Ben Reilly: The Scarlet Spider #25. SPOILER WARNING.

[Celgress]

Can we just finger snap the damn Inheritors out of existence already? I am so sick of Morlun and wannabe vampire family.

Yes please, I'm all for this. They are amongst the worst villains of all time. As big bads, they fall flat. Their designs are lackluster, they don't have fleshed out personalities, and their motivation is frankly absurd. Their favorite and most nourishing food is spider totems yet they plan to eradicate all such totems from the multiverse. I, for example, love McDonald's chicken nuggets there is thus no way in hell I'm blowing up every McDonald's restaurant in the country so I can't find them anymore.

[boots]

I think the main difference between how Ben was brought back vs Bucky and Jason Todd was they came back as part of long running story arcs, Ben was brought back as part of an event which had a finite space and was juggling multiple characters abs narratives like Otto's return, the Carrion virus pressing across the multiverse bringing in Kaine and Spider Gwen, Peter's reunion with several dead characters, Rhino, Lizard and Prowler subplots etc.

All things considered I think Clone Conspiracy did a decent-ish job at depicted Ben's descent into madness due to his torture. It didn't go into any real depth with it but that's really what PAD should have done.

all in all, i think we agree on most points. i'll just summarise by saying that i wish clone conspiracy had been a winter soldier, or a red hood or even a return of barry allen (the 90s story) than what we got. something that took the time and care to reconnect old readers to ben and to introduce him to a new audience...as it was, it felt like a stranger for all parties.

[boots]

Yes please, I'm all for this. They are amongst the worst villains of all time. As big bads, they fall flat. Their designs are lackluster, they don't have fleshed out personalities, and their motivation is frankly absurd. Their favorite and most nourishing food is spider totems yet they plan to eradicate all such totems from the multiverse. I, for example, love McDonald's chicken nuggets there is thus no way in hell I'm blowing up every McDonald's restaurant in the country so I can't find them anymore.

i vaguely recall they were cloning/farming them too? but hunting their mcnuggets was more fun.

i thought the inheritors were ok...as far as monsters for a big blockbuster went (monsters generally work best the less fleshed out they are), but i don't know if i could last a second round of reading them.

[SuperiorIronman]

i vaguely recall they were cloning/farming them too? but hunting their mcnuggets was more fun.

i thought the inheritors were ok...as far as monsters for a big blockbuster went (monsters generally work best the less fleshed out they are), but i don't know if i could last a second round of reading them.

They tried cloning them but couldn't recreate the essence necessary for them to be a viable food source. I don't now how on Earth they couldn't do that...., then again they also had a meek or potentially mentally disabled Miles Warren doing it for them so I guess yeah, even Jennix is the biggest idiot. So in short, they actually tried so they wouldn't have to, but the help they had to do it was beyond incompetent.

[Celgress]

...beyond incompetent.

This perfectly sums up the Inheritors in general lol.

[Batman Begins 2005]

Yes please, I'm all for this. They are amongst the worst villains of all time. As big bads, they fall flat. Their designs are lackluster, they don't have fleshed out personalities, and their motivation is frankly absurd. Their favorite and most nourishing food is spider totems yet they plan to eradicate all such totems from the multiverse. I, for example, love McDonald's chicken nuggets there is thus no way in hell I'm blowing up every McDonald's restaurant in the country so I can't find them anymore.

I like Morlun but it's also diminishing returns for him and his pointless family.

[theoneandonly]

frankly the first story didn't know where it was headed( their motivation remains baffling. kill spiders all over the multiiverse absorb their essence and become gods even they though they are equal to or greater than gods as it is or we are tired of eating our favourite meal piecemeal and want a giant feast of the same fare even though we may starve later?) and so it seems a repeat is in the cards. bet this time they are planning to sacrifice the spiders at the altar of their prime god or something and become akin to masters of the multiiverse because reasons.

[Scarlet-Spider]

Well the thing is JMS never planned Morlun to be this intergalactic threat with a big family who comes from a different dimension. No sign of any of that in Coming Home and The Other. Slott took it upon himself to explain how the hell Morlun could have come back after he was melted in Coming Home. I really love that Slott bothered to do that and in a fashion that lead to a really fun event.

[SuperiorPeterParker]

I've honestly thought Morlun and his family were sort of the antithesis of Kraven and his children. I.E. Kraven respected Spider-Man and in some portrayals is a conservationist, whereas Morlun was trying to kill every totem in the multiverse. Both of them were also involved in that whole Web of Life mystical stuff. There are other interesting contrasts, but that's my interpretation personally.

[SuperiorIronman]

Like Morlun, the retcons done to Ben Reilly have been questionable in terms of effectiveness.

Although I'd argue with Ben Reilly there is good that can come of this, Morlun just needs to go away as while it's an interesting idea, in practice he is the weakest and quite frankly dumbest Spider-man villain.

[HypnoHustler]

Morlun has been in exactly one good Spidey story and it came out over 17 years ago, which of course was 'Coming Home.'

Even then I didn't like the silly and convoluted animal totem stuff that seemed to come out of nowhere. But no one can deny the epic awesomeness of the battle between Spidey and Morlun, which spanned over a few issues. I had never seen Peter so scared to face someone.... maybe Dr Doom.

[classicgmer]

Like Morlun, the retcons done to Ben Reilly have been questionable in terms of effectiveness.

Although I'd argue with Ben Reilly there is good that can come of this, Morlun just needs to go away as while it's an interesting idea, in practice he is the weakest and quite frankly dumbest Spider-man villain.

What good do you feel that can come from the recent developments for Ben? I'm genuinely curious as I'm personally not seeing anything interesting that can come from all of this.

[Scarlet-Spider]

Morlun has been in exactly one good Spidey story and it came out over 17 years ago, which of course was 'Coming Home.'

Even then I didn't like the silly and convoluted animal totem stuff that seemed to come out of nowhere. But no one can deny the epic awesomeness of the battle between Spidey and Morlun, which spanned over a few issues. I had never seen Peter so scared to face someone.... maybe Dr Doom.

The Other was of course complete garbage but Spider-Verse was fun. Seeing all these different Spider-Man was a great concept.

[LordUltimus]

Wait, I thought Mephisto was locked up and Johnny Blaze was ruling Hell now.

[SuperiorIronman]

What good do you feel that can come from the recent developments for Ben? I'm genuinely curious as I'm personally not seeing anything interesting that can come from all of this.

The good that can come from Ben is his Jackal persona.

In this case Ben could be pushed for to the max fueled by his desire to do good and the Jackal spices things up because it adds a new layer chaotic good. It gives Ben a fresh perspective to newer readers in that Ben is more inclined to do whatever is necessary to save the day and that's at odds with the kind of person Ben comes from. I'm not saying make him a villain, what I'm saying is that the Jackal can offer a way to turn Ben up to 11. I don't like the villainous layer, but the Jackal aspects have potential in Ben to make him a more active presence and push real change that Peter doesn't seem capable of creating.

We also have the cloning aspects which offer interesting story turns like;
Transgenderism
Body image
Health crisis
Transhumanism (would that count if it's replacing it with advanced human parts and not robotics?)
The nature of the soul (which I find to simplistic than what we got offered)
Resurrecting the dead properly
Ending hunger

There are places to go this comic and Clone Conspiracy frustratingly ignore.

Sure it's ignoring this comic run and clone conspiracy outside of his revival, but there is good to be done here with Ben that I don't feel sweeping Ben to the side would do him justice.