Star Trek: All of Em

[CosmiComic]

Well my point is Vulcans are not asexual, they do recognize what sexy is. They too have sexual desires which they act on, otherwise they wouldn’t reproduce.

Don't they just do Pon Farr, which Spock described as illogical? And why would their idea of sexy be exactly the same as humans'?

[ChrisIII]

Curiously the most prominent Vulcan-Spock-is half human, and perhaps the second most (after his family)-Saavik, was intended be half Romulan (although this was cut out of the film, there are points-at least in Alley's version-where Saavik seems a bit more emotional than your average Vulcan).

[CosmiComic]

Curiously the most prominent Vulcan-Spock-is half human, and perhaps the second most (after his family)-Saavik, was intended be half Romulan (although this was cut out of the film, there are points-at least in Alley's version-where Saavik seems a bit more emotional than your average Vulcan).

Was her being half-Romulan ever canon? I was never sure but I always thought Star Trek was stricter about external materials being canon

[ChrisIII]

There's a TWOK deleted scene where Spock says it during the corridor scene after the Kobayashi Maru.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rKw66EU5Fc

Strangely despite TWOK's reputation these deleted scenes didn't really seem to be given any decent quality in any home releases. They're not in the director's cut either.

[CosmiComic]

Ok. So I guess it is canon

Maybe someday it'll get an official release

[BeastieRunner]

I guess we need to see how well Pointy Ears Shapely Rears sales are pre 2258.42 to see if there's a logical pattern to suss out for Vulcan sexuality.

[luprki]

Don't they just do Pon Farr, which Spock described as illogical? And why would their idea of sexy be exactly the same as humans'?

Spock can be overly extreme, as we have seen with other Vulcan, they are more emotional than Spock. Spock seems to go overboard with has logic.

[Cyke]

Perhaps I shouldn't have said they have nothing to do with one another. But my point is a lot of those are socially constructed ideals, which can and do change, and are based on various random social factors. So while those can attract people, they don't at all guarantee someone would be a fit parent, or even if they'd reciprocate those feelings or desires in any way. And I think we've seen the massive social downsides of people being superficial, and making decisions based on that. So, even though humans would act like that, I assumed Vulcans at least outwardly wouldn't act like that. Nor would they necessarily be attracted to the same things humans are.

With T'Pol specifically, I get the feeling she was treated like that because she was female. I don't recall male Vulcans being treated like that

However, is it superficial if we recognize that different people have different types of attractions? Not everyone is going to be attracted to what is classically beautiful, and there's definitely pushback against what defines that. But a lot of that is still based on appearance and first impression. Superficiality would be trying to live up to some kind of ideal, whereas dressing however you want -- and attracting someone who likes the way you dress -- isn't superficial.

[CosmiComic]

However, is it superficial if we recognize that different people have different types of attractions? Not everyone is going to be attracted to what is classically beautiful, and there's definitely pushback against what defines that. But a lot of that is still based on appearance and first impression. Superficiality would be trying to live up to some kind of ideal, whereas dressing however you want -- and attracting someone who likes the way you dress -- isn't superficial.

Um, that's my point. Attraction varies, so socially imposed ideals aren't inherently rational or logical or universal. But characters like T'Pol are viewed in a stereotypically, socially rigid view of "attractive," which is the opposite of that

[ChrisIII]

Spock can be overly extreme, as we have seen with other Vulcan, they are more emotional than Spock. Spock seems to go overboard with has logic.

He seems to chill down a bit in the movies, (apart from his brief recovery period in IV), showing more emotion here and there and more comfortable with calling the crew his friends, although whether this was intentional due to him reaching a sort of answer with V'ger in the first one or just a creative coincidence is unknown.

[CosmiComic]

He seems to chill down a bit in the movies, (apart from his brief recovery period in IV), showing more emotion here and there and more comfortable with calling the crew his friends, although whether this was intentional due to him reaching a sort of answer with V'ger in the first one or just a creative coincidence is unknown.

In some of his earliest appearances, he would sometimes be emotional, but I always assumed that was because the writers were still trying to iron things out

[Cyke]

Um, that's my point. Attraction varies, so socially imposed ideals aren't inherently rational or logical or universal. But characters like T'Pol are viewed in a stereotypically, socially rigid view of "attractive," which is the opposite of that

Again, I'm not nor have I ever tried to counter you about T'Pol (you're really stuck on this imaginary conflict for some reason even though I've said over and over again that I agree with you about how badly T'Pol was treated). But even if attraction varies, appearance still plays a role in that attraction (eye of the beholder, which I pointed to in an earlier post but you doubted), and that can also -- and often does -- lead to propagation.

How badly T'Pol was treated for the sake of the male gaze =/= appearance and attraction aren't factors in Vulcan propagation. Vulcans have their own standards and practices of beauty and attraction, and judging based on appearance is perfectly natural and logical. It's what the attracted likes in the appearance that's the major variable.

[CosmiComic]

Again, I'm not nor have I ever tried to counter you about T'Pol (you're really stuck on this imaginary conflict for some reason even though I've said over and over again that I agree with you about how badly T'Pol was treated). But even if attraction varies, appearance still plays a role in that attraction (eye of the beholder, which I pointed to in an earlier post but you doubted), and that can also -- and often does -- lead to propagation.

How badly T'Pol was treated for the sake of the male gaze =/= appearance and attraction aren't factors in Vulcan propagation. Vulcans have their own standards and practices of beauty and attraction, and judging based on appearance is perfectly natural and logical. It's what the attracted likes in the appearance that's the major variable.

I think it's only semi-logical, because physical appearance hardly denotes any internal attributes, which supposedly a logical society would care about

[luprki]

The Vulcans are the most illogical species in the universe. Because it’s illogical to be logical. Being logical is a stupid concept.

[CosmiComic]

The Vulcans are the most illogical species in the universe. Because it’s illogical to be logical. Being logical is a stupid concept.

Vulcans take it to an extreme, but I think it's a reasonable to goal ro try to be logical when it's applicable