Was One More Day Pointless?

[boots]

But isn't the point of a single Spider-Man that he can be in more romantic relationships then he can if he's married? So if you don't emphasize that then what really is the point of a single Spider-Man unless the point is that Spider-Man shouldn't be so focused or tied down by romantic relationships (which I don't think OMD was going for)?

thats a possible answer, but that's a conclusion people draw just because "much dating" is sorta the assumed opposite to "very married"

there's a few other possibilities in between.

[Inversed]

But isn't the point of a single Spider-Man that he can be in more romantic relationships then he can if he's married? So if you don't emphasize that then what really is the point of a single Spider-Man unless the point is that Spider-Man shouldn't be so focused or tied down by romantic relationships (which I don't think OMD was going for)?

I think alot of the writers don't like the idea of Spider-Man/Peter being tied down to being in a relationship because it "limits" the character. You don't have to worry about fitting the romantic interest into every story, you can just have Peter doing whatever he wants all alone or with whatever supporting character you need for that specific story. I would personally disagree with that sentiment that it would be "limiting", but I can understand how some writers may feel that way, how they may want to write him paired up for a story or two before wanting to move on to something else.

I do agree that OMD wasn't going for "Spider-Man shouldn't be so focused or tied down by romantic relationships" but by the time BND started and the writers room put their input in, I think that's the verdict they eventually came to.

[Frontier]

I think alot of the writers don't like the idea of Spider-Man/Peter being tied down to being in a relationship because it "limits" the character. You don't have to worry about fitting the romantic interest into every story, you can just have Peter doing whatever he wants all alone or with whatever supporting character you need for that specific story. I would personally disagree with that sentiment that it would be "limiting", but I can understand how some writers may feel that way, how they may want to write him paired up for a story or two before wanting to move on to something else.

I do agree that OMD wasn't going for "Spider-Man shouldn't be so focused or tied down by romantic relationships" but by the time BND started and the writers room put their input in, I think that's the verdict they eventually came to.

I can only see it as "limiting" if the writers don't want to have to deal with or write Mary Jane, but if their stories are going to focus more on stuff other then Peter's romantic life then I don't see what difference it makes whether he's married or not if stuff like that aren't going to be as much of a factor in a writer's story aside from maybe a cursory line or two.

I guess they want to leave the door open for "possible" or "potential" romances but these days those don't seem to amount to very much or have any meaningful role in the story.

[Miles To Go]

The daily strip has managed to tell some pretty cool Peter/MJ stories in the last decade without the need to angst up the relationship too. MJ's been involved with the likes of Doctor Strange and Black Widow and made some pretty big steps forward in her career. With her theatre having been destroyed in the recent storyline, it'll be interesting to see what fresh challenge she and Peter face together

[bob.schoonover]

I think alot of the writers don't like the idea of Spider-Man/Peter being tied down to being in a relationship because it "limits" the character. You don't have to worry about fitting the romantic interest into every story, you can just have Peter doing whatever he wants all alone or with whatever supporting character you need for that specific story. I would personally disagree with that sentiment that it would be "limiting", but I can understand how some writers may feel that way, how they may want to write him paired up for a story or two before wanting to move on to something else.

I do agree that OMD wasn't going for "Spider-Man shouldn't be so focused or tied down by romantic relationships" but by the time BND started and the writers room put their input in, I think that's the verdict they eventually came to.

I think the supporting cast is a pretty big part of it. There are some really rough MJ subplots post-marriage because the writers (presumably) felt the need to give her page space. If you want to tell a big Peter/Harry story and start seeding the next big villain arc, you don't want to lose two pages each issue establishing MJ's new job/crisis. He can just be between girlfriends for that arc, easy peezy (the huge plotting advantage of dating vs marriage is the ease with which you can suddenly not be dating).

There's also some two-body problem issues w/Peter's income level, living situation, etc. If you look at the end of Slott's ASM run, Peter goes from billionaire to penniless overnight (Big Time started in essentially the opposite manner). If Peter's married and you want him to become penniless, you have to have established why MJ's not doing anything to make money (and why Peter wasn't looking out for her at all when he bankrupted himself). Also, it'd be more awkward if both of them were sleeping on Bobbi's couch. That's not to say one can't tell that story or anything, but it just takes precious real estate to set up MJ's situation when that's not the driving force of your plot.

[Miles To Go]

I think the supporting cast is a pretty big part of it. There are some really rough MJ subplots post-marriage because the writers (presumably) felt the need to give her page space. If you want to tell a big Peter/Harry story and start seeding the next big villain arc, you don't want to lose two pages each issue establishing MJ's new job/crisis. He can just be between girlfriends for that arc, easy peezy (the huge plotting advantage of dating vs marriage is the ease with which you can suddenly not be dating).

