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  1. #31
    Ultimate Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    Oh I'm with you there. MOS was a short-term boost with long-term negative effects.
    "They can be a great people Kal-El, they wish to be. They only lack the light to show the way. For this reason above all, their capacity for good, I have sent them you. My only son." - Jor-El

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  2. #32
    AT EASE, LOO-SUH! Superlad93's Avatar
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    Okay, so I didn't actually exist anywhere near 1986, so I ended up having to do some research for this post, so forgive me if I'm off on some of the details. It's also unfair given I have all my futureman hindsight, so I'm not actually knocking MOS for being what it was when it was.

    Preamble: It's a 6 issue mini. My artist for this is Steve Rude. This is prime time Rude, so it's around the time he's drawing Nexus and Jonny Quest. I really need his ability to take those very classic looking character designs and inject extremely naturalistic character acting into them. I also need his high contrasting shadow work along with his very dynamic camera angles. When a reader gets the comic in their hands and cracks it open, I need them to immediately feel like this doesn't look or feel like the Superman comics of the past decades. This is a foreign and alien leans over a familiar subject.

    * Issue 1 opens on Krypton. This is no direct character dialogue for the majority of this issue. It's implied and shown via art that characters are in fact communicating with one another, but any detailed expounding on the dialogue is done via omniscient narration. It reads like a storybook about this impossible place with these impossible people out somewhere in space. We're coming in at the tail end of this very lived in world. Aesthetic-wise, I'm playing to Rude's established strength of doing really great far future Flash Gordon stuff, but I'm tinting it with creepy and organic shapes and structures that seem like they ungulate. The implication of ground level cultural differences are apparent at a glance, but the world is decidedly alive. Lara is pregnant with Kal-El, and Jor-El has received a formal dismissal from the Science Council. Through just the art their love is clear, but, again, the cultural differences are on display with how they express it, and the narration makes a point to highlight this. We move to the launching for the rocket, and this time it's Lara alone who is going.

    She followed in her father's footsteps and decided to train to become one of the few astronauts on Krypton before space travel was outlawed due to the Brainiac invasion years ago. Lara Lor-Van-El will now be Krypton's Last Astronaut. Escaping the atmosphere is extremely difficult due to the border field that keeps things in and out of Krypton, but due to Jor-El's deigns Lara passes the field. Unfortunately though, the ship is damaged. We see star drive fluid leaking in a great multi panel shot of the little ship going off into the lonely void. She lands on Earth, and there's an immediate shift in the feel and camera work. It's extremely dynamic, and lands in the mud and rain. The North American Air Defense Command has been tracking the object falling into the atmosphere since about the troposphere, and they have boots on the ground within 30 minutes. We dehumanize the government troops similar to Spielberg's E.T. So this is a lot of low to high shots of faces to make them seem imposing and unknowable. No shots of their eyes throughout. These are the "aliens" here.

    They find the rocket, but there's nothing in it. Lara is framed using head on or low camera shots to accentuate humanity and elicit empathy. The beautiful space suit she's wearing is muddied, her hair ragged, and her face is also partially covered in mud as she runs for shelter in the woods far outside of town. She's frantic so she's bumping into trees and branches and doesn't even notice that she uprooted and snapped them, or that she's getting damn close to breaking the land speed record on foot. All she knows is that she's scared for herself and her baby. The narration would be waxing poetic about the amazing feats she's accomplishing alongside the genuine terror that's engulfing her. She finds a cave where a bear attacks her, and this super powered 9 months pregnant 5 foot something woman wrestles it to the ground and away from her, then clutches at her belly and what she could grab from the rocket as she stares the creature down and her eyes faintly glow. It runs off. The crave is her prize, and she breaks down crying saying the first words we've heard from her this whole issue.

