The Gifted - "coMplications" Episode 3 (Spoilers)

[Marvelgirl]

DenOfGeek.com, The Gifted Season 2 Episode 3 Review: coMplications


I agree, I really enjoyed it.

I gave up on the show mid season 1. I may check it out again with that type of review.

[loke13]

Did we watch the same episode? MU comes off as bad guys? Seriously?

Yeah I'm not sure how they came to that conclusion considering the Inner Circle straight-up manipulated and killed a bunch of innocent people last episode

[donpricetag]

When he beat up the Cuckoos and was storming over to where Lorna was. What do you think he was doing? He was going to try to beat up everyone and take Lorna with him forcefully.

The persuasion attempt was over by the time he was being escorted out by the Cuckoos. Lorna was done with the conversation.

Do I feel for the guy being separated from his kid sure

And like I said they should have explored his offer to join them and not just dismissed it

But... he is turning into a creepy stalker. He is.

Then he lies to T-bird and Blink about what happened, and pretends he was just randomly attacked or something. So it's time to "hit them back". Playing up on Thunderbird's ego problems and leadership insecurities, wanting to please Vange by being willing to kill the "traitors". Very toxic and combustible mix there.

To be fair... you cant "force" Lorna to do anything against her will. I think he just wanted to appeal to her. To fight for his family. He was willing to stay and betray his friends to keep them together. I think he could have been less of an emotional wreck. If nothing else, he could requested they continue their talk away from whatever compound. At that point it wouldnt be a security risk. If Lorna still refused he'd know she was just trying to keep him at arm's length, which says a whole lot. On the other hand... she is a schizo.

[Grey]

Did we watch the same episode? MU comes off as bad guys? Seriously?

Yea between the MU supposedly “coming off as bad guys” and the Lorna abduction comment I think me and the quoted poster interpret the actions by the characters on the show very differently. I mean Marcos emotionally rushing over to Polaris and his child... I don’t see how that implies abduction. He’s emotional and very well could have just been rushing over to tell her what he saw in the hive mind (if true, see below) or to have a real, unmoderated conversation with Polaris.

I think Marcos saw actual lies in the cuckooos hive mind when they mind controlled him- so when he shouted to Lorna I think he was speaking truth. So I don’t see what Marcos did as evil here. The inner circle management (Reeva and cuckoos) are clearly (imo) being set up to be micromanaging dictators so, I think it makes more sense for Marcos to be telling the truth. I think There has to be an angle for polaris and Andy to eventually reunite with the MU so it makes sense. That being said until we know for sure I’m fine with reserving judgment.

Also it would be cool if Marcos put some sort of tracking device in that rattler he made, though I doubt he did since he made that before he knew he’d be going to meet the inner circle.

Oh I also like what the morlock guy said about the xmen. “The xmen fought for tolerance. We fight for freedom.” It doesn’t diminish what the xmen fight for but what he said rang true, especially for mutants like blink who can’t “pass” as easily as the “normal”, pretty-looking mutants.

As usual I liked the episode but there’s a couple of things bugging me:

1) I feel like there’s been fewer power displays so far this season than last, which I find strange unlesss the show is on a smaller budget this season. The screen-shaking reeeva power is particularly humorous.

2.) the members of the MU seem to needlessly be keeping secrets from one another.
Namely, the struckers and Blunderbird (blink+ Thunderbird). Yes I understand the in-show reasoning for said secrets.But that doesn’t mean I agree with the secret keeping. Feels like unnecessary drama. But then again the show IS a drama so I guess it’s not needless

[loke13]

Did they nerf the Cuckoo's? I mean last season when the three of them got together they mind control a group of armed men to commit suicide and in this episode the three of them together couldn't even control Marcos long enough to put them into an elevator?

[AbnormallyNormal]

Did they nerf the Cuckoo's? I mean last season when the three of them got together they mind control a group of armed men to commit suicide and in this episode the three of them together couldn't even control Marcos long enough to put them into an elevator?

It's poor writing meant to further glamorize Marcos

Did we watch the same episode? MU comes off as bad guys? Seriously?

Yes seriously (well, mostly serious).

You quoted my entire post so I presume you read my reasoning?

Yeah I'm not sure how they came to that conclusion considering the Inner Circle straight-up manipulated and killed a bunch of innocent people last episode

That was not this episode, and it was not "a bunch" it was 2. And it was a security risk with apparently no alternative. Do I think it's great for them to kill 2 witnesses? No. But if the alternative is Purifiers/SS finding out locations and activities of important mutants planning a "revolution" to establish their own homeland... well... it might be a relatively small bad thing for a much greater good overall. Those are the tradeoffs real-world leaders make in times of crisis. It doesn't mean you're "evil". It means you're pragmatic. You try to find other ways to resolve the problem - my assumption is the Cuckoos on the show can't "mind wipe" since that was a power unique to Dreamer.

