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Thread: Dark Phoenix

  1. #721
    Extraordinary Member Jokerz79's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Shape View Post
    The link says that the studio executives are the reason why Jean didn’t have much to do.



    Infusing it with Gifted wouldn’t have necessarily not have it at center stage. Ragnarok still took center stage in Thor 3 despite being infused with Planet Hulk for instance.
    Except Planet Hulk suffered I get the real world issues why Planet Hulk was used and I loved Thor Ragnarok is was glorious fun. But Planet Hulk got the shaft just like Dark Phoenix it always happens when you try to jam multiple storylines together like how the Death of Superman had no real emotional impact because it was jammed into an already bloated movie.
    Last edited by Jokerz79; 03-02-2019 at 12:43 PM.

  2. #722
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hellion View Post
    A true adaptation of the Dark Phoenix Saga was never in the cards for the FOX X-franchise. They never set the grounds for the cosmic portion of the story....

    ...A proper Dark Phoenix Saga adaptation was never gonna happen with FOX because they've never cared enough to craft a consistent narrative throughout its franchise, let alone slowly build up and expand upon its fictional world.
    And that's why I'm glad Disney is getting further control of its intellectual property back such as the X-Men in this deal with Fox. Fox hasn't demonstrated it cares at all about crafting these movies into something fans could enjoy like we like the MCU, whatever its faults. The X-Men will be in better hands in the MCU.

  3. #723
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    I'm actually glad they never went with aliens and space etc because it undermines core themes of the X-men.

    "We're persecuted and hated by humanity to an insane xenophobic level"
    "You have a spaceship and space station tech, just terraform a new world dammit!"

  4. #724
    Astonishing Member CRaymond's Avatar
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    May the Shi’Ar never be found on film.

  5. #725
    Extraordinary Member The Shape's Avatar
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    This has been some for week for Sophie Turner. Dark Phoenix trailer released, Jonas Brothers music video with her in it released, and Game of Thrones posters released.
    Last edited by The Shape; 03-03-2019 at 02:12 PM.

  6. #726
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetengine View Post
    I'm actually glad they never went with aliens and space etc because it undermines core themes of the X-men.

    "We're persecuted and hated by humanity to an insane xenophobic level"
    "You have a spaceship and space station tech, just terraform a new world dammit!"
    Quote Originally Posted by CRaymond View Post
    May the Shi’Ar never be found on film.
    Oh, come on! That's where the fun and adventure can be found!

    Yes, it has almost nothing to do with the core themes of the X-Men, but that's where it gets big, messy, sloppy and Claremonty! It doesnt make a lot of sense, I admit it. But that's where it gets so cool, with Scott's dad and the Starjammers, Deathbird, Phoenix and all the rest.

  7. #727
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian B View Post
    Oh, come on! That's where the fun and adventure can be found!

    Yes, it has almost nothing to do with the core themes of the X-Men, but that's where it gets big, messy, sloppy and Claremonty! It doesnt make a lot of sense, I admit it. But that's where it gets so cool, with Scott's dad and the Starjammers, Deathbird, Phoenix and all the rest.
    In fact, for me it's a part of what makes the X-Men what it is. Science fiction is part of what make good X-Men stories, and Space-opera is part of it!

  8. #728
    Extraordinary Member The Shape's Avatar
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    Wow, they really adapted this scene.



  9. #729
    Astonishing Member Killerbee911's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian B View Post
    Oh, come on! That's where the fun and adventure can be found!

    Yes, it has almost nothing to do with the core themes of the X-Men, but that's where it gets big, messy, sloppy and Claremonty! It doesnt make a lot of sense, I admit it. But that's where it gets so cool, with Scott's dad and the Starjammers, Deathbird, Phoenix and all the rest.
    I am going to second this

    The core themes of the X-men is also just superhero stuff, Stan Lee created the X-men because he didn't want to do superhero origins for powers anymore and he put down a thin veil of core themes we see today,Claremont and others who flesh X-men as metaphor for minorities and add in the nuances that made it great. But X-men is meant to be just as much Superhero comic as the Avengers or Justice League as it about deeper themes about persecution, hate/fear and fighting for survival. Part of the reason X-men struggling today is because they are stuck infinite loop of them fighting for survival in a marvel universe that has the Avengers and others living comfortably.

    X-men is survival, mutant affairs and mutant powers. But X-men is also fights against Demons, Aliens, Killer Robots from the future, Living Islands, going to place where time forgot, Fighting Dracula, Fighting villains with other superheroes, etc. X-men is not just Hard sci fi concept

  10. #730
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    Their imcompatable though frankly.

    You cannot have the theme of "Struggle with social justice" sit in the same box as "Space Alien fights on another planet" it renders one or the other moot.

