Storm >>> APPRECIATION <<<

[BBeeryan]

yea I'm not convinced that had she stayed with Claremont she would be doing anything of value. after the marriage the xoffices said they had big plans for storm and if by big plans they meant reduce her to showings in ivx then they kept their promises. hudlin can't be blamed for ultimately where storm is now because the xoffices have had 5 or so years to make storm an integral part of the xlore with hudlin not being an excuse. during schism who was shown being the ones taking charge: Cyclops and wolverine. after schism who was shown as the headmaster of the Xavier institute Logan. when storm finally took the reigns with the exception of a few writers, she was shown as unsure and afraid to take a stand when she had every right to do so.

so could storm be a different place now... yea but I'm not sure it would be a better one. look at all those major players who did stay and where they are now:

cyclops: dead
jean: dead
emma: bat-sh!t crazy, villain
wolverine: dead
xavier: dead

however we do know the xoffices had had several years to make storm relevant and they have failed miserably. she gets back in the bp mythos and in a span of a few months she has he her ties to Harlem and black causes explored, she is saving nations from destruction, and something Claremont can't even say was shown as an actual goddess. there is simply no excuse for the poor handling of her character and if the xoffices had any intention of doing anything earth shattering with the character they would have done so.

While I'm here I figured I'd quote this for the sheer, unadulterated truth!

[butterflykyss]

Hard to disagree with this posts. But I'd like to add that during that time a writer being made to give up a character was total BS as far as Storm is concerned. Wolverine and Deadpool can hope all over the universe and no one bats an eye. But when it comes to Storm, "oh, she must be written out of this book to give her freely to this book". It is such malarkey.

thank you thank you! and say it again!! it's complete and utter BS! They didn't use her cause they didn't want to.

[yogaflame]

They should be but they never have been drawn that way... Why start now?

"Never" is not true. Every once in a while they are. I just take it as an artifact of the medium(which outlines most everything in black lines). Did all those people really have blue hair, or did it just get colored that way to represent black hair?

[rutog98]

A couple points:

Claremont didn't write Giant Sized X-Men, where Storm is first introduced and recruited by Charles. That was written by Len Wein and penciled by Dave Cockrum. All of Storm's classic origins as an American born, orphan thief in Cairo and such was added by Claremont in the following years after her debut. Wein and Cockrum actually wanted her to be an immortal goddess from the start, with no American birth or parentage. But they only had her for that debut issue and Claremont took over thereafter.

Claremont did take over Storm for X-Treme X-Men in the early 00's. Had he not taken her, Storm would have had Emma's role in New X-Men as Morrison wanted her and Cyke to have an affair and all that(and Colossus would have been in there too, but he had just recently been killed and they wouldn't let him resurrect him, so Emma got her diamond form to fill that spot too). While it might have been interesting to see Storm under Morrison and firmly entrenched in the modern X-Lore to come, I loved X-Treme and it had lots of great moments for Ororo under Claremont. X-Treme ended and that cast was taken back to Uncanny as the XSE and had a few arcs before Marvel made Claremont let go of Storm so she could go over to BP which was being re-tooled under Hudlin.

Hudlin was in charge of BET and the time and promised Marvel he'd get Black Panther on television if he got to have Storm too(which actually never materialized in America). So Storm was married off to BP(also clearing the way for Cyke and Emma to be the leaders of the X-Men in this new era), kinda out of no where(yes, they already had some Claremont and Priest canon). Storm went from being the leader of her own UN-sanctioned team to BP's wife and queen of Wakanda. Yes, there were some nice scenes like Ororo chewing out Tony Stark during the Civil War Registration Act stuff, but there was also scenes of Storm being written down so as to not overshadow T'Challa(like in their visits to Latveria, Atlantis and Attilan).

Personally, the Hudlin era for Storm wasn't that helpful. Storm was sidelined from the X-Men during their most crushing storylines(No More Mutants, Messiah Complex, etc, etc), and really didn't make that big of a splash in BP's canon either. McDuffie did add some nice feats during their brief FF run, but overall, it was a side-quest, and when AvX happened, Storm did choose her X-Fam in the end and BP annulled their marriage(which was handled on panel in a horrible manner, in the several versions that were printed).

Now, in the post-marriage era, Storm has had to rebuild her significance to the X-Mythos, and it has largely been a failure, culminating with the IvX storyline and her abdication of leadership to Kitty which leads us to the current situation in Gold(where Storm is a complete non-factor).

So, while it is nice to see Storm getting some story beats in Coates BP now, it's interesting to see the whole 10-15 year track in terms of the behind the scenes power plays and creators, and wonder at how things might be if x happened instead of y, and so forth.

