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  1. #1471
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malvolio View Post
    It was there because network executives were against it, not Roddenberry. One of the reasons the original pilot didn't sell was because network executives were convinced that viewers wouldn't accept a female first officer, much less a female captain.
    Oh yeah, that's true. I guess we can chalk that up to the attitudes at the time. Still, within the ST universe, it's still odd

  2. #1472
    Astonishing Member Anthony W's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Craig View Post
    Not sure if this was a general inquiry or directed at someone BUT, I did know.

    I've wondered on occasion what the show's dynamic would've been like and how storylines would've gone different if it had been Ro instead of Kira. The only explanation I recall that was given was that Michelle Forbes, at that moment in time, didn't want a full time character role on tv. Like Kirstie Allie she wanted to be doing Features...that didn't wholly work out. Which is why when I'd see Forbes on nuBSG and True Blood I just chuckled. You passed on a great gig but hey life and your career is about chances. Sure Things, who wants that?!
    Isn't that why Denise Crosby (Tasha Yar) left too? Man, how different would TNG look if she would have stayed? I just don't know what becomes of Worf.
    "The Marvel EIC Chair has a certain curse that goes along with it: it tends to drive people insane, and ultimately, out of the business altogether. It is the notorious last stop for many staffers, as once you've sat in The Big Chair, your pariah status is usually locked in." Christopher Priest

  3. #1473
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony W View Post
    Isn't that why Denise Crosby (Tasha Yar) left too? Man, how different would TNG look if she would have stayed? I just don't know what becomes of Worf.
    For Crosby or for TNG?

  4. #1474
    Ultimate Member Ascended's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by babyblob View Post
    The one thing I loved about Star Trek was that everyone was equal, race, sex, it didnt matter, everyone was the same. That is at least how iit was written. Then kirk busts out with the last line of the series and I couldnt help but laugh in the WTF moments.

    "Her life could have been as rich as any woman's, if only. If only." He did not say her life could have been as full as anyone's nope he said as any womans. So there was still a bit of a divide.
    Eh, Trek lore is full of the limitations forced upon Roddenberry by executives who couldn't see as far as him. This is just another one, alongside things like "each episode needs a car chase."
    "We all know the truth: more connects us than separates us. But in times of crisis the wise build bridges, while the foolish build barriers. We must find a way to look after one another, as if we were one single tribe."

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  5. #1475
    Astonishing Member Anthony W's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CosmiComic View Post
    For Crosby or for TNG?
    Both. I think if Crosby stayed on TNG Dorn would have ended up being kind of useless before becoming an original cast member on DS9.
    "The Marvel EIC Chair has a certain curse that goes along with it: it tends to drive people insane, and ultimately, out of the business altogether. It is the notorious last stop for many staffers, as once you've sat in The Big Chair, your pariah status is usually locked in." Christopher Priest

  6. #1476
    Relaunched, not rebooted! SJNeal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony W View Post
    Both. I think if Crosby stayed on TNG Dorn would have ended up being kind of useless before becoming an original cast member on DS9.
    I've read a few interviews with Crosby wherein she states that when she approached him, Roddenberry basically told her that Picard and Riker were the stars of the show, and he couldn't guarantee S2 wouldn't be more of the same for Yar. However, Roddenberry was also ready to let go of Marina Sirtis before Crosby quit; had that happened it still would have freed up some screen time to fall to the other characters, and Yar may have gotten that development she was missing in S1.

    Speculation is fun, and I'd like to think the late, great Michael Piller would have found a way to give everyone their due had we still had everyone on board by S3.
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  7. #1477
    Ultimate Member ChrisIII's Avatar
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    Speaking of Crosby, wonder if they'll bring back Sela for Picard at some point.
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  8. #1478
    Extraordinary Member Captain Craig's Avatar
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    I thought Crosby's departure was rooted in her appearance in Playboy?
    Is that not correct? The other above mentioned items might also be in play, thought it started with that magazine appearance though.
    "Freedom is the right of all sentient beings" - Optimus Prime

  9. #1479
    Mighty Member C_Miller's Avatar
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    I often think about what the show would have looked like if Tasha Yar had stuck around. I don't think it's inevitable that Worf would have been kicked to the side as I don't think his role as Chief of Security is really what gave his character life. It was his Klingon heritage, his status as a man of two worlds and his role as a war orphan.

