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  1. #61
    Astonishing Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Robe Jaldari View Post
    Your exoperience? Hi George.
    Depends on the people behind it.[/QUOTE]

    Sorry, but I don't really understand your response.
    Doctor Strange: "You are the right person to replace Logan."
    X-23: "I know there are people who disapprove... Guys on the Internet mainly."
    (All-New Wolverine #4)

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celgress View Post
    If anything original I ever create becomes popular I'd be so happy if anyone posts anything offensive on my social media I'd be like - "so you're familiar with my work, keep on buying". If they want to hate buy just to complain let them. Many creators and people in the industry have thin skins today and should stay away from political or social commentary posting if they can't exercise restraint.
    The thing is-a LOT of these guys are NOT buying the stuff in question.

    There is a guy on youtube who TRASHED Star Wars Last Jedi-eventually someone flat out asked him.
    "You just did a video BEGGING for money to get a hair cut-how did you get money to see Star Wars Last Jedi?"
    The reply-
    "I didn't see it-I base my opinions on the trailers."

    And he didn't do ONE video he did over 10.
    Oh he did that same thing to Black Panther movie 20 times with personal attacks to Ryan Coogler.
    He called Dynamite Comics low quality and hasn't read a single book.
    He has not read a Marvel book in 20 years and constantly trashed every single employee-especially WOMEN.


    The guy who doesn't bother to research yet feels entitled to harass and encourage witch hunts. Including creating FAKE and BAD reviews of one's work.
    That is playing with a creator's MONEY.

    And in the END the FAN looks bad not the creator because LOL they can find work. But those troll fans make it HARDER for the rest of us. Because other creators are going to be less likely to interact with fans.

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyvolt2000 View Post
    The thing is-a LOT of these guys are NOT buying the stuff in question.

    There is a guy on youtube who TRASHED Star Wars Last Jedi-eventually someone flat out asked him.
    "You just did a video BEGGING for money to get a hair cut-how did you get money to see Star Wars Last Jedi?"
    The reply-
    "I didn't see it-I base my opinions on the trailers."

    And he didn't do ONE video he did over 10.
    Oh he did that same thing to Black Panther movie 20 times with personal attacks to Ryan Coogler.
    He called Dynamite Comics low quality and hasn't read a single book.
    He has not read a Marvel book in 20 years and constantly trashed every single employee-especially WOMEN.


    The guy who doesn't bother to research yet feels entitled to harass and encourage witch hunts. Including creating FAKE and BAD reviews of one's work.
    That is playing with a creator's MONEY.

    And in the END the FAN looks bad not the creator because LOL they can find work. But those troll fans make it HARDER for the rest of us. Because other creators are going to be less likely to interact with fans.
    It's like I said before, the whole "anti-SJW Star Wars" thing is just low hanging fruit. The use of words like "SJW", "Star Wars", "Marvel" in video titles will always get hits because of google's (and by extension youtube's) algorithm, folks are just saying a lot of stuff to make a quick buck even when what they are saying is utter rubbish.

    It's simple and lazy criticism, i don't like a movie- "it's minorities and women", i can't get a job- "it's illegal immigrants" (who hardly get skilled jobs), i don't like Star Wars- "it's SJWs AND women AND minorities"! i don't like a game- "it's SJWs". One can disagree with creative choices (like i do with the Last Jedi) and not turn everything into a political rant. It's so bad that some folks go and review bomb movies they've never even seen like how Black Panther was review bombed before it even released (check IMDB, there is literally no movie with a predominantly black cast that has a score above 8).

    But to your larger point, a lot of fandom has become VERY toxic and it's made interacting with creators and even fellow fans very difficult. A couple of months ago, the "Comicsgate" crowd invaded CBR only for the moderators to completely shut down and ban all "Comicsgate" related discussions. The Star Wars forums across the internet have witnessed similar issues and it's turned discussions about any Disney Star Wars related material into cluster f*&!ks and this ultimately hurts us as fans too. The "outrage" culture is pretty disgusting and these trolls are ultimately making things difficult for everyone but ultimately creators need to ignore these trolls. If said trolls become too threatening, then said trolls should be blocked and/or report to the police (for the idiots that issue death threats).
    "Obviously not all conservatives are racists/bigots but all racists/bigots claim to be conservative"- Unknown

  4. #64
    Astonishing Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Username taken View Post
    It's like I said before, the whole "anti-SJW Star Wars" thing is just low hanging fruit. The use of words like "SJW", "Star Wars", "Marvel" in video titles will always get hits because of google's (and by extension youtube's) algorithm, folks are just saying a lot of stuff to make a quick buck even when what they are saying is utter rubbish.
    Yeah, from my personal experience, I have never seen a legitimate argument based on an "anti-SJW" perspective; it's all