    * Issue 2 is all about Clark, Pete, Lana, and the Kents. We open now with Kal's birth. Nothing graphic, but the strong implication is there. By this point we've skipped ahead some and Lara's well aware of her abilities, has set up a kelex unit, and it's now facilitating the birth. We also get the bit of information that Lara has been growing sick, but baby Kal is fine for now. She has a holo recording of Jor-El. It's in Kryptonian, and it's stated in the narration that she would listen to it often for comfort. Eventually she starts to see that her blood is becoming toxic from radiation poisoning she suffered on takeoff from Krypton. Her body protected Kal, but her days are numbered, and she can't stay by her son's side because her blood is becoming so toxic that it'll soon even start to give off the same radiation. So, she has to make arrangements for her boy. She has to find him a safe place to live and thrive with good people, but this world is so scary, dirty, and confusing. How could anyone hope to make a way on and in it? Well, at the very least, they look similar to the humans. This leads us to Jon and Martha. Lara can only hold her son while she's wearing her bright blue protective space suit. It's shielding is sufficient enough to keep Kal safe for now while the radiation is low. We get shots of Lara hovering above the town of Smallville holding her child in one arm, and scanning the lives of these people. It's all so confusing for her. The cultural clash, the dirt, the ignorance, and the fear. But through all the noise she hears Jon and Martha praying for a child. The sincerity comes off their voices and in the steadiness of their hearts. Lara takes interest in them and follows them from the sky for some time. They go to the doctor, tend their farm, talk to people, and so on. Times up for Lara when one night she hears Kal slightly wheeze while he sleeps. She knows full well that she'll have to say goodbye soon, and put her faith in these strangers. She lands on the property with Kal, and then strikes the ground with her free hand to wake the Kents. Martha is out there first, and for a split second she locks eyes with Lara in her beautiful blue space suit, helmet and all, and a chill goes down her spine. She'll carry that image with her forever. We flash forward to Clark as boy of about 12 or so. We've already organically gone through what a Kryptonian's baseline powers are, so we can just dive right in.

    We quickly establish the friendship of Clark, Pete, and Lana. Establish that Clark doesn't know about his heritage or his mom, but he he's got a reduced version of her powers (due to age. And he also lacks flight) and Pete and Lana know about them. Pete runs away from home, and Clark and Lana run after him. It's very coming of age The Goonies and E.T. We work backwards using dialog and narration to figure out why Pete ran off, and confusing emotions run high as a what you assume is a love triangle is further broken down into just lamenting on the change that is growing up. This is also slight foreshadowing for Clark and Lois' triangle for two, and marking that its days are numbered in this continuity because change always comes around like the seasons. While on their adventure outside of town they found a broken down car, they put it in neutral, Pete and Lana have a seat inside, and Clark pulls it using some chains they found. The imagery is suppose to evoke E.T. and the makeshift nature of childhood. They come across the landing sight of Lara's rocket, and an extremist tries to kill everyone there. He's screaming about a cover up, a flying spaceman, and how he lost his job. Clark gets ready to act, but Jon Kent (been trailing them for a while now) steps in, and tries to talk the guy down. Clark's in awe. The same sort of camera shot we had for the unknowable government guys before is reused here for Pa, but we clearly seen Pa's eyes as he towers above the kids. Eventually the guy makes a move and Jon lays him out (his time in the military). After Pa drops off Lana and Pete, the Kent boys head home to find Ma waiting near the storm cellar with a red blanket with a funny looking S on it. The issue ends with them going into the cellar for Clark to see a wall plastered with newspaper clippings and pictures. "We got somethin' we need to talk to you bout, son."

    * Issue 3 is Clark coming home from college. Put a bow on the plot threads from last issue by catching up with Pete (took on his dad's store) and Lana (left town and hasn't kept in touch. Implied that her and Clark ended badly). Pa had a heart attack Clark's senior year. Clark didn't wanna leave for school, but Ma wasn't havin' it. He's fully expecting to get into it with her a bit about him staying now that he's done school, but his mind is as close to made up as he can get it these days. He's directionless by this point, and writing is just about the only thing that makes him feel like he's on solid ground for an hour or two. While clearing out the old house and his room (Ma's finally selling. Getting the farm back is left open for future stories if anyone is down) we basically get an orgy of nods to past stories or Easter eggs. One of them is directly addressed by Clark and narration: the Legion flight ring. Clark has no idea where he got it, but the strangest sensation of nostalgia washes over him along with the smallest of somber smiles, and the beginnings of misty eyes set upon him. It's like a bittersweet half remembered dream. So he keeps the ring like he always does. The idea here being that he was the Superboy for the Legion, but his mind has been wiped by Saturn Girl (a plot thread to be picked up later by any writer who wants it).