    When I think of great Worf episodes, I think of Sins of the Father, Redemption, Family, the Way of the Warrior, Sword of Kahless. I can't think of a single episode that was about Word defending the Enterprise or investigating a crime. I think they could have found a place for him on the Enterprise that would have allowed him to shine without firing phasers or torpedoes or being the guy that gets beat up to show the situation is serious. Worf's best qualities go beyond that and I think he still would have had the same arcs.

    I'm honestly less interested in the question of what would have happened with Worf and more interested in what they would have done with Tasha.

  10. #1480
    Relaunched, not rebooted! SJNeal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Craig View Post
    I thought Crosby's departure was rooted in her appearance in Playboy?
    Is that not correct? The other above mentioned items might also be in play, thought it started with that magazine appearance though.
    That was a prevailing theory for years, but debunked. I want to say the photos were taken before TNG, and didn't see publication until after she'd already left the show...? I'd have to research some dates to be sure.
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  11. #1481
    Relaunched, not rebooted! SJNeal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by C_Miller View Post
    I often think about what the show would have looked like if Tasha Yar had stuck around. I don't think it's inevitable that Worf would have been kicked to the side as I don't think his role as Chief of Security is really what gave his character life. It was his Klingon heritage, his status as a man of two worlds and his role as a war orphan.

    When I think of great Worf episodes, I think of Sins of the Father, Redemption, Family, the Way of the Warrior, Sword of Kahless. I can't think of a single episode that was about Word defending the Enterprise or investigating a crime. I think they could have found a place for him on the Enterprise that would have allowed him to shine without firing phasers or torpedoes or being the guy that gets beat up to show the situation is serious. Worf's best qualities go beyond that and I think he still would have had the same arcs.

    I'm honestly less interested in the question of what would have happened with Worf and more interested in what they would have done with Tasha.
    You're absolutely right, Worf's best moments had nothing to do with his job performance. He was actually a pretty ineffectual security chief - when he wasn't being beaten up, he was being shut down by Picard or Riker for daring to speak up! Lol.

    Had Tasha stuck around, I think her S2 would have looked a lot like S1. While there were some standout episodes in S2, it's often recalled as the year of the revolving writers door. She'd have likely had to stick it out until S3, when the dust settled and Piller had his writers room established, before she got any real character development.

    Just my speculation.
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  12. #1482
    The Superior One Celgress's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malvolio View Post
    It was there because network executives were against it, not Roddenberry. One of the reasons the original pilot didn't sell was because network executives were convinced that viewers wouldn't accept a female first officer, much less a female captain.
    Yeah, this is what happened not that the show makers were sexist. I've watched pretty much every Trek documentary that has ever been made and I can testify you are 100% correct.
    "So you've come to the end now alive but dead inside."

  13. #1483
    Ultimate Member ChrisIII's Avatar
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    Been watching TMP in 4k.

    Just me or is it inferred that Kirk was somewhat responsible for the Transporter malfunction? Not just by rushing the ship, but also he distracts Scotty and Decker when they were trying to fix the thing.
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  14. #1484
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Craig View Post
    I thought Crosby's departure was rooted in her appearance in Playboy?
    Is that not correct? The other above mentioned items might also be in play, thought it started with that magazine appearance though.
    I heard at the time it was her appearance in the Stephen King Pet Semetary movie conflicting with the shooting schedule for the season, and instead of, as she asked for, giving her a few episodes off to finish up her movie shooting, she was just fired and written out.

    But this was just a rumor at the time, and I have zero inside info as to whether it's true or BS.

  15. #1485
    Ultimate Member ChrisIII's Avatar
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    Didn't they initially consider Denise for Troi and Sitris as Yar?

    Kind of interesting if you look at both their filmographies prior to Star Trek they were in fairly similar roles-bit parts in crime thrillers, mainly, although I think Crosby might've gotten more movies on her family name alone as well.
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