    Quote Originally Posted by Username taken View Post
    It's simple and lazy criticism, i don't like a movie- "it's minorities and women", i can't get a job- "it's illegal immigrants" (who hardly get skilled jobs), i don't like Star Wars- "it's SJWs AND women AND minorities"! i don't like a game- "it's SJWs".
    Yeah, saw a TLJ "review" on YouTube that was just all this on autoplay. Learned nothing about the movie but I learned more then I ever wanted to know about the anger, hate, and bigotry that the "reviewer" in question carried in their heart. Seen plenty of others just like it (on Star Wars and other stuff). The thing that gets me about this, esp. with the "Star Wars has become SJW" garbage, is that Star Wars has always had that angle from the get go, long before Disney started making it. Watching people claim that Disney has disgraced the original movies and whine and moan over stuff that they praised in the original movies is a special kind of lack of self-awareness that has to be seen to believed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Username taken View Post
    One can disagree with creative choices (like i do with the Last Jedi) and not turn everything into a political rant. It's so bad that some folks go and review bomb movies they've never even seen like how Black Panther was review bombed before it even released (check IMDB, there is literally no movie with a predominantly black cast that has a score above 8).
    The internet is indeed a wretched hive of scum and villainy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Username taken View Post
    But to your larger point, a lot of fandom has become VERY toxic and it's made interacting with creators and even fellow fans very difficult. A couple of months ago, the "Comicsgate" crowd invaded CBR only for the moderators to completely shut down and ban all "Comicsgate" related discussions.
    Remember that. I agree with the decision on the grounds of denying a known hate group a platform to spread their crap. On the other hand, I find the subject quite interesting and do wish there was a place to discuss it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Username taken View Post
    The Star Wars forums across the internet have witnessed similar issues and it's turned discussions about any Disney Star Wars related material into cluster f*&!ks and this ultimately hurts us as fans too. The "outrage" culture is pretty disgusting and these trolls are ultimately making things difficult for everyone but ultimately creators need to ignore these trolls. If said trolls become too threatening, then said trolls should be blocked and/or report to the police (for the idiots that issue death threats).
    I belong to a Star Wars forum as well. While it's is one of the best-mannered ones I belong to, they did have to crack down a bit on ill-behavior after TLJ came out. Kinda surprised it's as civil as it is, given how toxic a fandom Star Wars is.

    In terms of when to ignore tolls and when to speak against them, I've heard it both ways. Unfortunately, Comicsgate and the militant Star Wars haters seem to be self-perpetuating at this point. Kinda seems like any method of dealing with them just emboldens them to go further and further with their attacks.
    Doctor Strange: "You are the right person to replace Logan."
    X-23: "I know there are people who disapprove... Guys on the Internet mainly."
    (All-New Wolverine #4)

  5. #65
    Fantastic Member Red Robe Jaldari's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    Here is a clip of Patton Oswald joking about how he wanted to kill George Lucas



    Sure, this was played for laughs. But even back then, it was somewhat distasteful when I first heard it. Criticize him, halt his projects, have someone help him out. That's one thing. But this was something else entire else entirely. This was someone joking about taking another human being's life because they made some bad films. And no one called this out. I can't imagine this joke would fly today. Especially in light of how the SW fandom has acted.

    And this is just what was done to Lucas. Jake Lloyd got bullied out of an acting career. Ahmed Best actually contemplated suicide because of the harassment and bullying he suffered for playing Jar Jar Binks. And no one called this out. This is the type of toxicity and fan entitlement that weblurker was referring to. All of this was a precursor to what the cast and crew of the Sequel Trilogy are enduring. Fans didn't clamp down in this behavior when it was at its infancy and now decades later we're suffering the consequences of that apathy.
    And 1 and a half year fron now it might fly like Superman.

    Jake Lloyd still worked in the industry. I don't know if he has talent as actor or not.

    Who did what that was so bad to Ahmed Best? I mean he came back to play jar Jar in the Clone Wars. He must not have hated the character that much.

    Quote Originally Posted by WebLurker View Post
    Depends on the people behind it.
    Sorry, but I don't really understand your response.[/QUOTE]

    The arts community is not sending Star Wars their best.

  6. #66
    Incredible Member kjn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WebLurker View Post
    In terms of when to ignore tolls and when to speak against them, I've heard it both ways. Unfortunately, Comicsgate and the militant Star Wars haters seem to be self-perpetuating at this point. Kinda seems like any method of dealing with them just emboldens them to go further and further with their attacks.
    There is at least one fannish group that managed to shut down a hate group assault, when the Sad Puppies and the Vox Day-led Rabid Puppies tried to take over the Hugo awards from old-school science fiction fandom. But it depended on both that old-school sf fandom is well-organised and with a long history for being a fannish group, and that the Puppies overreached.

    I can recommend reading Zoe Quinn's book Crash Override for an overview and collation of various advice on how to deal with Internet trolls and hate groups. It concerns itself with Gamergate, but there is plenty of overlap between these groups, and their tactics are the same.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Robe Jaldari View Post
    And 1 and a half year fron now it might fly like Superman.
    I doubt that highly.

    Jake Lloyd still worked in the industry. I don't know if he has talent as actor or not.
    Nothing to do with my point.

