Post-crisis Batman vs MCU Comic Book Peak Humans

[Pendaran]

https://youtu.be/6fal2Dx1cO0

It's starting to sound like you want to be eating at Denny's at 4 am and are just trying to make someone give you an excuse rather than admit your hidden shame.

[The Arbiter]

It's starting to sound like you want to be eating at Denny's at 4 am and are just trying to make someone give you an excuse rather than admit your hidden shame.

https://youtu.be/FPG8iBqz8us

[The Watcher]

This started with this: "Reflex performances to suggest he's pulling that off on the guy who does no look arrow catches on an arrow shot from behind him by the likes of Green Arrow?"
He literally asks for something that shows Cap can hit a no-look-arrow-catcher when Cap has hit a no-look-arrow-catcher.

That's different from transitive feats, I believe..

Not if you're implying it implies he has reflexes, speed and reaction time equivalent to someone who catches arrows simply due to hitting someone who has. That's an indirect inference that is not valid under Rumbles standards.

[Pendaran]

https://youtu.be/FPG8iBqz8us

The avalanche of your previously hidden need for 4 am Denny's has already begun, it is too late for the pebbles to complain.

[moonknight11]

The only speed feat I can think of that supports Cap being Loki fast is Cap ducking after Black Widow fired an RPG at Winter Soldier. I think even the most diet peak humans like the Robin's could pull that off imo.

[Carabas]

Not if you're implying it implies he has reflexes, speed and reaction time equivalent to someone who catches arrows simply due to hitting someone who has. That's an indirect inference that is not valid under Rumbles standards.

I wasn't implying that at all.

Just that you obviously can just punch somebody who has better reflexes than yourself in the face without much trouble.

[Pendaran]

I wasn't implying that at all.

Just that you obviously can just punch somebody who has better reflexes than yourself in the face without much trouble.

So, your argument is that so long as the faster character forgets they're faster, the slower character will hit them? Despite the whole PIS being off thing?

[Carabas]

So, your argument is that so long as the faster character forgets they're faster, the slower character will hit them? Despite the whole PIS being off thing?

My argument is that you should take a good look at what you asked, exactly.

[Pendaran]

I know your entire thing at this point is "I'm not going to reply to the posts pointing out I'm basically ignoring board guidelines and being inconsistent with the meaning of my own arguments", but, at this point it's pretty indepth.


You've been posting on the board for a while, you've certainly seen people note how performances get weighed, that things like plot induced stupidity of people basically being underwritten to the point that they'd have to forget how fast they can act at, so that someone can hit them isn't given any weight at all here. That sort of thing is right under the FAQ/guidelines. It's the entire thing of asking people for actual feats done by a character to back claims. Which leaves us with "Captain America gets a pass from that because I want to say he wins." Why do you feel that Captain America should be discussed differently than any other character on this board? Not a rhetorical question.


Alternatively you're trying "that doesn't matter, people get hit in comics all the time despite their superior speed." Which is totally true. Of course, also in comics, people get hit all the time, get exploded, what have you, by forces and characters of all kinds of high end strength, and yet not only are alive right after, in some cases are even completely unharmed, or at the very least are able to keep right on fighting, despite that force and what should be the durability otherwise of the person getting hit/exploded/whatever. Why then, and I know you're going to keep ignoring this, but it seems worth continuing to point out anyway, does Cap's strength still apply anyway under the standard of "comics!" as far as talking about why he could knock Batman out, at all? That seems remarkably inconsistent.


At this point it's mostly a good way of illustrating why there is that FAQ/guideline thing, all you otherwise get is a guy making a bunch of contradictory arguments, ceaselessly.

[Pendaran]

My argument is that you should take a good look at what you asked, exactly.

So, I'll ask it again, I guess. What reflex performances does MCU Captain America have to suggest he can actually hit Batman, given Batman's reflex performances. If the answer is none, why is he hitting him? Nothing in that is rhetorical. Are there answers to these questions that you are capable of providing?

If your answer is "he hit Loki", then why doesn't that mean Batman is as fast as all the speedy people he hit, and thus, ludicrously faster than Cap? Again, not a rhetorical question.

Those were the questions I asked, amongst others. Is it that you feel if you reply to a question, you shouldn't have to reply to any follow up questions you don't like? In that case, why bother posting in a debate thread and making claims if you don't like the idea that they can be questioned for anything resembling meaning or consistency?

[The Arbiter]

I wasn't implying that at all.

Just that you obviously can just punch somebody who has better reflexes than yourself in the face without much trouble.

How can you just punch someone in the face who has much better reaction times?

We see boxers and MMA fighters in /real life/ dodge blows with only a very slight realistic human edge in reflexes. Video games as well.

Batman has a large reaction advantage. Not a small one.

You think you could just punch Anderson Silva in the face? I mean, his edge on you is very small compared to the gap with Batman and Cap.

Edit
https://youtu.be/Rt1IIJMpcgI
10 secs in

[Pendaran]

How can you just punch someone in the face who has much better reaction times?

We see boxers and MMA fighters in /real life/ dodge blows with only a very slight realistic human edge in reflexes. Video games as well.

Batman has a large reaction advantage. Not a small one.

You think you could just punch Anderson Silva in the face? I mean, his edge on you is very small compared to the gap with Batman and Cap.

He already said that reflexes don't matter in comics, therefore this doesn't matter. He just then refuses to answer why that should mean Cap's strength should still matter by his standards.

[Pendaran]

This is basically all that remains of whatever he's trying to argue at this point:

Better question: is being fast enough to catch bullets all that good a defense against somebody trying to punch you in the face?
Huge amounts of evidence in comics suggest not even slightly.

[Beadle]

I wasn't implying that at all.

Just that you obviously can just punch somebody who has better reflexes than yourself in the face without much trouble.

Only if they’re tied to a chair.

[The Arbiter]

Only if they’re tied to a chair.

Thaaaats what Forrest Griffin needed. A chair!
https://youtu.be/Rt1IIJMpcgI

I would like "do they have a chair?" to become a meme plz