Anyway my post was for this episode primarily. I feel like if you watched with an open mind it'd be hard not to perceive the Underground as the more villainous or aggressive of the two main groups.

[xman]

In no medium is telepathy powerful to stop important characters from inconveniencing telepaths. Same in the comics! It works until it doesn’t.

[Soulsword323]

I love the Inner Circle, but don't see how the Underground are the villains. Thunderbird was reiterating what Whedon told him about Polaris, and Andy. That they would have to be killed or that Reeva would kill them, I can't remember exactly, but he wasn't just saying that to say it. That entire scene with Blink was John going into more detail about what his conversation with Vange was about.

[Phoenixx9]

Reed's mutation is so destructive. I was not sure what powers they were going to give him, but I guess this fits in with his family heritage. He really needs to learn to control his powers, especially when he is around his loved ones.

[Sutekh]

In no medium is telepathy powerful to stop important characters from inconveniencing telepaths. Same in the comics! It works until it doesn’t.

Yeah, NPCs, like all the nameless mooks the Cuckoos ganked last season, don't get saving throws. Pawns just get swept off the board.

Marcos is a named character. He gets a chance to resist.

As will Lorna, when the time comes...

[Nevets]

Better than episode 2 (not a difficult task BTW)

Inner Circle came across less overtly "evil"

Underground by contrast seems increasingly like the bad guys IMO

First Marcos tries abducting Lorna and lies to her about the Cuckoos, viciously attacks the Cuckoos burning one's arm

He is then escorted out, when he arrives back at the apartment he freaks out more saying he needs to "hit em back"

Dude what on earth. YOU JUST HIT THEM AFTER THEY TRIED TO HELP YOU TO SAVE YOUR KID? WHAT.

Then to top that off, we get more Thunderbird (back to being the hardass leader again, groans) saying they need to kill Lorna and Andy

Lmao if anyone still roots for Underground. I'm sorry I'm just done with the lot of 'em

Jace's scenes were very compelling and almost like a different genre of show they were powers-less sort of "real" feeling

Jace no longer comes across as a bumbling "Keystone Cop" as he did in season 1, now he is treated with more respect and we see his superior abilities compared to the others

I am almost warming up to Jace as the real antagonist for this season.

I'm glad ThunderBlink is finally hitting some roadbumps, impressed Blink actually is doing what Erg wanted and is going to be a spy for the Morlocks. Not sure if she will keep that up the whole season or eventually break down and admit everything to Thunderbird. But either way, thankfully it makes her slightly more appealing. (Her CONSTANT sarcastic quips during the sewer jaunt were extremely getting on my nerves, like I get she is "the sarcastic girl" but come on... let's done that down somewhat)

Reeva made an excellent point to Andrew, it's easy to fight your enemies but it's harder to go up against your former friends. But you do what you must for the sake of something much bigger than any one of us.

SO GLAD Lorna rebuffed Marcos' entreaties. SO GLAD. Thank you show. When she initially gasped and all that at his presence a lump was forming in the pit of my stomach that the show was going to lean way too far into teasing a reunion between them.

I did find it amazing Marcos actually offered to help stay with Inner Circle... I don't know why they didn't take that offer seriously? And try to use him? Why just say no? Seriously, that was weird. I would have immediately tried to find out how serious he was, he would be useful.

Reed is just like... a comical dumbass. I mean I was just laughing hard at his stupid antics. Good lord. How dumb can you possibly get Reed????

The preview for next episode is "straight fire" as the kids say, definitely looking VERY forward to it.

Well here's to hoping the ratings were at least not super terrible.

...I honestly think you are just messing with us, right? Underground as the bad guys?? Marcos trying to abduct? Jace not being an awful blight on the show? No way your serious.

[SpiderClops]

Reed's mutation is so destructive. I was not sure what powers they were going to give him, but I guess this fits in with his family heritage. He really needs to learn to control his powers, especially when he is around his loved ones.

Yeah, I'm surprised there was no scene of Lauren or Caitlin being afraid of being touched by him. Thought they would do something like that for sure.

[MarvelMaster616]

I had to DVR this episode, but when I finally got around to watching it, I was glad I could skip the commercials. This was a pretty dramatic episode. Marcos reaction to holding his daughter the first time was very sweet. And Reed finally coming clean about his powers was overdue, but well-done. Tensions are really rising on all fronts and the Morlocks definitely add some new complications. I look forward to the next episode.