    .......
    Last edited by Superlad93; 03-16-2019 at 01:15 PM.
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  3. #33
    AT EASE, LOO-SUH! Superlad93's Avatar
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    Issue 3 continued

    Clark talks with Ma while he cleans the farmhouse out and got her set up, and key words trigger small flashbacks for him to moments of heroics and a scene of Clark (having learned to fly by then) hovering far above the clouds looking at the stars (a parallel to Lara hovering while looking down at the Earth). By the time they're through he knows he can't stay in town. He knows that he has to get back out there and find himself (and maybe even the strange woman who left him with the Kents). We next, after he catches a train out of town, hard cut to find Clark as a freelance war correspondent covering the current war in the DCU at the time (adding some very specific texture to the world and dropping in some shallow JSA WWII ties along with some Amazon ties.) Clark can hear all of the people hurting on both sides and in the towns (and he's been reporting on it), and he can't take it anymore. So at night in just a few minutes he trashes all the weapons, puts every troop back in their base (while they sleep, and before they can even notice), rips apart the battle ground as if a focused storm had gone through the area so that no forces will be able to fight there for quite some time, and fixes all of the homes in the towns. It's scattershot at best. A frenzy of uncontrollable pent up emotions he's felt about this confusing world he's found himself growing up in. His dad's death, the feelings about the woman that left him with the Kents and never reached out, his aimlessness, his Ma being alone, his want to help people, and all of the unfair things that happen in life. All of it lets itself out in a roar of otherworldly power. There's a small child who's awake at night and sees the tsunami of power and passion that is Clark Kent. It's the first time the reader is seeing a Kryptonian's power in this manner not just in the book but in Superman's publication. It's messy, frantic--almost manic, and quite a bit scary. Clark has to physically stop himself from flying out to do the same elsewhere--EVERYWHERE that very night. That actual night Clark was more than ready to force the world into shape--force it to make sense, but he had to stop himself and take a breath. This isn't how he's gonna resolve any of the issues in his life. He has to take a breath, come up with a plan, and take it step by step. The hard part is starting.

    That's the end for now. I'll be picking up the Lara mystery plot point, getting Superman debuted, introducing Lois, Jimmy, the city, and the Daily Planet, and who our "big bad" is, and letting things splash into the DCU as a whole for future stories next post. Appreciate you reading.
    Last edited by Superlad93; 03-16-2019 at 01:20 PM.
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  4. #34
    Extraordinary Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    If at all possible, I wouldn't reboot at all. Kara was dead and the Phantom Zone was destroyed, Kandor was gone, so there were no other Kryptonians to surround him with. Lex could have transitioned to his corrupt businessman incarnation easily. Come up with some reason for Clark's powers to be scaled down a bit. His time as Superboy would need to be in place, but get rid of some of the camp like having him wear a mini version of his adult costume and fly around as Superbaby. That's it, that's ALL they had to do. It would make all of those things easier to bring back if it was ever desired. It was short sighted and honestly kind of selfish to throw all that in the trash for short term reasons.

    A re-telling of the origin with modern (well, modern for the time) writing styles and art would have been good, but don't do anything drastic. It would also help to eliminate some of the other camp, like the goofy specifics of Krypto and Argo City's survivals of Krypton's destruction.

  5. #35
    Phantom Zone Escapee manofsteel1979's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bat39 View Post
    Yeah, the timeline thing always bothered me. What's more, it actually didn't even make sense! As per MOS' internal chronology, Superman has been around for three years by the end of the mini-series. And Superman #1 picks up shortly after that, but is supposedly contemporaneous with the rest of the DCU. But there's no way that all the other events of the DCU that were still in continuity all happened within a span of three years!

    I didn't know they tried to rectify it as early as the 90's though. I always assumed that they stuck to Byrne's timeline, such as it was, up till the continuous retconning of the 2000's.