    Who did what that was so bad to Ahmed Best? I mean he came back to play jar Jar in the Clone Wars. He must not have hated the character that much.
    And neither does this. Best playing the character again does not erase the harassment he faced

  8. #68
    Astonishing Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Robe Jaldari View Post
    And 1 and a half year fron now it might fly like Superman.

    Jake Lloyd still worked in the industry. I don't know if he has talent as actor or not.

    Who did what that was so bad to Ahmed Best? I mean he came back to play jar Jar in the Clone Wars. He must not have hated the character that much.



    Sorry, but I don't really understand your response.
    The arts community is not sending Star Wars their best.[/QUOTE]

    Huh?
    Doctor Strange: "You are the right person to replace Logan."
    X-23: "I know there are people who disapprove... Guys on the Internet mainly."
    (All-New Wolverine #4)

  9. #69
    Cosmic Cowboy Scoke's Avatar
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    Freedom of speech is not freedom from consequence. It's not always worth opening your mouth.
    Last edited by Conn Seanery; 10-26-2018 at 01:54 PM. Reason: ironic...

  10. #70
    Astonishing Member ChrisIII's Avatar
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    Regarding Lucas, he's largely (wisely?) has stayed away from social media (and apart from showing up at some Star Wars events and film sets, largely is out of the spotlight these days). His daughter, Katie, did have some harsh words for fans on twitter a few years ago (I don't think her twitter's there anymore though).


    Funny thing regarding Jake Lloyd, backlash kind of started a bit early, with rumors of his performance on set started to leak. So much that Ron Howard actually sent a letter to Newsweek about it:


    https://www.inverse.com/article/3345...999-jake-lloyd
    Last edited by ChrisIII; 10-26-2018 at 01:03 PM.
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  11. #71
    Fantastic Member ClanAskani's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisIII View Post
    Regarding Lucas, he's largely (wisely?) has stayed away from social media (and apart from showing up at some Star Wars events and film sets, largely is out of the spotlight these days). His daughter, Katie, did have some harsh words for fans on twitter a few years ago (I don't think her twitter's there anymore though).


    Funny thing regarding Jake Lloyd, backlash kind of started a bit early, with rumors of his performance on set started to leak. So much that Ron Howard actually sent a letter to Newsweek about it:


    https://www.inverse.com/article/3345...999-jake-lloyd

    It's terrible the way Jake was treated but I want to point out - he wasn't going to conventions and being called names by fans. He was bullied by his own classmates at school. Adult fans may have been bashing him online, but he wasn't going to TFN and reading what people were posting about him on forums. And there were plenty of people who actually were defending me (I was one of them). But his classmates were brutal. That's the same problem many of us faced at school, but it's not the fault of Star Wars fans.

    Other child actors were bullied by classmates enough that they gave up acting. For example, James Badge Dale (best know for his role in Iron Man 2) quit acting when he was a child because his classmates bullied him about appearing in the Lord of the Flies remake where he mostly wore just his underwear. Does anyone attack Lord of the Flies fans who bash the remake for that (are there Lord of the Flies fans?).

    What I dislike is the percent instance that Star Wars fans were the ones harassing Jake Lloyd like adult fans were going to his house and yelling at him that he sucked as Anakin. Star Wars fans can't be held responible for what Jake's classmates did.


    As for Chuck Wendig, I was looking forward so much to the Aftermath books and was so disappointed by how poorly they were written. So I have no problem with him being fired. I really am tired of my Twitter feed being nothing but political tweets when I mostly follow people involved in comics, music and entertainment.
    Last edited by ClanAskani; 10-26-2018 at 01:59 PM.

  12. #72
    Astonishing Member ChrisIII's Avatar
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    Lloyd also suffers from mental illness as well.

    https://www.usmagazine.com/celebrity...eport-w202212/
    chrism227.wordpress.com Info and opinions on a variety of interests.

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  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by ClanAskani View Post
    It's terrible the way Jake was treated but I want to point out - he wasn't going to conventions and being called names by fans. He was bullied by his own classmates at school. Adult fans may have been bashing him online, but he wasn't going to TFN and reading what people were posting about him on forums. And there were plenty of people who actually were defending me (I was one of them). But his classmates were brutal. That's the same problem many of us faced at school, but it's not the fault of Star Wars fans.

    Other child actors were bullied by classmates enough that they gave up acting. For example, James Badge Dale (best know for his role in Iron Man 2) quit acting when he was a child because his classmates bullied him about appearing in the Lord of the Flies remake where he mostly wore just his underwear. Does anyone attack Lord of the Flies fans who bash the remake for that (are there Lord of the Flies fans?).

    What I dislike is the percent instance that Star Wars fans were the ones harassing Jake Lloyd like adult fans were going to his house and yelling at him that he sucked as Anakin. Star Wars fans can't be held responible for what Jake's classmates did.


    As for Chuck Wendig, I was looking forward so much to the Aftermath books and was so disappointed by how poorly they were written. So I have no problem with him being fired. I really am tired of my Twitter feed being nothing but political tweets when I mostly follow people involved in comics, music and entertainment.
    What makes you think Lloyd’s classmates weren’t Star Wars fans?

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