Are New Gods and Parademons the same species?

[NetSpiker]

Or are they different species?

[Deniz Camp]

Parademon "schtick" changes from appearance to appearance, but modern writers tend to have them as artificially grown shock troops.

[Lorendiac]

Parademon "schtick" changes from appearance to appearance, but modern writers tend to have them as artificially grown shock troops.

I think someone once pointed out in a similar online discussion that there was a time, back around the "Genesis" event of the late 1990s, when at least one superhero killed a Parademon and virtuously claimed this didn't really violate the "no killing" rule which most DC superheroes try to live by. The excuse was that he "knew" Parademons were just artifically-created entities of limited intelligence instead of "natural-born sentient people" . . . or something to that general effect. I think. (If I ever read that scene myself, I can't remember it now.)

[Deniz Camp]

That's a large part of the reason for it, I'm sure.

And there's quite a bit to back it up post-Kirby; Byrne's own Wonder Woman makes it clear that, additionally, Parademons dont' ever really die unless Darkseid allows it. In a field of slaughtered amazons and Parademons, the harvest of a bloody battle between the two, a simple gesture from Darkseid signals the parademons to rise, as alive as they ever were, for the next task.

Even Morrison's Rock of Ages has the Black Racer say as much. "These ones died long ago; they feel nothing at my passing", as his shadow slides over parademon shock troops.

PAD's Aquaman implies that most of them are incapable of free will (making the protagonist of the one off issue particularly special), where as Denny O'Neil's Azrael Genesis tie in has perhaps the most interesting take on them, as hyper-adaptable learning organisms.

There's a variety of takes.

[Sirzechs]

In Justice League : War it was said that Parademons are other races Darkseid conquered then Desaad mutated and engineered them into foot soldiers so i'm just gonna go with that.

[BlackWind]

IIRC, Parademons have even been bio-mechankcal creatures.

[Buried Alien]

I've always thought that if New Gods were human beings, then parademons would be their dogs.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[Carabas]

Parademons aren't really a race, they're a status.
They're altered, brainwashed supersoldiers, and their ranks are filled with many races, including Apokoliptian citizens.

In a sense they're like the various types of Husks the Reapers created in Mass Effect 3, but more uniform in appearance.

[Nix Uotan]

Current Parademons are seemingly bio-engineered warrior servants that are converted sentients from planets attacked by Apokolips. That why in the first arc we saw them capturing civilians and taking them to the spires. Though I think that was more implied then outright seen... might be mistaken there since its been a while but don't think it was seen in the comic. Justice League: War outright shows it by individuals placed in cocoons and transformed against their will.

[Lorendiac]

That's a large part of the reason for it, I'm sure.

And there's quite a bit to back it up post-Kirby; Byrne's own Wonder Woman makes it clear that, additionally, Parademons dont' ever really die unless Darkseid allows it. In a field of slaughtered amazons and Parademons, the harvest of a bloody battle between the two, a simple gesture from Darkseid signals the parademons to rise, as alive as they ever were, for the next task.

I own the full Byrne Wonder Woman run, but it's been so long since I read the relevant portion of it that I just vaguely remember that Darkseid attacked Themyscira at some point and a bunch of Amazons died. That's it. I don't remember the details you mention about the Parademon army bouncing back from death, ready to go another round.

I do remember that I didn't like that story arc. (Which, of course, probably explains why I haven't bothered to refresh my memory of it any time in the last several years.)

[sirjustin86]

I just go with the New-52 DVD version of things - they're a converted gloop made up of conquered prisoners etc that are given mechanical and DNA alterations to be mindless beasts whose only whim is to serve Darkseid. They aren't 'alive' per se, because they're created from the biological leftovers of various individuals etc.

[Lorendiac]

I just go with the New-52 DVD version of things - they're a converted gloop made up of conquered prisoners etc that are given mechanical and DNA alterations to be mindless beasts whose only whim is to serve Darkseid. They aren't 'alive' per se, because they're created from the biological leftovers of various individuals etc.

That makes it sound like "The Walking Dead" or some other "Zombie Apocalypse" type of story. "Lo, I shall wave my hand and raise up an army of fearless zombies who are too dumb to be scared of enemy firepower!"

I haven't read any "New 52" stories with Parademons in them, but I have to say that "army of zombies" wasn't quite the impression I used to get in lots of relevant stories from the 1970s, 80s, 90s, and 2000s which I did read.

At any rate, it occurs to me that we do seem to have a consensus forming in response to the original question in the thread title: "Are New Gods and Parademons the same species? No."

[ReverseReverseFlash]

Or are they different species?

"species"?

They're Gods. They don't really exist in a biological environment.

Parademons are basically the same thing as Cyborg. Apokolips nano-tech infused in an organic host. Parademons are what happens when the nano-tech destroys the original host's mind.

They're alive, but they aren't considered sentient or intelligent. The Justice League killing them is the equivalent of shooting a rabid dog. As we saw in Batman and Robin #33, they do have basic instincts and emotions and they are punished when they disobey by being burned alive for eternity in a cage.

So yeah, rabid dogs. They don't have human-like sentience.

[Lorendiac]

"species"?

They're Gods. They don't really exist in a biological environment.

I have serious doubts about that statement.

1) I normally tend to see the rank-and-file "New Gods" (as opposed to such exceptionally powerful cases as Darkseid and Orion) as just being "fairly powerful, long-living humanoid creatures who happen to have been born in another part of the universe," rather than "gods" in the usual sense of the word. No matter what Jack Kirby called them! (Heck, I don't really think of Darkseid as "a god" either, but I admit his power-levels are higher than those of most of the costumed superhumans running around on Planet Earth in the DCU, so he at least comes closer to being worthy of the name, as does his son Orion.)

2) There have been plenty of cases of "mythological" and/or "modern fictional" gods whose abilities (or at least the general power-levels, even if the exact abilities were different) were supposed to be hereditary, and whose halfbreed offspring (by mortal lovers) had some of the "divine power" within them, but not as much incredible power at their fingertips as a pure-blooded "god" would have had in that same setting.

So in either case, I think biological concerns such as "hereditary traits" and "are these two individuals of the same species?" can be highly relevant to understanding what is going on within a story, series of stories, or larger fictional universe. Could a New God woman mate and reproduce with a Parademon male? (Heck, can a New God successfully reproduce with an ordinary human being from Planet Earth? I'm having trouble remembering any good examples of such a romantic couple trying, and then definitely succeeding or definitely failing, to have "halfbreed" kids in any DC comic book.)