    Funnily enough, DC took a different approach to rebooting each member of the Trinity. Batman got a 'soft reboot' wherein his origin was retold but everything else was more or less still in continuity, unless explicitly contradicted. Wonder Woman was rebooted from scratch and introduced as a new hero in the present-day DCU. Superman got a weird mix of the two approaches where he was completely rebooted, but with a time lag such that he was still an established hero in the present-day DCU. Personally, Batman's approach was the best one, and ideally what they should have done with Superman. I believe that's actually what Byrne wanted to do, but it was DC who forced him to do a hard reboot and wipe out ALL past continuity...
    Well around Zero Hour they started to futz around with it a bit. It wasn't overt but there was some subtle retconing of things like MOS and the early Byrne stuff happening concurently with his peers.
    Last edited by manofsteel1979; 11-02-2018 at 03:51 PM.
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  6. #36
    (formerly "Superman") JAK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by superduperman View Post
    I am of the opinion that the reboot just wasn't thought out very far. They wanted a more realistic Superman and didn't think out the consequences very much. So you end up with problems with the Legion and everyone else's timeline as a result. This is why I liked New 52, I think it tried a little harder to be the clean sweep that COIE was supposed to be. It still ran into some mistakes but most of the missteps were more bad creative decisions rather than continuity problems.
    Both were equally as botchy. Technically, though not in concept initially, the Byrne reboot throwing out everything that came before and not trying to shoehorn anything (much) in is one reason why it lasted as long as it did. There wasn't a huge plan, but they tried to think everything through and give Superman a history so you knew where he might go since you knew where he'd been. That didn't exist in the New52 because they tried to be many things to all people while still being a huge revamp. Those don't sync well, and even with the good spots it had, that showed.


    Upon more thinking, I now know exactly what I'd have done, and it's something I've said on here, before (in fact, I can't believe I didn't remember until now!): the heroes beat the Crisis and save their universes - but the process reveals something they'd never before considered: the multiverse (this time, which is unusual) is expanding from the CENTER, and now a new universe is born. All the heroes left from the other universes vow to keep an eye on this new "core" universe when they can and help if they're sure it can't do it on their own - and they, along with us, turn our attention to this brave new universe.

    Translation: you'll still see the past versions again every once in awhile, and in 20+ years or so the cycle will potentially repeat (or the cycle will start, bringing energy that villains will try to harness that may sometimes halt said growth - non-story version being "if things are going well, no new universe" lol) and another new "core" universe will form - with that universe being the one we see in the books. It's a "passing of the torch," but not a wipe-out of what came before, which may not make everybody happy, but should at least be better than the way they do it now.
    Last edited by JAK; 11-02-2018 at 06:18 PM.
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  7. #37
    Astonishing Member superduperman's Avatar
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    I've gone over this in the past, to the point where I'm sure people are sick of hearing it by now. But there's something about Superman's origin that always bothered me: Why didn't the science council believe Jor-El when he told them the planet was about to blow up? Well, what if they did and planned to save themselves? The story starts with Jor-El discovering some unusual radiation coming from the planet's core. That's when he finds a bomb left over from the Kandorian War thousands of years earlier. They were driven off the planet but not before planting the bomb as a failsafe. The main Kandorian battleship was destroyed before it had a chance to set off the bomb. The years of heat at the core and deteriorating condition of the bomb has made it unstable. If it blows, the planet goes with it.

    Jor-El tries to warn the governing council but they dismiss his concerns since the bomb is so old. Jor-El doesn't understand why they aren't taking this seriously and tells his brother, Zor-El. Zor-El talks to some of this contacts in the governing council and finds out that they already knew but didn't know of any safe way to deactivate it so they built a ship to save themselves. Jor-El is furious when he hears this and decides he's not going to let his family die so he tells Zor-El he plans to steal the ship. Both Jor-El and Zor-El gather their families and board the ship. But the governing council got word of Jor-El's plan and try to stop him from taking off. The ship is already programmed for Earth. A world circling a yellow star. The radiation will give them powers and abilities far beyond those of mortal men. The council planned to use their powers to conquer Earth and enslave it's inhabitants.

