Possible Solution to the SMWW / Clois Division?

[Miles To Go]

I honestly see nothing that indicates that Superman/Wonder Woman was bigger than Batman/Wonder Woman before the New 52.

It's had a lingering presence amongst fandom dating back to the Silver Age through Imaginary Stories and eventually into post-crisis when Diana was crushing on Clark, but to be fair, that was only because Steve Trevor had been taken off the table by Perez who foolishly thought the character made Diana "weak", and it took thirty years for Steve to be brought back to prominence.

In those thirty years, DC pushed Diana and Clark's bond hard, even after Clark moved on and married Lois, Diana was still trying to muscle in (which I don't think was the right move at all, as it just made Diana look like a potential homewrecker). It's not hard to see that, when the time came to restore and to evolve the traditional ways, they had to diminish the level of Diana's feelings towards Clark so as to ensure she dare not get in the way of his happiness with Lois and Jon. You can't give Clark and Diana the same kind of flirtatious friendship anymore with a family involved, it just looks ugly. Alternate Universes are your only option

[kjn]

Sorry, just "no" to the OP.

Superman x Wonder Woman is a fine idea for Elseworlds or A.U. stories, but just unworkable for main canon incarnations of each character. Same deal with Batman x Wonder Woman.

You can't intermix your 3 biggest I.P.s to that extent without screwing one of those alpha characters over (and let's be real: Diana will almost certainly be the "screwee" in either scenario).

D.C. will always be better off with each of the Trinity going with their respective beta partners: Lois Lane, Selina Kyle, and Steve Trevor.

Yep. Also, I'd say that any attempt to canonically ship Wonder Woman and either Superman or Batman runs into the issue why a "true" representation of Wonder Woman would be interested in, or get out of, a romantic relationship with either. She's even more a career woman than Lois Lane, and poses even more challenges to Batman's rigid morality than Catwoman does (Hekateia by Rucka and Joy Ride by Brubaker are interesting in how they critique Batman's view of justice).

Another take on this is that arguably it's not Superman who is looking for a partner, it's Clark Kent who is looking for one. Being together with Wonder Woman pretty much locks him into his Superman role all the time.

[Armor of God]

It's had a lingering presence amongst fandom dating back to the Silver Age through Imaginary Stories and eventually into post-crisis when Diana was crushing on Clark, but to be fair, that was only because Steve Trevor had been taken off the table by Perez who foolishly thought the character made Diana "weak", and it took thirty years for Steve to be brought back to prominence.

In those thirty years, DC pushed Diana and Clark's bond hard, even after Clark moved on and married Lois, Diana was still trying to muscle in (which I don't think was the right move at all, as it just made Diana look like a potential homewrecker). It's not hard to see that, when the time came to restore and to evolve the traditional ways, they had to diminish the level of Diana's feelings towards Clark so as to ensure she dare not get in the way of his happiness with Lois and Jon. You can't give Clark and Diana the same kind of flirtatious friendship anymore with a family involved, it just looks ugly. Alternate Universes are your only option

But that still doesn't really answer my question. Dini for instance tried to push Batman/Zatanna as well, writers will go for whatever they want. Some day another person will write their own take on Superman/Wonder Woman and there's nothing wrong about it but in the case of the New 52 Didio and Lee went all in which they never did for Batman/Zatanna or Flash/Wonder Woman, etc. That's what I'm getting at, it was a fringe group which they brought to the mainstream. Give Zatanna or Diana's relationships with Batman an equal push and I'd guarantee they'd have far more fans than they did before the push.

[superduperman]

I've said before I think New 52 should get it's own continuity separate from the mainstream universe. And there are plenty of "loopholes" to exploit to do that with. That crossover they did with Masters of the Universe a few years back doesn't appear to be canon. Ditto that video game, Infinite Crisis, that used the New 52 versions of the DCU. Neither one of those are canon so you could have an ongoing that takes place in either one of those universes. So it's not like the New 52 isn't still out there in some form or another.

[Ascended]

I don't think there's enough interest to support a alt-universe version where Clark and Diana being together is the main purpose of the title. Even if there was, that doesn't strike me as a great reason to publish a book when there are many better, more interesting ideas worth exploring.

Personally, I'd just say that Clark and Diana dated briefly, years ago, shortly after the League was formed. Some slightly modified version of their New52 history took place and they both eventually realized they weren't feeling it, had a respectful, mutually agreed upon break-up, and moved on to their respective partners in Lois and Steve.

This way, you can go back to that relationship via flashback scenes if you want to play with it, but it's not competing for Super-fans dollars against the main continuity.

[Lokimaru]

I don't think there's enough interest to support a alt-universe version where Clark and Diana being together is the main purpose of the title. Even if there was, that doesn't strike me as a great reason to publish a book when there are many better, more interesting ideas worth exploring.