[AbnormallyNormal]

Yeah, NPCs, like all the nameless mooks the Cuckoos ganked last season, don't get saving throws. Pawns just get swept off the board.

Marcos is a named character. He gets a chance to resist.

As will Lorna, when the time comes...

Wouldn't be so sure about that part re: Lorna but we'll see. If it comes into a Lorna + Esme partnership vs Sophie and Phoebe maybe but then that would be also kind of Cuckoo vs Cuckoo so it would make more sense powers-wise

Also... thank god those "nameless mooks" were "swept off the board", it saved multiple key characters

...I honestly think you are just messing with us, right? Underground as the bad guys?? Marcos trying to abduct? Jace not being an awful blight on the show? No way your serious.

Did you read my reasons? Yes that was my perception of the episode while watching. If you disagree I'd love to hear why.

In particular the thing about Jace being an awful blight on the show is a strange one to say, I think a lot of people actually are enjoying Jace's presence as a developing threat in this season.

Of course the whole thing like... can Underground be viewed as in any way dubious/questionable/aggressive is going to be controversial with people who go into watching the show just assuming 100% who is good/hero and who is evil/villain. But if you open your mind up maybe you can notice these apparent contradictions more.

Now do I think the Underground are like "pure Satanic evil" no of course not. I'm just trying to point out some of their behaviors and intentions are, if the Inner Circle did them, people would easily use as evidence of villainy. But simply because it's the Underground people view it totally differently as heroic/good/pure. That's my point, it's total double standards. You should judge each action or attitude on its own and not just because some group or character you already have a feeling about is attached to it.

Was Marcos brought by the Cuckoos by force? Was he brought voluntarily? Why was he brought there? Was he allowed to do what he was brought for? Did anybody attack or harm him in any way? Did Lorna literally tell him she wants to be there and believes in it? Did Lorna rebuff him and tell him it was time for him to go? Did Lorna try to beg him to stay there? Did Lorna give him ANY indication she needed "rescuing"? These are questions you should attempt to answer....

I love the Inner Circle, but don't see how the Underground are the villains. Thunderbird was reiterating what Whedon told him about Polaris, and Andy. That they would have to be killed or that Reeva would kill them, I can't remember exactly, but he wasn't just saying that to say it. That entire scene with Blink was John going into more detail about what his conversation with Vange was about.

Well I just meant *in the context of this episode* the Underground could be viewed as the villains since they are the more aggressive and hostile side. It's entirely possible and indeed plausible other episodes will portray things differently.

I know Thunderbird was repeating what Vange said, but the point is Vange insulted him and mocked him, and again... if we had an open mind... we could view Vange as "manipulating" Thunderbird, much like everyone thinks Reeva is manipulating Andy. So I would argue Vange's thing of berating and tearing down Thunderbird's ego and then at the end giving him that indoctrination or message of "you'll have to kill your friends" was indeed sort of a way of using Thunderbird to do her dirty work of getting rid of her political adversaries or those mutants she dislikes.

Reeva in this episode did indeed get Andy to accompany her when Marcos arrived at their HQ, and she explained to Andy it's easy to fight your enemies but much harder to confront former friends or people you still have feelings for. So I see strong parallels between Reeva Payge and Evangeline Whedon, they're both basically rival political figures who use other characters as tools or soldiers to fight their proxy battles. However, unlike Vange, Reeva never explicitly tells anyone they need to be ready to KILL their former friends. She had every opportunity to kill Marcos when he attacked.

Imagine if Andy had been brought to Vange's office and freaked out and started to fight everyone. Maybe they wouldn't kill him and would just bring him back to the Inner Circle. But... would they really? I think it's far more likely they would never return him and instead would try to "re educate" (read: forcefully indoctrinate) him back into their "ways". Or they might even surrender him to the authorities for prison who knows. I'm just pointing out, the way the Inner Circle handled Marcos' violent outburst was so so incredibly tame, that it just made his ridiculous "I wanna hit em back" line at the end just totally bother and offend me. And I am having difficulty understanding people thinking he is in the right morally somehow, I really am.

[Soulsword323]

I just don't see it that way. I don't know what the Underground did that seemed super aggressive. I also don't think Vange was manipulating Thunderbird, she was just stating her opinion, and nor do I think that John has any actual intentions of murdering Polaris and Andy. He wouldn't be trying to figure out how to reach them if he just wanted to kill them.

When it comes to Marcos' violent outburst, you fail to mention that the Stepfords were mentally controlling him. They took away his free will, and he fought back. The scenes doesn't play out the way you describe, and Eclipse didn't just start randomly attacking people. You can't ignore the things other characters do.