Where is the Flash in Doomsday Clock and will he have a role in this ?

[BohemiaDrinker]

...and, he's Barry's friend. It would only be fitting that he'd want to make things right for his buddy and many others.

Do you remember the early days of CBR when members used to moot that Parallax Hal was in the right in ZERO HOUR, and that the heroes were wrong for thwarting him?

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

I still think that.

And I don't really like Hal Jordan.

[Buried Alien]

You've misunderstood me. There was no way to restore the original history in which Nora Allen wasn't murdered and her husband was framed for it.

On a related note, Bored, I was thinking...even in the FLASHPOINT timeline wherein Nora wasn't murdered: Henry still wasn't a part of Barry's childhood in that scenario. The true blue classic original Silver/Bronze Age history that had BOTH Allens alive, well, and free (even ultimately outliving Barry) really was buried improbably deep.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[Bored at 3:00AM]

...and, he's Barry's friend. It would only be fitting that he'd want to make things right for his buddy and many others.

Do you remember the early days of CBR when members used to moot that Parallax Hal was in the right in ZERO HOUR, and that the heroes were wrong for thwarting him?

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

Ha! Yes, comics fans have an unstoppable knack for twisting themselves in knots to justify how characters like either like or hate are perfectly justified or totally guilty of the various crummy stories they've been a part of.

[Bored at 3:00AM]

On a related note, Bored, I was thinking...even in the FLASHPOINT timeline wherein Nora wasn't murdered: Henry still wasn't a part of Barry's childhood in that scenario. The true blue classic original Silver/Bronze Age history that had BOTH Allens alive, well, and free (even ultimately outliving Barry) really was buried improbably deep.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

While I think the murdered mom/framed dad backstory is here to stay for the foreseeable future because it's proven to be a very effective hook for new fans of the character despite the dislike older fans have for it, I think it's very likely that Barry will Flash Fact his way around it somehow in order to give his mom and dad a happy ending, perhaps in the far future to help raise the Tornado Twins, Bart Allen and XS. That'd be a nice way to put a bow on the idea so that Barry can finally move on, but still retain that part of his backstory (because he'd still have the memories of both versions of his history).

Obviously, some fans wouldn't be satisfied by this, because there's always a small segment of hardcore fans who will never be satisfied, but I think that might help bridge the gap that now exists between a lot of old and new Flash fans.

[Frontier]

While I think the murdered mom/framed dad backstory is here to stay for the foreseeable future because it's proven to be a very effective hook for new fans of the character despite the dislike older fans have for it, I think it's very likely that Barry will Flash Fact his way around it somehow in order to give his mom and dad a happy ending, perhaps in the far future to help raise the Tornado Twins, Bart Allen and XS. That'd be a nice way to put a bow on the idea so that Barry can finally move on, but still retain that part of his backstory (because he'd still have the memories of both versions of his history).

Obviously, some fans wouldn't be satisfied by this, because there's always a small segment of hardcore fans who will never be satisfied, but I think that might help bridge the gap that now exists between a lot of old and new Flash fans.

I think the TV show was really the only place that could make the "dead mom, imprisoned father" narrative really work but even that show started to get really bogged down in drama and nonsensical time-travelling when they finally adapted Flashpoint.

[Bored at 3:00AM]

I think the TV show was really the only place that could make the "dead mom, imprisoned father" narrative really work but even that show started to get really bogged down in drama and nonsensical time-travelling when they finally adapted Flashpoint.

I would agree. It's a great starting point for the character that tips its hat to the original setup of Barry's happy childhood being raised by Nora & Henry, but giving it a compelling tragic sci-fi twist. However, it seems that Williamson understands that, much like Wally's subconscious desire to never surpass Barry, the tragedy of Barry Allen is holding back the character from reaching his full potential.

It should be noted that most of Wally West's best stories came after he'd overcome his fear of replacing Barry. It's entirely possible the same will be true of Barry Allen once he overcomes what Thawne did to his parents.

[Frontier]

I would agree. It's a great starting point for the character that tips its hat to the original setup of Barry's happy childhood being raised by Nora & Henry, but giving it a compelling tragic sci-fi twist. However, it seems that Williamson understands that, much like Wally's subconscious desire to never surpass Barry, the tragedy of Barry Allen is holding back the character from reaching his full potential.

It should be noted that most of Wally West's best stories came after he'd overcome his fear of replacing Barry. It's entirely possible the same will be true of Barry Allen once he overcomes what Thawne did to his parents.

Honestly I don't think there's much of a future for a Barry Allen who seems so defined by his dead mom.

That just seems pretty antithetical to who The Flash is.

[Buried Alien]

Honestly I don't think there's much of a future for a Barry Allen who seems so defined by his dead mom.

That just seems pretty antithetical to who The Flash is.

Geoff Johns has made many great, great creative choices over the years, but saddling Barry Allen with the dead mother trope isn't one of them. It was a pretty serious misstep.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[Frontier]

Geoff Johns has made many great, great creative choices over the years, but saddling Barry Allen with the dead mother trope isn't one of them. It was a pretty serious misstep.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

I think there have been some indications that he's not as happy about Flash: Rebirth as his other stories, but considering how much the "dead mom, imprisoned dad" idea keeps getting used in other media, I doubt he recognizes that as part of the problem.

[PyroTwilight]

Do you remember the early days of CBR when members used to moot that Parallax Hal was in the right in ZERO HOUR, and that the heroes were wrong for thwarting him?

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

...wasn't he? He was trying to essentially undo Crisis on Infinite Earths as far as readers were shown.

[Buried Alien]

...wasn't he? He was trying to essentially undo Crisis on Infinite Earths as far as readers were shown.

About half the fans at the forum twenty-plus years ago thought so, and though I was on the fence at the time, I've come around to mostly agreeing.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[Jackalope89]

Don't worry, Barry will soon be killed off by DiDio so that Jay Garrick can be the main Flash again.

[Buried Alien]

Don't worry, Barry will soon be killed off by DiDio so that Jay Garrick can be the main Flash again.

Ironically, it might be one of the few things that would reunify the feuding Barry and Wally fan factions.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[MajorHoy]

Don't worry, Barry will soon be killed off by DiDio so that Jay Garrick can be the main Flash again.

But which "Jay" will DiDio be trying to shove down our throats then? The version of Jay who looked like he peed in his costume?

[Bored at 3:00AM]

But which "Jay" will DiDio be trying to shove down our throats then? The version of Jay who looked like he peed in his costume?

Peeing in your own costume is unfairly stigmatized! It's been a longstanding tradition of the superhero genre since Joel Shumacher first zipped Val Kilmer into his rubber gimp suit back in the early '90s!