What's wrong with that exactly? People are likely to be more invested in something happening to a character everyone LIKES as opposed to a dry and uninteresting person Peter is seeing. MJ didn't get over with fans because she was neglected for Peter's own problems, she got over with fans because she got a good amount of focus.

Nobody should be reading comics for an "easy time" and easy relationships. People enjoy complication.

Those "rough" subplots are what made MJ compelling as she had her own struggles that paralleled Peters'. Real life is full of struggles for both partners in a relationship.

And Peter had plenty of his best stories with Harry while the writers gave MJ page space. As a matter of fact, Peter hasn't had any interesting stories with Harry since they stopped.

[jetengine]

I think the supporting cast is a pretty big part of it. There are some really rough MJ subplots post-marriage because the writers (presumably) felt the need to give her page space. If you want to tell a big Peter/Harry story and start seeding the next big villain arc, you don't want to lose two pages each issue establishing MJ's new job/crisis. He can just be between girlfriends for that arc, easy peezy (the huge plotting advantage of dating vs marriage is the ease with which you can suddenly not be dating).

There's also some two-body problem issues w/Peter's income level, living situation, etc. If you look at the end of Slott's ASM run, Peter goes from billionaire to penniless overnight (Big Time started in essentially the opposite manner). If Peter's married and you want him to become penniless, you have to have established why MJ's not doing anything to make money (and why Peter wasn't looking out for her at all when he bankrupted himself). Also, it'd be more awkward if both of them were sleeping on Bobbi's couch. That's not to say one can't tell that story or anything, but it just takes precious real estate to set up MJ's situation when that's not the driving force of your plot.

Your literally making excuses for writers being lazy or unimaginative.

[LK3185]

The last 10 years showed me that writers are lazy and didn't want Peter Parker to be tied down to anyone so Spider-man could play with all the toys... Except that's not what Peter Parker was set out to be. I don't really care if they just had split up MJ and Peter.. Not every marriage has to last, but you have to add the personal angst.. Not just professional.. The more issues Peter has, with everything and juggling everything in his life, makes for a more interesting character and what Stan Lee created.

Also, Superior Spider-man would be an enhanced by MJ being involved. Okay, maybe she calls bullshit early on, but how does Superior Otto deal with that and his marriage? maybe falling for MJ makes Otto a better person.. There's alot of places could have gone.

Status quo changes happen all the time, but I think the core character should stay roughly consistent and you play around with the edges.

[Bor]

Nice to see you didn't explain why whatsoever.


The idea the main universe is "more important" is such an antiquated concept in the light of Spider-Gwen and the Spider-Verse elements in cartoons, video games, and the movies. Any universe is just as important, and in such universes, the marriage has been in play for a decade and hasn't been gone at all.

Neither did you? Funny how I have to but you dont. Plenty of examples have been given by others including superior and the dating stories and your response boiled down to: They would have been he same or better with the marrige. Blank statement without any supstance.

You might feel the main universe is an antiquated concept but that is still the main selling title and always will be. I doubt even most post OMD haters will refuse that. OMD would never have been such a big problem if it had been an elseworld or what if story. Thats he truth.

[bob.schoonover]

Your literally making excuses for writers being lazy or unimaginative.

Hardly. Writers all have their own preferences for what they want to write. Look at when Roger Stern and Bill Mantlo left ASM/SSM in the 80s - the new teams ditched grad school + Deb Whitman, et al., brought MJ back (giving her a new backstory, to boot!), started the Alien Costume Saga, and pushed Aunt May and her geriatric halfway house off to the side by making her mad that Peter quit school. Huge change to the status quo so that the new creative teams could focus on the characters and plots they wanted to. Were they lazy and unimaginative, or did they just have different interests?

In other books, Scott Snyder didn't have Catwoman appear (almost?) at all in his Batman run, then Tom King's has a heavy dose of Catwoman in the following run. Snyder used Gordon a ton, King less so. Morrison was heavy on new villains and no love interest. Rucka's Wonder Woman focused heavily on Cheetah and Steve Trevor, Robinson was more interested in the Darkseid connection. When James Robinson left Cable (the most recent time), his mission changed substantially. JMS's ASM run is ridiculously different from Mackie's. Look at how all the X-books changed w/new creative teams after the Age of Apocalypse! A huge number of creative team shifts result in changes to the cast and status quo of the main characters. My point is that the wholesale changes that come very often with creative team shifts are easier to pull off with MJ and Peter not married. It's easier to tell a "Peter is broke" story w/o having to explain why MJ can't work, too. That doesn't make the writer lazy; it could very well be the writer and/or editorial thinks "MJ lost the modeling job because someone else was younger" isn't a story the readers care about (one example of such a reader: me). Not wanting to ruin the pace of your story to check in on MJ's nightclub is not necessarily lazy; it means you have a specific cadence to the story you want to tell and you find that subplot a drag.

