow was just a trail balloon to see if there was enough interest to make a Suicide Squad movie. In other word if WB wasn't considering a Suicide Squad movie, there might not have ever
been a Suicide Squad on Arrow in the first place. Once Suicide Squad served its purpose on Arrow, it was no longer needed on Arrow. It could well be the Deathstroke on Arrow served a similar purpose.
Or maybe Hamada will let Arrow use Deathstroke again after all. There was talk that we might not ever see Superman again on TV. And he was gone for the whole 3rd season of Supergirl because that was
when Justice League came out. Remember Superman was dead in the movies during Supergirl's second season. But here Superman is again, and on three shows, so probably not just a cameo.

That's not how these things work though, in reality. I can see how it could be perceived that way, but they don't use the shows to seed interest for movies. The television division and the film division are 2 seperate entities, and both divisions have to receive permission to use specific characters. But they definitely don't use one to seed interest for the other.

This is one of the reasons I think they might kill him off. WB's "condition" for getting to use him may only be if they get rid of him for good so they aren't competing with each other. Make no mistake, I like this Superman and prefer it over the current movies. And would LOVE to see him get a new TV show ala Lois & Clark. But movies make more money than TV shows do and WB really needs the new movie-verse to work to compete with Marvel. If they have to choose, it's not that hard to figure out which one will get the axe.

Now, I don't necessarily see the two versions as "competing" with each other but WB might. People who don't like the movie version won't go see it. Which is kind of the situation they have now. This is sort of like saying a cartoon version and a live action version are "competing" with each other. They're two different formats. That having been said, I don't see him getting his own show anytime soon. At least not while Supergirl is still on the air.

WB definitely sees it that way, due to the seperate divisions. They want both divisions to make maximum profit, and if one side completely destroys a character then it affects the other side. So you don't want Batman showing up on television because if he comes off cheesy, or silly, or just plain unlikeable or too low-budget, that could affect his big screen box office. It might affect it minimally, but the studio won't sacrifice any amount no matter how minimal. That's what I meant by 'competing'. Having said that, I do agree with most posters here & I personally wouldn't mind tv versions of most characters alongside movie versions. But I just want to bring a little light on how it works for the studio so everyone can be a little better informed.

[stargazer01]

The way I see it is, why go watch Superman on the big screen when you can watch him on TV every week? And what if that TV Superman is very popular? I just don't think it works having two versions going at the same time. Smallville was about younger Clark kinda like the show Gotham.

You need to make people and fans hungry for more. I'm talking about live action. Animation is a whole other thing.

Can you imagine having a TV Wonder Woman show and the movies at the same time (live action)? I don't think WB would do it. It creates division. Same way with Superman. I wish he was never in Supergirl, and if he was, he was just a cameo and written different like the real hero he is not a lesser version to prop up Kara. That's just wrong and does a disservice to the First and Greatest hero ever. It also shows insecurity in the writters and poor imagination. I can't understand how a big Superman fan could tolerate that and keep watching that Supergirl show that destroys their fave character.

[Osiris-Rex]

The way I see it is, why go watch Superman on the big screen when you can watch him on TV every week? And what if that TV Superman is very popular? I just don't think it works having two versions going at the same time. Smallville was about younger Clark kinda like the show Gotham.

You need to make people and fans hungry for more. I'm talking about live action. Animation is a whole other thing.

Can you imagine having a TV Wonder Woman show and the movies at the same time (live action)? I don't think WB would do it. It creates division. Same way with Superman. I wish he was never in Supergirl, and if he was, he was just a cameo and written different like the real hero he is not a lesser version to prop up Kara. That's just wrong and does a disservice to the First and Greatest hero ever. It also shows insecurity in the writters and poor imagination. I can't understand how a big Superman fan could tolerate that and keep watching that Supergirl show that destroys their fave character.

Simple. A lot of people like the CW version of Superman. A lot of people like him more than the DCEU version. He is more fun loving, caring, heroic, mature, and every bit as tough and hard nosed when the scene calls for it.
Like the scene where he took on J'onn over kryptonite. And won, getting the DEO to give him all their kryptonite. You have to keep in mind not everyone hates Supergirl and they enjoy seeing cousins interact in a loving way.
She loves him and he loves her and Superman is proud of Supergirl, admires her, and wants to see her succeed. People respond to that version instead of the grumpy, sad, loner version that we got in the movies up until
towards the end of Justice League.