    The ship breaks atmosphere but the council fires the world cannons. One of them damages the star drive. The ship isn't going to make it. Both Jor and Zor put their children in escape pods already programmed for Earth. Jor-El packs all his journals and an emergency message for Kal should he not make it with all of Krypton's history in it. He also gives him a necklace with a medallion on it. One side has the Kryptonian Tower of Wisdom. The other has the House of El. Both Kal and Kara are sent out in their escape pods. Just as their parents get into their pods, the ship blows up. A couple months later, so does the planet. Kal's ship crashes at night so no one sees it. But not before causing a massive disruption of the electrical field.

    The next day, Jonathon and Martha Kent are driving home from a trip into town when Martha sees smoke coming from the north forty. They get out and investigate where they find Kal's ship. A month later, Jonathon is burying the ship in the same spot. Martha goes upstairs to wake little Clark. When she opens the door, she is shocked to see him floating on the ceiling. Martha panics and goes screaming for Jonathon. Fast forward five years later. Children are playing at recess but Clark is sitting outside the principle's office looking at his medallion. Jonathon and Martha leave the office and tell Clark to follow them. They are driving home. Jonathon is the first to speak. "We talked about this, didn't we? You can only go to school if you can keep your...gifts...a secret." Clark interrupts. "But Pa, Kenny was hurting Pete! I had to stop him!" Jonathon stops the truck abruptly. "Dammit, Clark! You threw that boy over a hundred feet! You broke his arm! We'll be lucky if his parents don't sue us!" Jonathon stops and realizes he's been too harsh on Clark.

    "Look, Clark, this strength of yours. You've got to hide it or people will be afraid of you". Clark is disappointed. Martha tries to comfort him. "Clark, honey, someday you will do great things with your gifts. Someday, you will use them to assist humanity. But for right now, you have to keep them a secret, okay?" Clark nods. They drive home. Flash forward 12 years later. Martha calls for Clark outside. A 17 year old Clark walks out of barn. Martha tells him to go get his father for dinner. When she turns around, he's already gone. Jonathon is fixing an old tractor in the field. Clark startles him when he says that he should just get a new one. Jonathon is trying to unscrew a spark plug when Clark unscrews it for him, easily. Jon turns on the tractor. Clark starts to hear someone calling for help a mile away. He tells Jon to turn off the tractor. "That girl's in trouble!" Clark speeds off. A young girl is stuck on the railroad tracks outside town. The train is coming at her. Clark speeds past the train so fast no one sees. He wraps his arms around the girl just as the train hits him.

    Jonathon hears the crash and runs towards it. He sees the front of the train caved in. Clark startles him again as he turns around and sees Clark holding the girl. "Pa, what am I?" That night, Martha gets off the phone with chief Parker. The girl is fine. She's being looked at at the local hospital. She doesn't remember seeing anything because Clark moved so fast. Clark is staring at the medallion again. Jonathon approaches him. Jonathon tells him that they found him with that around his neck. That he'd cry every time they tried to take it off so they let him keep it. Clark says he wants to see the ship. They both get in the truck and drive out to the north forty. Jonathon goes to get the shovels from the back of the truck. By the time he gets back, Clark has already pulled up all the ground. Clark touches the ship and all the information about Krypton flows directly into his brain. Jonathon gets scared and thinks he's hurt. Clark stands up. "Clark, what happened?" Clark answers: "I know!" Jonathon asks: "What do you know?". Clark responds: "Everything."

    Fast forward seven years later. Clark is a freelance journalist for whoever will buy his stories. He's in a middle eastern country in the middle of a military coup. The military rounds up all reporters from other countries and takes them prisoner. Including Clark. As a message to America, the general leading the coup threatens to shoot all the American journalists. Clark knows he has to act to fast. So he uses his super-breath to blow sand up and distract the soldiers. He then uses super-speed to get all the reporters out of the country. After he gets back to the states, he has a conversation with Ma and Pa. He realizes he can't just stay on the sidelines anymore. He wants to use his powers to help people but doesn't know how. Clark goes to his old treehouse, conveniently called his "Fortress of Solitude". That's when he sees an old poster of a circus strongman and gets an idea.
    Now listen to me, Clark! This great strength of yours--you've got to hide it from people or they'll be scared of you!