  11. #731
    Astonishing Member Killerbee911's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetengine View Post
    Their imcompatable though frankly.

    You cannot have the theme of "Struggle with social justice" sit in the same box as "Space Alien fights on another planet" it renders one or the other moot.
    No it doesn't the fiction has aliens. The fiction had aliens from the beginning Lucifer was alien, Mutant Master from Factor three was an Alien,Apocalypse is Celestial powered, etc. Your idea of X-men fiction is just wrong from the beginning the X-men has been fighting the Brotherhood, Unus, Vanisher,etc and the X-men have been fighting the Puppet Master, Count Nefaria, Lucifer, Mayan God, Kukulcan,Super-Adaptoid, Mole Man and Tyrannus. That is the fiction Stan Lee intend the creator intended.

    Fans like to come along and pretend X-men is this hard sci fi concept and trying to remove what they think is whackier elements but X-men has been off wall big sci fi /fantasy. X-men has fighting Aliens, Hyborian Wizards, Demons and Robots. if Stan Lee had done nothing with aliens and then someone had come along add aliens you might have a point. The aliens have always been compatible because that was the intend fiction Lucifer, Z'Nox ,Mutant Master are aliens. Stuff like Magic Demon Bear,Belacaso and Adversary are part of X-men, Stuff like Dracula and Monsters are part of X-men.

  12. #732
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    No I'm saying that thematically you cannot have both, I dont particularly care what started first nor can you read my mind and claim that I 'interpret them wrong'.

    I mean I personally dislike the space shit but if it works better then social justice then they need to jettison it quickly. Having both stretches the SOD in a franchisr that already suffers badly from it.

  13. #733
    Astonishing Member CRaymond's Avatar
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    I don’t mind aliens as antagonists when thier motivations sum up to exploiting mutants of Earth as a foreign resource. The Brood are basically the whites from Get Out. Extra-dimensional creatures like Stramger Things’ demogorgon works because it’s a threat discovered BY the exploitation of mutant powers. When you can use aliens to help tell a social story, it works.

  14. #734
    Astonishing Member Killerbee911's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetengine View Post
    No I'm saying that thematically you cannot have both, I dont particularly care what started first nor can you read my mind and claim that I 'interpret them wrong'.

    I mean I personally dislike the space shit but if it works better then social justice then they need to jettison it quickly. Having both stretches the SOD in a franchisr that already suffers badly from it.
    Thematically X-men does both so therefore you can have both. It is one thing to dislike or prefer it certain way , Everyone is allow freedom to like what they like about X-men that is fine. It is completely different thing say the X-men can't be about racial issue and space aliens at the same time ignoring it is that and it is designed to be that by the creator. The Fiction dictates what it is and not people going it can't be that it is like saying you can't make a movie about Abraham lincoln slaying vampires or You can't do a victorian period piece with zombies, or you can't have a franchise about race cars turn into franchise about superheroes. Saying can't be is not both is not understanding that X-men isn't type of genre to think it is and X-men doesn't adhere to strict rules that allows to have aliens and still be in tone it wants.

    YOU want X-men strictly adhere to a one tone, but X-men tone is bunch of genres and that is what it wants to be. The X-men movie universe taking stricter hard tone is fine that is their choice,Just like it will be fine when X-men is part of MCU and take on the tone of the MCU universe which now has more lose tone than when it started and Gods where space aliens because they wanted to be more serious.
    Last edited by Killerbee911; 03-04-2019 at 05:32 AM.

  15. #735
    King of Wakanda Midvillian1322's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    Thematically X-men does both so therefore you can have both. It is one thing to dislike or prefer it certain way , Everyone is allow freedom to like what they like about X-men that is fine. It is completely different thing say the X-men can't be about racial issue and space aliens at the same time ignoring it is that and it is designed to be that by the creator. The Fiction dictates what it is and not people going it can't be that it is like saying you can't make a movie about Abraham lincoln slaying vampires or You can't do a victorian period piece with zombies, or you can't have a franchise about race cars turn into franchise about superheroes. Saying can't be is not both is not understanding that X-men isn't type of genre to think it is and X-men doesn't adhere to strict rules that allows to have aliens and still be in tone it wants.

    YOU want X-men strictly adhere to a one tone, but X-men tone is bunch of genres and that is what it wants to be. The X-men movie universe taking stricter hard tone is fine that is their choice,Just like it will be fine when X-men is part of MCU and take on the tone of the MCU universe
    I don't think the MCU has a tone. I mean Captain America --- Dr strange-- Black Panther-- Spidey/Ironman---- Antman----Thor/Guardians... I mean all these movie spreads across the spectrum imo. One of the praises Infinity War got was the blending of tones while still keeping the character true to they'r solo films. And l agree Xmen arent just one thing tonally. So they will probaly spread the spectrum.

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