[Sacred Knight]

Lois Lane is actually a tougher sell for me when it comes to casting than Superman is. I always worry most when it comes to casting her. I've loved only one live-action incarnation of Lois, and that was Erica Durance. I've had issues with every other, be it movie or tv. I don't know why, my expectations there just always end up higher (and admittedly probably too tough) than Superman/Clark Kent.

[Osiris-Rex]

Originally Posted by Osiris-Rex View Post
Now that Walter Hamada is in charge it could be the rules are loosening up. We may never see Wonder Woman on TV until we do. Legends of Tomorrow did have a scene where Helen of Troy was taken to Themyscira.
Suicide Squad on Arrow was just a trail balloon to see if there was enough interest to make a Suicide Squad movie. In other word if WB wasn't considering a Suicide Squad movie, there might not have ever
been a Suicide Squad on Arrow in the first place. Once Suicide Squad served its purpose on Arrow, it was no longer needed on Arrow. It could well be the Deathstroke on Arrow served a similar purpose.
Or maybe Hamada will let Arrow use Deathstroke again after all. There was talk that we might not ever see Superman again on TV. And he was gone for the whole 3rd season of Supergirl because that was
when Justice League came out. Remember Superman was dead in the movies during Supergirl's second season. But here Superman is again, and on three shows, so probably not just a cameo.

That's not how these things work though, in reality. I can see how it could be perceived that way, but they don't use the shows to seed interest for movies. The television division and the film division are 2 seperate entities, and both divisions have to receive permission to use specific characters. But they definitely don't use one to seed interest for the other.
.

Except in the case of Suicide Squad on Arrow that is precisely how it worked.

The Suicide Squad made their theatrical debut early last month, but it wasn't the first time the team of super villain operatives got to play around in live action. Along with appearing in goo Season 10, the Squad was introduced in the second half of Arrow Season 2, and it looked like the team was being prepped to have a recurring presence on the Emerald Archer's show. That didn't end up happening, and now we've learned that the main reason the Suicide Squad was added to Arrow in the first place was to test how they would fare on the big screen.
When asked whether DC Comics president Geoff Johns has ever approached him about "trying out a character" on TV to see how they would to in the movies, Arrow executive producer Greg Berlanti told Vulture that including the Suicide Squad in Arrow Season 2 was an example of such a request. Sometimes, or he has other executives mention that to us. They said to us a year and a half before they started developing Suicide Squad, 'Will you guys put [a version of] the Suicide Squad in your show? Because we want to have it as a film at some point.'

https://www.cinemablend.com/news/155...-suicide-squad

[phantom1592]

I agree.

Honestly, I don't think the 'embargo' is such a big deal anymore. In the unlikely event that we ever get a Superman TV series, I seriously doubt it will affect the development of a Superman movie (the other way round is MUCH likelier!) But I think appearances on TV are likely to be less of an issue moving forward.

Yeah.... what the rules were during the smallville years shouldn't be taken as gospel NOW... nor should the rules of 2000, 2010, or even 2016.

WB makes the rules and they decide what they will and won't allow... and while they may have their own guidelines, they're also fine with bending, breaking or changing their minds. The overall collapse of DCEU SHOULD cause them to rethink abandoning money in the bank for hopes and dreams that something ELSE will suddenly be huge.

[Agent Z]

The way I see it is, why go watch Superman on the big screen when you can watch him on TV every week? And what if that TV Superman is very popular? I just don't think it works having two versions going at the same time. Smallville was about younger Clark kinda like the show Gotham.

You need to make people and fans hungry for more. I'm talking about live action. Animation is a whole other thing.

Can you imagine having a TV Wonder Woman show and the movies at the same time (live action)? I don't think WB would do it. It creates division. Same way with Superman. I wish he was never in Supergirl, and if he was, he was just a cameo and written different like the real hero he is not a lesser version to prop up Kara. That's just wrong and does a disservice to the First and Greatest hero ever. It also shows insecurity in the writters and poor imagination. I can't understand how a big Superman fan could tolerate that and keep watching that Supergirl show that destroys their fave character.

No it won't. All it means is that there's something for everyone. If the movie Superman isn't your thing, try the tv version and vice versa. Having two version means more options and wider audiences that you can't reach with only one version.

And no, the Supergirl tv show is not destroying Superman. That's so hyperbolic it almost comes across as funny. Losing one fight won't damage his character. If it could, then he's not as great as we think he is and I like to believe Superman is better than that.

[phantom1592]

The way I see it is, why go watch Superman on the big screen when you can watch him on TV every week? And what if that TV Superman is very popular? I just don't think it works having two versions going at the same time. Smallville was about younger Clark kinda like the show Gotham.