Why does easier matter? Well, it gives writers more freedom to tell the stories they want to tell. It's commercial art, but it's still art, and the fewer constraints on the artist, the better (well, when the artist is talented, but people generally don't think they're hiring untalented people, so. . . ). You can often tell when a writer isn't particularly interested in the crossover/event they've been roped into, and it's the same with supporting characters the writer has no affinity for.

[marhawkman]

But isn't the point of a single Spider-Man that he can be in more romantic relationships then he can if he's married? So if you don't emphasize that then what really is the point of a single Spider-Man unless the point is that Spider-Man shouldn't be so focused or tied down by romantic relationships (which I don't think OMD was going for)?

Some people write Spidey as a guy who just doesn't bother with romance... or personal relationships...

[Miles To Go]

Hardly. Writers all have their own preferences for what they want to write. Look at when Roger Stern and Bill Mantlo left ASM/SSM in the 80s - the new teams ditched grad school + Deb Whitman, et al., brought MJ back (giving her a new backstory, to boot!), started the Alien Costume Saga, and pushed Aunt May and her geriatric halfway house off to the side by making her mad that Peter quit school. Huge change to the status quo so that the new creative teams could focus on the characters and plots they wanted to. Were they lazy and unimaginative, or did they just have different interests?

...I fail to see what point you're making. Those status quo changes brought MJ to the forefront and set her on the path to becoming the definitive love interest for decades.

My point is that the wholesale changes that come very often with creative team shifts are easier to pull off with MJ and Peter not married. It's easier to tell a "Peter is broke" story w/o having to explain why MJ can't work, too.

And again, there's nothing compelling in telling easier stories.

"MJ lost the modeling job because someone else was younger" isn't a story the readers care about (one example of such a reader: me)

ROFL. You don't speak for everyone. I'd be interested, so that torpedos that viewpoint.

Why does easier matter? Well, it gives writers more freedom to tell the stories they want to tell. It's commercial art, but it's still art, and the fewer constraints on the artist, the better (well, when the artist is talented, but people generally don't think they're hiring untalented people, so. . . ). You can often tell when a writer isn't particularly interested in the crossover/event they've been roped into, and it's the same with supporting characters the writer has no affinity for.

That doesn't guarantee the writing is better.

[Tuck]

thats a possible answer, but that's a conclusion people draw just because "much dating" is sorta the assumed opposite to "very married"

there's a few other possibilities in between.

It's also because before the marriage Peter wasn't depicted as someone who was voluntarily single for any extended period. (He's clearly co-dependent )

If Peter's married and you want him to become penniless, you have to have established why MJ's not doing anything to make money (and why Peter wasn't looking out for her at all when he bankrupted himself).

This isn't a problem with Peter being married to MJ, it's a problem with MJ being made into a supermodel instead of being an aspiring/struggling actress who took some modeling gigs to pay the rent.

[bob.schoonover]

ROFL. You don't speak for everyone. I'd be interested, so that torpedos that viewpoint.

I at no point suggested I was speaking for anyone else (if, for example, you don't cut out the first part of the sentence to construct your strawman, you'd see that - also, the "I am a person that doesn't like that story" is the opposite of passing off my opinion as a fact or trying to speak for others.). However, while on the topic of speaking for others, please see what this other commenter said below, passing off subjective opinions as fact (in bold)

What's wrong with that exactly? People are likely to be more invested in something happening to a character everyone LIKES as opposed to a dry and uninteresting person Peter is seeing. MJ didn't get over with fans because she was neglected for Peter's own problems, she got over with fans because she got a good amount of focus.

Nobody should be reading comics for an "easy time" and easy relationships. People enjoy complication.

Those "rough" subplots are what made MJ compelling as she had her own struggles that paralleled Peters'. Real life is full of struggles for both partners in a relationship.

And Peter had plenty of his best stories with Harry while the writers gave MJ page space. As a matter of fact, Peter hasn't had any interesting stories with Harry since they stopped.

[Dangerous]

I would like to add, that although Joe Q is a talented artist, his rendition of Peter was real ugly in this story.