Personally, I'd just say that Clark and Diana dated briefly, years ago, shortly after the League was formed. Some slightly modified version of their New52 history took place and they both eventually realized they weren't feeling it, had a respectful, mutually agreed upon break-up, and moved on to their respective partners in Lois and Steve.

This way, you can go back to that relationship via flashback scenes if you want to play with it, but it's not competing for Super-fans dollars against the main continuity.

To me the need of the "human" love interest is so retro, a hold over from a time when comicbook characters were separate entities in there own self contained universes. The Advent of the Shared universe means just that SHARED. One hand washes the other. How many times has Clark turtled up to protect his own little slice of Heaven whilst the world around him burned? How many times have Heroes been out on a limb when help is only supposed to be a few cities away and has Superspeed? New 52 was a truly Shared Universe where anyone could interact with anyone without an Event going on or "Guest" appearance.

[Miles To Go]

To me the need of the "human" love interest is so retro, a hold over from a time when comicbook characters were separate entities in there own self contained universes. The Advent of the Shared universe means just that SHARED.

We still have a shared world, but not everyone is interested in gods constantly meeting up and relying on one another exclusively. That's rigid and boring. They want to relate to struggles with the everyman or woman, characters that can ground those high and mighty beings so they don't lose their way.

[Superlad93]

I'd argue that it's probably a bit more shared now than it was. Snyder's Justice League/No Justice, Bendis' Superman/Action Comics, King's Batman, and Williamson's Flash are all super shared. King has Batman causally telling Clark to look after his kids without there being any indication that Superman would be in the issue. Bendis has had the whole Justice League show up in at least 5 different issues of his run. Plus, he'll apparently be adding Earth to the galactic conversation via his Superman book. And Snyder and Williamson are literally interducing new fundamental concepts to the whole DCU that everyone will be/has been using.

That's not even mentioning how fantastically interconnected the events like Metal and Doomsday Clock have been.

[Last Son of Krypton]

Yeah, the DCU is more interconnected post-Rebirth. During the New 52, writers were left to do their own thing without communicating much with each other, not to mention the loose continuity of the failed DC-You era.

[stargazer01]

It's had a lingering presence amongst fandom dating back to the Silver Age through Imaginary Stories and eventually into post-crisis when Diana was crushing on Clark, but to be fair, that was only because Steve Trevor had been taken off the table by Perez who foolishly thought the character made Diana "weak", and it took thirty years for Steve to be brought back to prominence.

In those thirty years, DC pushed Diana and Clark's bond hard, even after Clark moved on and married Lois, Diana was still trying to muscle in (which I don't think was the right move at all, as it just made Diana look like a potential homewrecker). It's not hard to see that, when the time came to restore and to evolve the traditional ways, they had to diminish the level of Diana's feelings towards Clark so as to ensure she dare not get in the way of his happiness with Lois and Jon. You can't give Clark and Diana the same kind of flirtatious friendship anymore with a family involved, it just looks ugly. Alternate Universes are your only option

Or the future. After Lois dies and Clark is single again, I love the idea of him and Diana coming together and start (or re-start) a new romantic relationship that begins as closer friends and ends in love.

As long as it's well written, I like the idea of seeing Superman with someone else in his life.

[Miles To Go]

Or the future. After Lois dies and Clark is single again

Did you read Action Comics#1000? There's a story in there by Tom King which reveals Lois takes a serum that extends her life a billion years so she can run an intergalactic news station and continue to live alongside Clark and Jon (Clark remarks that she hates the taste of it)

And then there's DC One Million, where Lois has died and many centuries later Clark ultimately recreates Lois to be with him again

[Last Son of Krypton]

Did you read Action Comics#1000? There's a story in there by Tom King which reveals Lois takes a serum that extends her life a billion years so she can run an intergalactic news station and continue to live alongside Clark and Jon (Clark remarks that she hates the taste of it)

It was written by King, so Clark was probably hallucinating because of PTSD.

[Miles To Go]

It was written by King, so Clark was probably hallucinating because of PTSD.

Given Lois just spent a few months travelling across the Universe with Jor-El and Jon, it's entirely possible she probably already has this serum

[Last Son of Krypton]

Given Lois just spent a few months travelling across the Universe with Jor-El and Jon, it's entirely possible she probably already has this serum

I don't think that most of the stories in AC 1000 were meant to be in continuity, but headcanons exist for some reason.

[Miles To Go]

I don't think that most of the stories in AC 1000 were meant to be in continuity, but headcanons exist for some reason.

Nothing directly said they weren't in continuity...and Jon was featured and mentioned in some of them.

Ok, yeah, there's the niggle with frigging Deathstroke at the Superman appreciation rally that made people wince, but the one-shots that tied up Jurgens on Action established that story counted