You need to make people and fans hungry for more. I'm talking about live action. Animation is a whole other thing.

Animation is arguably better. No budget constraints. No special effects and safety concerns.

There has never really been a time where there was only ONE version of a character on tv. We've always had TV, movies and Animation running together. Smallville and Justice League unlimited ran at the same time as Batman Begins and superman returns. Ruby Speares Superman ran at the same time as 80's Superman movies did. Disney Marvel has CONSTANTLY had Avengers and Spider-man cartoons as long as the MCU has been running.


Not to mention all the massive amounts of Direct to DVD they do now.

People aren't complete idiots. They can understand that a movie is or is not based on the TV show. They may not LIKE it... they may prefer one or the other... but there shouldn't be any confusion... or any real conflict between the two. What's more valuable? A questionable movie that shows up for 3 weeks every 3 years... or 7-10 seasons of a long running show that hits rerun status and lives forever?


Adam West and Lynda Carter were showing reruns for 30 years creating new fans and drawing them into the world of DC. Limiting exposure to characters like this??? It's bad marketing.

[Clark_Kent]

Except in the case of Suicide Squad on Arrow that is precisely how it worked.



https://www.cinemablend.com/news/155...-suicide-squad

Yep, you are right. There's always an exception to the rule, and Geoff Johns (who was overseeing live action for both divisions) made the request. My larger point still stands though: what happened as soon as they were full steam ahead on the movie? The characters were removed from the television show.

Animation is arguably better. No budget constraints. No special effects and safety concerns.

There has never really been a time where there was only ONE version of a character on tv. We've always had TV, movies and Animation running together. Smallville and Justice League unlimited ran at the same time as Batman Begins and superman returns. Ruby Speares Superman ran at the same time as 80's Superman movies did. Disney Marvel has CONSTANTLY had Avengers and Spider-man cartoons as long as the MCU has been running.


Not to mention all the massive amounts of Direct to DVD they do now.

People aren't complete idiots. They can understand that a movie is or is not based on the TV show. They may not LIKE it... they may prefer one or the other... but there shouldn't be any confusion... or any real conflict between the two. What's more valuable? A questionable movie that shows up for 3 weeks every 3 years... or 7-10 seasons of a long running show that hits rerun status and lives forever?


Adam West and Lynda Carter were showing reruns for 30 years creating new fans and drawing them into the world of DC. Limiting exposure to characters like this??? It's bad marketing.

It's not really about confusing the audience, but about watering down your product. Batman & Wonder Woman are money makers, and they don't appear on television because if your audiencecan get them for "free", they won't often pay extra to go see them elsewhere. It's the same reason why Disney is so selective on the use of Mickey Mouse; you can't water your brand down to the point people don't care anymore.

Allowing Superman on television in live action means WB doesn't care about him on the big screen. If they didn't mind competing versions of marquee characters, we'd already have a WW series and a Harley Quinn series in development (animation is different, but notice the HQ cartoon is being kept in-house for the DC streaming service).

Anyway, this is how things have always been at WB, and hopefully Hamada will change that. Much too soon to tell, though.

[daBronzeBomma]

The pessimistic side of me can see exactly how they will "pull from the comics" for Tyler Hoechlin Superman's interactions with the other 3 CW crossover shows:

THE FLASH: "Clark, that race was just for charity" (proceeds to hopelessly race past him).

ARROW: "I want you to remember in your most private moments, my hand at your throat, as the man you beat you" (confrontation with a kryptonite arrow).

SUPERGIRL: "I'll avenge your hilariously incompetent death, Kal" (Ok, that one isn't pulled from the comics, but seems about right for the level of nuance from that show).

The CW has lost all benefit of the doubt when it comes to their Superman.

[Osiris-Rex]

The pessimistic side of me can see exactly how they will "pull from the comics" for Tyler Hoechlin Superman's interactions with the other 3 CW crossover shows:

THE FLASH: "Clark, that race was just for charity" (proceeds to hopelessly race past him).

ARROW: "I want you to remember in your most private moments, my hand at your throat, as the man you beat you" (confrontation with a kryptonite arrow).

SUPERGIRL: "I'll avenge your hilariously incompetent death, Kal" (Ok, that one isn't pulled from the comics, but seems about right for the level of nuance from that show).

The CW has lost all benefit of the doubt when it comes to their Superman.

Best live action Superman since Christopher Reeve.

[Miles To Go]

Elizabeth Tulloch cast as Lois



https://www.eonline.com/news/968457/...erse-crossover