What would it take for a New Avengers level type shake up

[comicstar100]

Way back when Disassembled had just ended and New Avengers started with Breakout it was huge. The roster shake up completely revamped the Avengers line. What would it take to have that level of shake up for the Avengers team now? I feel like at this point just about everyone has been part of the team, I'm not sure if a roster shake up would be enough.

[Digifiend]

Yeah, that relaunch added both Wolverine and Spider-Man, who were Marvel's most popular characters at the time. Before then, the Avengers had been the second stringers, and weren't even the most popular team - that was the X-Men. Even though the team now is mostly a traditional lineup, with She-Hulk instead of Banner and one rookie in the shape of Ghost Rider, that line-up, which may have considered second stringers a decade ago, is now mostly popular characters, thanks to the movies (Jennifer is the only one who's not in the MCU, as Robbie was on Agents of SHIELD).

I think at this point, a team similar to ANAD Avengers (i.e. mostly not classic Avengers, Iron Man and Vision were the only classics) would be the biggest way to shake it up - the reason that team was shortlived (just a year) wasn't because of sales, it was because they had the team split in two, with the launch of Champions. The team's second roster was still untraditional, since the characters that replaced the Champions trio and Iron Man were another kid hero (Unstoppable Wasp) who later ended up also becoming a Champion, one more traditional Avenger in the form of Hercules, and a like for like swap in the form of Spider-Man. That second lineup would've come to natural conclusion a few months ago even without No Surrender, due to Jane Foster's depowering, Peter losing his money and thus the team's headquarters (he actually left between No Surrender and the previous arc, Worlds Collide, meaning his last appearance as an Avenger was in Champions) and Nadia joining the other teens.

[Rosebunse]

Wait...you're Jason Aaron, aren't you? You want to get a kill list together and go on a Bendis level murder spree, don't you?

Honestly, I feel like the person who pulls the team together is more Stark than anyone else. Take him off the map now and watch it fall.

Also murder Thor.

[Digifiend]

True. It was Tony who re-established the team in ANAD. First he recruited Sam Wilson, then Vision, and then the four rookies - Jane Foster, Kamala Khan, Miles Morales and Sam Alexander. Normally those four wouldn't have made the team, because they kept their identities secret (even Peter Parker was forced to out himself to his team back in Bendis's run) and because three of them were still at school (Rage was once expelled being underage). When Civil War II happened, Tony ended up in a coma, prompting Sam to take over leadership. With Kamala, Miles, and Nova leaving to form the Champions, FalCap had some recruiting to do. He brought in Hercules, promoted the recently arrived Nadia to full membership, and then Peter Parker invited himself by providing a base. Later, after Secret Empire, Sam had a crisis of confidence, feeling he was only leader because he was Captain America, and since he was no longer Cap, he no longer deserved to stay in charge. He asked Thor - who, remember, was Jane Foster, a relative rookie - to take over, but she literally knocked some sense into him by putting her helmet on his head and whacking him with her hammer! Even though he was no longer Cap, he was still the most suitable leader. Spider-Man and Unstoppable Wasp weren't getting along because Peter Parker had lost their HQ (she didn't know Peter and Spidey were the same person, and ended up housing the team at GIRL), and after Worlds Collide, Nadia joined the Champions - intending to be on both teams - and Peter quit. But then No Surrender led to the already decimated team's disbanding (they were about to lose Jane as well), which prompted a recently returned Tony to assemble the current roster.

[gurkle]

I don't think it's possible.

"Avengers Disassembled" was possible because of two things specific to the Avengers at the time: there were some famous characters who had never been Avengers (Spider-Man was a reservist but had never actually been on the roster). And there were a bunch of B and C-list characters who were very closely associated with the Avengers and who had been in the book almost nonstop since the 1960s.

Vision, Scarlet Witch, Hawkeye, Wasp and Hank Pym all went back to the 1960s with the Avengers, and they had been in the book consistently for years; the 1998 relaunch had Scarlet Witch and Vision on the roster and both of them were still on the active roster when Bendis took over; Hawkeye had just returned and Hank/Wasp were there too. He and Brevoort knew people were used to having them there, and that they'd probably been in the book for too long, and that it was time to signal a new approach by clearing out some of the nostalgic favorites that most comic fans (at the time) didn't really care about.

By taking those characters out of the book - and having Hawkeye and Vision both killed by the Scarlet Witch - and then bringing on Spider-Man and Wolverine, Bendis was able to show very clearly that this was not your traditionalist's Avengers book. Because traditionalists felt that at least some the classic B-listers should be on the team and that it would be wrong for Spider-Man and Wolverine to be Avengers. It was a provocative choice that got a lot of traditionalists angry while intriguing new fans, just as intended.

But because there have been so many Avengers books and Avengers teams since then, there's nothing they could really do to the Avengers to shake it up that way. It's not quite true that "everyone is an Avenger now" but it's certainly truer than it was. So they probably thought the ANAD team was going to be a big shakeup because it had so many newcomers, but it just didn't come off that way at all, it was just another team with three people who have been Avengers before and a few other people who haven't.

[Rosebunse]

I don't think it's possible.

"Avengers Disassembled" was possible because of two things specific to the Avengers at the time: there were some famous characters who had never been Avengers (Spider-Man was a reservist but had never actually been on the roster). And there were a bunch of B and C-list characters who were very closely associated with the Avengers and who had been in the book almost nonstop since the 1960s.

Vision, Scarlet Witch, Hawkeye, Wasp and Hank Pym all went back to the 1960s with the Avengers, and they had been in the book consistently for years; the 1998 relaunch had Scarlet Witch and Vision on the roster and both of them were still on the active roster when Bendis took over; Hawkeye had just returned and Hank/Wasp were there too. He and Brevoort knew people were used to having them there, and that they'd probably been in the book for too long, and that it was time to signal a new approach by clearing out some of the nostalgic favorites that most comic fans (at the time) didn't really care about.

By taking those characters out of the book - and having Hawkeye and Vision both killed by the Scarlet Witch - and then bringing on Spider-Man and Wolverine, Bendis was able to show very clearly that this was not your traditionalist's Avengers book. Because traditionalists felt that at least some the classic B-listers should be on the team and that it would be wrong for Spider-Man and Wolverine to be Avengers. It was a provocative choice that got a lot of traditionalists angry while intriguing new fans, just as intended.

But because there have been so many Avengers books and Avengers teams since then, there's nothing they could really do to the Avengers to shake it up that way. It's not quite true that "everyone is an Avenger now" but it's certainly truer than it was. So they probably thought the ANAD team was going to be a big shakeup because it had so many newcomers, but it just didn't come off that way at all, it was just another team with three people who have been Avengers before and a few other people who haven't.

This is probably the best response. At this point, it wouldn't be a surprise for anyone to be on the team. Maybe some really unconventional characters like Venom or...um...Morbius? Who actually was a reserve Avenger for a while anyways.

The Avengers are simply not in their own little bubble, but a rallying point for all of Marvel.

[Triniking1234]

Way back when Disassembled had just ended and New Avengers started with Breakout it was huge. The roster shake up completely revamped the Avengers line. What would it take to have that level of shake up for the Avengers team now? I feel like at this point just about everyone has been part of the team, I'm not sure if a roster shake up would be enough.

This. New Avengers only worked because so many wild cards joined the team. Even Deadpool was an Avenger.

I'm not sure anyone can pull that off again.