You have some excellent points in this post. One thing I would like to point out, though, is Claremont did state in an interview that Storm was a 3-dimensional goddess. Then we saw her ascend to goddesshood in the Roguestorm arc spanning from Uncanny X-Men 145-147. What I can really appreciate about Coates is he is taking this whole "goddess" aspect of the character that has been there from the start and is finally building on it. The problem is, I seriously doubt the x-writers are going to continue with this development once Coates is no longer with Marvel. I see them do things like trying to prop up Jeen even at the expense of other characters (she recently TK hit Galactus in a PIS story that drastically wrote down the planet devourer for her to do that). I have a nagging suspicion that the x- office probably wants Storm scaled back to make Jeen the number 1 eventhough Ororo is far more powerful than she when Storm isn't being written down. Its a problem that has always been there. I'll explain more below (I've ranted on this before, but I'm gonna do it again...so sue me!):

When Storm first went into outter space, she was able to control the solar wind and use those forces to generate an attack backed by the full power of a star. A few issues later, when the rocket the team was traveling in was assaulted by a solar flare, Storm was scaled back in order for the Phoenix Force Jean Grey thing to happen. Given what Storm had done in an earlier issue, she should have been able to take control of the solar flare and either move it away from the team or simply disperse it. Furthermore, it wasn't until after Phoenix Force Jean Grey died that Storm's character development building her mental defenses against telepathy began in Uncanny 151-152. This was something that was constantly developed for the remainder of Claremont's initial run. Ororo's willpower grew to the extent that is surpassed everyone else's and no single telepath could prevail against her mental defenses. On top of this, we see Storm once more controlling cosmic forces with PF Jean Grey no longer on the team in the "Brood Saga".

After this, when Jean was brought back into the fold, all of a sudden, Storm's metal defenses were ignored. Till this day, no writer, even Chris Claremont, has ever given Storm her mental defenses when Jean was on the roster. Not one time has Storm kept a telepath out of her mind while Jean was on the team. However, when Jean is taken off the team, Storm gets her mental defenses back. Claremont, Alan Davis, Chris Yost, Hudlin, McDuffie, Coates, and the guy who wrote "Wolverine and the X-Men" where Storm was headmistress of the school all wrote Storm with her defenses when Jean was not on the team.

I used to make the excuse that maybe Storm was scaled back over the last few years because the writers were not creative and Storm's powers could easily deal with any threat the X-Men face. Not only this, but she can easily overshadow the rest of the team. I have changed my mind on this theory, though, when looking at what is going on with Jeen and what Guggenheim seems to be doing with Rachel based on that story where she saves the team from sentinels. It seems to me the office wants to prop up Jean and lessen Storm who would be a threat to Jeen's position as the top X-Man. I can't help but wonder if there is a racist element to this. If Storm were white, dollars to donuts they would have explored her goddess thing a long time ago and she would have been labelled an omega mutant or omega plus from day 1. That brings me to my last point: Omega Mutants.

Originally, omega mutants were those who had the potential to rival even the major abstract entities of the MU. In other words, if these mutants reached their full potential, the would be able to go toe-to-toe with an abstract. These were characters who potentially wielded unlimited power. Originally, Jean would have fit in this category because she had the potential to host the Phoenix Force, something only a few other characters could do at the time. So, with the power of the Phoenix Force, she would be able to fight an abstract since the PF is an abstract cosmic entity. This however, should be nullified since now anybody can serve as host to the PF.

The other character, Iceman, who was labelled an omega on day 1 was pure PIS. This guy's powerset includes the ability to remove heat from his target spot (he likely shunts the heat off to another dimension...at least, that's my theory), ice and water control, transform into ice, and merge his consciousness with bodies of water. Its a strong powerset, but nowhere near strong enough to fight characters like Galactus and other abstracts. Anybody with powerful control over the power cosmic and anyone who can control matter at the sub-atomic level (ala Sersi) could cream him in a fight. His powerset is no defense against such attacks.

Meanwhile, Storm, who was intended to be a goddess from day 1 under Len's pen and who was given power to rival that of Phoenix Force Jean Grey under CC's pen was overlooked to be an omega. Her powerset is the ability to percieve the universe as patterns of energy and forces she can bend to her will. This was established early on. The POTENTIAL applications of her powerset easily competes with that of the Phoenix Force and is leaps and bounds ahead of Bobby's, yet Iceman gets labelled an omega and Storm is just an alpha alongside people like Cyclops and Wolverine? I would not be surprised if this was done again to prop up Jean. Call me paranoid if you want, but this is a theme with Ororo when it comes to the redhead.

As things stand right now, I think Ororo should be labelled an Omega-Plus mutant alongside Franklin Richards and Selene (thanks to "Necrosha"). This should be the class of mutants who can potentially match and beat the Cosmic Abstracts in battle. Jean should not be in this category since its nothing special anymore to be host to the PF.