  8. #38
    Took me a while, I'm back Netherman14's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sacred Knight View Post
    Oh I'm with you there. MOS was a short-term boost with long-term negative effects.
    It just so drastically changed everything about Superman, to the point that he was basically unrecognizable.

    - Krypton was a depressing dystopia that actually deserved to die because it apparently was such a horrible place

    - The Kents lived to the present day in universe, thus getting to see Clark become Superman

    - There was no Krypto, no Supergirl. no Kandor, no Fortress. no Brainiac.

    - It kicked off the mopey Superman that is so prevalent nowadays.

    - It made Clark identify only as human, instead of respecting both his Kryptonian nature and Human nurture.

    - He was a paragon of hope who was deputized by the mayor to be able to arrest people at will , rather than a rough-and-tumble outlaw vigilante hunted by the government and police.
    Last edited by Netherman14; 11-03-2018 at 03:45 AM.
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  9. #39
    Phantom Zone Escapee manofsteel1979's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Netherman14 View Post
    It just so drastically changed everything about Superman, to the point that he was basically unrecognizable.

    - Krypton was a depressing dystopia that actually deserved to die because it apparently was such a horrible place

    - The Kents lived to the present day in universe, thus getting to see Clark become Superman

    - There was no Krypto, no Supergirl. no Kandor, no Fortress. no Brainiac.

    - It kicked off the mopey Superman that is so prevalent nowadays.

    - It made Clark identify only as human, instead of respecting both his Kryptonian nature and Human nurture.
    I wouldn't go so far to say he was unrecognizable. He still Kal-El from Krypton.. He was still Clark Kent. He had the same costume. He still had the same power set (just on a smaller scale) Lois was still his girlfriend. Jimmy his pal etc. Upon initial glace he was still recognizably Superman. However a lot of the finer details changed pretty drastically compared to the previous version.

    Even New 52 was recognizable as Superman. You just had to squint a bit harder because this time some of the broadstrokes even changed.
    Last edited by manofsteel1979; 11-03-2018 at 03:54 AM.
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  10. #40
    Father Son Kamehameha < Kuwagaton's Avatar
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    I just don't get it. The 1986 Man of Steel made him a mopey character? It kind of seems like things are just attributed to it because of the fact that it was different.

    The idea behind not having those things (Krypto, in his origin is because they have no place in his origin. All of those ideas were invented a number of years later and some not by Siegel. The original Superman didn't even know he was from Krypton until 10 years later. Which I thought was a good enough influence, but I will always adore Secret Origin #1 from 1986. Having Boring in an era where those artists were still able to contribute was the best touch, but Roy Thomas always had a knack for fleshing out the same very old stories.

    Quote Originally Posted by Superlad93 View Post
    That's the end for now. I'll be picking up the Lara mystery plot point, getting Superman debuted, introducing Lois, Jimmy, the city, and the Daily Planet, and who our "big bad" is, and letting things splash into the DCU as a whole for future stories next post. Appreciate you reading.
    Very cool. Isn't it fun? I think Year One was the first origin to not assume that the hero needed a costume by the end of the first issue, but it feels right. I really like the idea of Lara holding the torch not as someone who will drop it to Kal, but hold it until he can hold it himself, if that makes sense. I think one of the greatest struggles since 1938 has been giving her real meaning.

  11. #41
    Took me a while, I'm back Netherman14's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kuwagaton View Post
    I just don't get it. The 1986 Man of Steel made him a mopey character? It kind of seems like things are just attributed to it because of the fact that it was different.

    The idea behind not having those things (Krypto, in his origin is because they have no place in his origin. All of those ideas were invented a number of years later and some not by Siegel. The original Superman didn't even know he was from Krypton until 10 years later. Which I thought was a good enough influence, but I will always adore Secret Origin #1 from 1986. Having Boring in an era where those artists were still able to contribute was the best touch, but Roy Thomas always had a knack for fleshing out the same very old stories.
    This isn't mopey? no offense, but it is.