Underneath this class should be the omegas. Jean, Emma, Iceman, Magneto, Apocalypse, Sinister, Bishop, and Exodus should be in this class of mutants.

Underneath them should be the Alphas. In this group should be Cyclops, Wolverine, and Banshee with Polaris being on the border between Alpha and Omega class.

Anyway, bottom line is, when Coates leaves Marvel, the development he gave us with Storm with be forgotten in the dustpan of history by other writers. I have outlined in this post why I think it will be ignored...

End of rant!

PS. I don't have a problem with Marvel making other characters powerful and giving them their moments to shine, I just don't want Storm held back for other characters. Give Ororo her due!

[yogaflame]

I'm not saying the X-office couldn't have done better. I'm just saying the BP-office isn't faultless either. And really, in the grander sense of things, you have to look at the big picture. At the end of the day, Storm's film license is with Fox, and Marvel wasn't going to give her that much to do anyways. It's not like she'll get to be in BP's film(s). So enjoy her now in BP, but once that movie hits in February, things should get interesting.

[yogaflame]

There is definitely a racist element to how Storm has been used over the years and in other media. And yes, as long as Jean is around in any various incarnations, Storm will most likely not attain her highest potential in the X-Lore.

[butterflykyss]

I'm not saying the X-office couldn't have done better. I'm just saying the BP-office isn't faultless either. And really, in the grander sense of things, you have to look at the big picture. At the end of the day, Storm's film license is with Fox, and Marvel wasn't going to give her that much to do anyways. It's not like she'll get to be in BP's film(s). So enjoy her now in BP, but once that movie hits in February, things should get interesting.

i dont think anyone is delusional to not understand all that is at play. but just like I tell those fans of BP that it is getting old all the resentment towards storm about things that happened after the marriage, the same is true for storm fans who hold this grudge against hudlin as if he is the reason why storm is being written shotty. No hudlin has been gone and storm from the bp mythos way too long for people to be holding any ill-feelings towards hudlin as it pertains to her treatment by the xoffices now. if he was the demise of whatever happened while he had her, what's the excuse now that she is back with the xoffices and hudlin is gone?

what is happening with storm in the xbooks have nothing to do with fox and marvel either. there again is the problem. instead of acknowledging the truth that the x-offices just don't give a crap about her, people point to things that don't really mean much of anything. I'm thankful Coates has Storm for now but as I've said in other places I'm enjoying the ride. it's better than anything I have seen in the xside in years and that's including her solo. I still love u pak.. just saying

[butterflykyss]

There is definitely a racist element to how Storm has been used over the years and in other media. And yes, as long as Jean is around in any various incarnations, Storm will most likely not attain her highest potential in the X-Lore.

it isn't a coincidence the times she has shown at her best have been with people of color (Coates, Harvey, willow, mcduffie, hudlin, to name a few).

[rutog98]

There is definitely a racist element to how Storm has been used over the years and in other media. And yes, as long as Jean is around in any various incarnations, Storm will most likely not attain her highest potential in the X-Lore.

Tell me about it! Instead of exploring all of these aspects of Ororo's character that are still largely unchartered and full of potential stories that can surpass the greatness of even the original Dark Phoenix Saga, all the writers want to do is rehash that same old Grey/Summer stories from the 70s/80s. We keep getting stories about the Phoenix Force (which hasn't been unique to the Grey clan in decades ever since Excalibur opened it up so that there have been others to serve as its host...and now anybody can host it as of AvX), family members from the past, future, and alternate timelines, evil clones of various family members, and time traveling. Its old and its tired. Its as if Marvel is just looking for ways to try and avoid developing Ororo.

Then, when it comes time to do something for Ororo, they throw us a small, dried out bone by writing a story with the Morlocks. That is a well of stories long run dry and its not as if you have any powerful threats coming at Storm from their ranks. They are a bunch of weaklings. That's why they live in the sewers. If they were powerful, it wouldn't matter if they were ugly. They would be trying to take over the world for shunning them.

[butterflykyss]

Tell me about it! Instead of exploring all of these aspects of Ororo's character that are still largely unchartered and full of potential stories that can surpass the greatness of even the original Dark Phoenix Saga, all the writers want to do is rehash that same old Grey/Summer stories from the 70s/80s. We keep getting stories about the Phoenix Force (which hasn't been unique to the Grey clan in decades ever since Excalibur opened it up so that there have been others to serve as its host...and now anybody can host it as of AvX), family members from the past, future, and alternate timelines, evil clones of various family members, and time traveling. Its old and its tired. Its as if Marvel is just looking for ways to try and avoid developing Ororo.