    The Man of Steel V1986 #1 (of 6) - From Out of the Green Dawn (1986_10) - Page 24.jpg
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  12. #42
    Father Son Kamehameha < Kuwagaton's Avatar
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    I figured you meant that one scene in the first issue. Where he explains that the public reaction to him, the first superhuman in this context, was overwhelming. I don't know why that assumes he had never been repulsed before, should never be put off going forward, or would consistently fall out with the world around him, though.

  13. #43
    Ultimate Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    To me that scene is more of a reflection of why its a mistake to have the Kents still alive that far into Clark's life. I find it far more intriguing when he had to navigate the beginning of his career on his own.

    They're cute, loving characters. I love them. But in stories showing the past.
    "They can be a great people Kal-El, they wish to be. They only lack the light to show the way. For this reason above all, their capacity for good, I have sent them you. My only son." - Jor-El

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  14. #44
    AT EASE, LOO-SUH! Superlad93's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kuwagaton View Post
    Very cool. Isn't it fun? I think Year One was the first origin to not assume that the hero needed a costume by the end of the first issue, but it feels right. I really like the idea of Lara holding the torch not as someone who will drop it to Kal, but hold it until he can hold it himself, if that makes sense. I think one of the greatest struggles since 1938 has been giving her real meaning.
    Thanks man, and yeah, this is actually a lot of fun. Getting your head into what the style and frame of mind was back then is a nice challenge, and makes you a bit more appreciative of the era and the writers in it. Reading MOS again made me realize just how quickly we got to the suit and full on Superman. I'm for sure more of a fan of Miller's style with Year One with the build to it. But I can appreciate where a writer at the time is coming from when they decide to move relatively fast to the suit. They wanna hold the reader's attention, get them into some awe, and get them to the comic's namesake as soon as possible. Hopefully that's theoretically alleviated by technically showing Lara in her fantastic space suit (that's tooootally not gonna somehow inspire Clark's action suit in some way) and doing super stuff.

    And for whatever it's worth, Superman has been mopey and introspective since the late 50s. People forget that Superman's Silver age is basically an era built on and around very thoroughly exploring all of his insecurities, flaws, failings, fears, and shames. Every other story Superman would get worried that no one liked him anymore, or that he was obsolete, or that his friends didn't need him. He was a guy so tied to the idea of his ability and standing being what gave him value and meaning to others around him that he got jealous of one of his own powers (shooting a small version of himself out of his hand that was better than him).

    No real comment on the Kents being alive or dead though. It's really up to the writer's discretion how often Clark works through a situation with them. I'm not really about "removing the temptation" but I've always appreciated, on a narrative level, one of his adopted parents passing of natural means. The lesson means more to me than one or the other not being there to talk him through whatever have you.
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  15. #45
    Astonishing Member superduperman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Netherman14 View Post
    It just so drastically changed everything about Superman, to the point that he was basically unrecognizable.

    - Krypton was a depressing dystopia that actually deserved to die because it apparently was such a horrible place

    - The Kents lived to the present day in universe, thus getting to see Clark become Superman

    - There was no Krypto, no Supergirl. no Kandor, no Fortress. no Brainiac.

    - It kicked off the mopey Superman that is so prevalent nowadays.

    - It made Clark identify only as human, instead of respecting both his Kryptonian nature and Human nurture.

    - He was a paragon of hope who was deputized by the mayor to be able to arrest people at will , rather than a rough-and-tumble outlaw vigilante hunted by the government and police.
    I've said before that the reboot was an overreaction to the SA. They wanted to eliminate any chance of those aspects ever being brought back. And it was obvious that by the mid to late nineties these restrictions put too many limitations on the creators creatively. You don't turn Metropolis into a techno future wonderland because you have a ton of other ideas lined up. One of the reasons why I liked things like Smallville and New 52 is that it managed to find a healthy middle ground.
    Now listen to me, Clark! This great strength of yours--you've got to hide it from people or they'll be scared of you!

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