Then, when it comes time to do something for Ororo, they throw us a small, dried out bone by writing a story with the Morlocks. That is a well of stories long run dry and its not as if you have any powerful threats coming at Storm from their ranks. They are a bunch of weaklings. That's why they live in the sewers. If they were powerful, it wouldn't matter if they were ugly. They would be trying to take over the world for shunning them.

i was Low key kinda disappointed on the solo. I'm like I'm tired of callisto and yukio can kick rocks honestly lol

[ZNOP]

"Never" is not true. Every once in a while they are. I just take it as an artifact of the medium(which outlines most everything in black lines). Did all those people really have blue hair, or did it just get colored that way to represent black hair?

Then you can point to at least one book (title and issue please) that emphatically shows Ororo drawn with white eyebrows -- if such an issue exists then I'm sure I have it -- I'll be glad to post said pages...

[rutog98]

i was Low key kinda disappointed on the solo. I'm like I'm tired of callisto and yukio can kick rocks honestly lol

While I am grateful to Pak for the creative ways in which he applied Storm's powers, I told Omegastorm in private via PM messages that the book was not going to last when I saw the soliciations of Callisto, Forge, and Yukio back to back. He asked me not to lampoon the book on the boards before it got out there, so I respected his wishes, but I didn't hold back in my private conversations with him. I told him that Pak is rehashing "Storm's Greatest Hits of the 80s" and that the book was going to fail. I told him those kinds of stories were old and tired and only die hard Storm fans would buy those books and only in support of the character and her solo title. He should have written bigger stories and challenged Storm with big-gun A-list Marvel villains with earth-shattering powers. He should have started out with a bang bringing on MASSIVELY powerful bad guys Storm had not yet faced before, but had loads of reader appeal.

[yogaflame]

I think the Fox license is a huge reason why the X-Lore has been circling the drain for the past decade or more. Marvel doesn't want to develop any new content for Fox to play with, so they just had the X-Men destroy themselves(No More Mutant is mutant SW(and an Avenger) destroying mutantkind, and then the Messiah Complex is all the greatest hits in a blender, and destroys the mutants' moral high ground by making them proactive killers), and then parlay the X-Men against their own properties(the Avengers and then Inhumans). Now they have reverted to Claremontism in Gold, without covering any new ground(Kitty and Piotr, the rest of the cast just bumbling about), Blue is just revisions of the O5 and Ultimate Wolvie, and Astonishing is the 90's stars(Archangel, Rogue, Gambit, Psylocke, Bishop) plus some villains and other recent fan favorites(Fantomex and Mystique). Literally no new ground is being forged in the entire line.

And of course Fox is owned by Rupert Murdoch and his children, so don't expect anything more than Magneto love-fest over there.

[yogaflame]

Then you can point to at least one book (title and issue please) that emphatically shows Ororo drawn with white eyebrows -- if such an issue exists then I'm sure I have it -- I'll be glad to post said pages...

I know of two easy examples, but I know there are a few scattered appearances over the years.

[BBeeryan]

I'm not saying the X-office couldn't have done better. I'm just saying the BP-office isn't faultless either. And really, in the grander sense of things, you have to look at the big picture. At the end of the day, Storm's film license is with Fox, and Marvel wasn't going to give her that much to do anyways. It's not like she'll get to be in BP's film(s). So enjoy her now in BP, but once that movie hits in February, things should get interesting.

Things will definitely get interesting. There's always a chance we could get a nod to a Goddess of the Serengeti. Lol who knows?

There is definitely a racist element to how Storm has been used over the years and in other media. And yes, as long as Jean is around in any various incarnations, Storm will most likely not attain her highest potential in the X-Lore.

We Storm know what's really up. The question is Marvel ballsy enough to admit? Of course not.

it isn't a coincidence the times she has shown at her best have been with people of color (Coates, Harvey, willow, mcduffie, hudlin, to name a few).

No, it isn't. Yona Harvey and Coates both need a **** a flagship X-title.

i dont think anyone is delusional to not understand all that is at play. but just like I tell those fans of BP that it is getting old all the resentment towards storm about things that happened after the marriage, the same is true for storm fans who hold this grudge against hudlin as if he is the reason why storm is being written shotty. No hudlin has been gone and storm from the bp mythos way too long for people to be holding any ill-feelings towards hudlin as it pertains to her treatment by the xoffices now. if he was the demise of whatever happened while he had her, what's the excuse now that she is back with the xoffices and hudlin is gone?

what is happening with storm in the xbooks have nothing to do with fox and marvel either. there again is the problem. instead of acknowledging the truth that the x-offices just don't give a crap about her, people point to things that don't really mean much of anything. I'm thankful Coates has Storm for now but as I've said in other places I'm enjoying the ride. it's better than anything I have seen in the xside in years and that's including her solo. I still love u pak.. just saying

Barring World's Apart and her solo by Pak, what are some Storm-centric or Storm-defining arc within X-men comic?