Do you think Gwen Stacy should ever return?

[Tuck]

616 Gwen should never return.

At the same time, adaptations that use her should stop killing her.

[LK3185]

No, its a fixed part of Peter Parker's mythos at this point and Marvel already Alt Gwen's to play with that should be enough.

Also, the Main Gwen Stacy was pretty boring tbh and would be totally different if she was brought back anyway given the time we're in.

[AngelJD]

To be honest for all that found her boring: That's what writers and character developments are made for.

I'm a fan of 616 MJ. HOWEVER let's just take that comics that MJ was in of her in the 60's and 70's till Gwen dies. Reading those issues I was so shock to find a character I disliked so much. She was a catty, brainless, and had zero depth and danced like she was high. She also was self centered and when other worried about missing friends she could only care about her paycheck (which is fine if you add worrying about your missing friends possibly in danger to that). Not a fan of THAT MJ. Gwen not perfect and many flaws and while emotional gave more care about others then MJ showcased during those issues and that left more of a impact for me to her then MJ of those 1960's and beginning 1970 issues.

MJ existing and used had however developments by writers that shaped her into who she is now (both good and bad). MJ isn't 1960's or 1970's MJ anymore. As people we change and hopefully grow. Story writers hopefully make good stories showing growth (MJ and Gwen are fictional characters thus they are not frozen to be presented just one way if a writer desires and has quality).

If a writer used 616 Gwen as well hopefully the writers will aim for developments, fun, showcase interesting things that Gwen can be used for and much more. If given time and good tales Gwen transforms into a different person then who she was just like all characters do in time and changing cultures.

[LK3185]

To be honest for all that found her boring: That's what writers and character developments are made for.

I'm a fan of 616 MJ. HOWEVER let's just take that comics that MJ was in of her in the 60's and 70's till Gwen dies. Reading those issues I was so shock to find a character I disliked so much. She was a catty, brainless, and had zero depth and danced like she was high. She also was self centered and when other worried about missing friends she could only care about her paycheck (which is fine if you add worrying about your missing friends possibly in danger to that). Not a fan of THAT MJ. Gwen not perfect and many flaws and while emotional gave more care about others then MJ showcased during those issues and that left more of a impact for me to her then MJ of those 1960's and beginning 1970 issues.

MJ existing and used had however developments by writers that shaped her into who she is now (both good and bad). MJ isn't 1960's or 1970's MJ anymore. As people we change and hopefully grow. Story writers hopefully make good stories showing growth (MJ and Gwen are fictional characters thus they are not frozen to be presented just one way if a writer desires and has quality).

If a writer used 616 Gwen as well hopefully the writers will aim for developments, fun, showcase interesting things that Gwen can be used for and much more. If given time and good tales Gwen transforms into a different person then who she was just like all characters do in time and changing cultures.

The issue with this is twofold. One, MJ got development soon after Gwen died, writers took time to do that and shape the character how they saw fit. Gwen was seen as this perfect girlfriend who's innocence (also not knowing Peter was Spider-man) was who she was. After basically, 50 years, You'd have to tell a hell of a story to get Gwen back alive (save a reboot like Ultimate was) and I think its better left alone because her death was important to shape Peter and MJ. Secondly, Marvel is already using alternate Gwen where anything interesting with a Main Gwen besides being Peter Love interest can be told.

Basically, the only reason to bring back main Gwen is if you wanted Peter to have her as a love interest and I feel that undercuts her death.

[AngelJD]

The issue with this is twofold. One, MJ got development soon after Gwen died, writers took time to do that and shape the character how they saw fit. Gwen was seen as this perfect girlfriend who's innocence (also not knowing Peter was Spider-man) was who she was. After basically, 50 years, You'd have to tell a hell of a story to get Gwen back alive (save a reboot like Ultimate was) and I think its better left alone because her death was important to shape Peter and MJ. Secondly, Marvel is already using alternate Gwen where anything interesting with a Main Gwen besides being Peter Love interest can be told.

Basically, the only reason to bring back main Gwen is if you wanted Peter to have her as a love interest and I feel that undercuts her death.

Yes but how people see a character then suddenly writers able to write a good story that disrupts things can alter perceptions (good and bad). MJ gor altered and so can Gwen. Perfection in various things including as people is opinionated and really a unreachable goal in ways. True that after 50 years the skill needed and odds will be a challenge for a writer. But if a writer has ideas, wants and plans for such things, then is ready they should be allowed the chance if they worked out the details and put in the time. Just because something might be hard doesn't mean it can't be done or worth the effort if it's believed in and more. Just 'playing it safe' gives dull stores and nothing remarkable so I value when writers take a chance provided they went over it and put there best abilities and time into it.

To bring back Gwen a writer must be able to have her find a place as a individual and part of the cast to fit (even if it's not agian a 'love interest' somehow which I prefer not but agian all on the quality of a writer but Gwen just trying to discover and experience all that she missed, all te things that left a impact and change in culture, a gal out of time, or maybe cover things like maybe she isn't out of time but know more than she lets on having knowledge from heaven as she watched over Peter and MJ (SHE knows about the Peter and MJ deal with the Devil as she was meant to be their child's 'Guardian Angel' and has made her own deal to be sent back to fix things that will allow Gwen to rip the deal in half or lose to the Devil with a time limit as a example then she either goes back to heaven as a Guardian Angel in training for the child or goes to Hell as the Devil's newest succubus). It all depends on the writer(s). Nothing is solid.

Plus that 'lesson' from her death and impact is either lessened now for the two (Peter and MJ) with many life experiences now influencing them plus as you wrote it help shaped them. Past tense thus her death shaped them and even if she came back they were still and forever more shaped by that time impacted in their subconsciousness that even a return won't ruin their character development but might get them so worked up to ensure Gwen never dies again to extreme methods motivated by her death and what they felt. I can see MJ doing the 'Mom Arm' on Gwen when driving

[boots]

leave gwen and uncle ben be

[LK3185]

Yes but how people see a character then suddenly writers able to write a good story that disrupts things can alter perceptions (good and bad). MJ gor altered and so can Gwen. Perfection in various things including as people is opinionated and really a unreachable goal in ways. True that after 50 years the skill needed and odds will be a challenge for a writer. But if a writer has ideas, wants and plans for such things, then is ready they should be allowed the chance if they worked out the details and put in the time. Just because something might be hard doesn't mean it can't be done or worth the effort if it's believed in and more. Just 'playing it safe' gives dull stores and nothing remarkable so I value when writers take a chance provided they went over it and put there best abilities and time into it.

To bring back Gwen a writer must be able to have her find a place as a individual and part of the cast to fit (even if it's not agian a 'love interest' somehow which I prefer not but agian all on the quality of a writer but Gwen just trying to discover and experience all that she missed, all te things that left a impact and change in culture, a gal out of time, or maybe cover things like maybe she isn't out of time but know more than she lets on having knowledge from heaven as she watched over Peter and MJ (SHE knows about the Peter and MJ deal with the Devil as she was meant to be their child's 'Guardian Angel' and has made her own deal to be sent back to fix things that will allow Gwen to rip the deal in half or lose to the Devil with a time limit as a example then she either goes back to heaven as a Guardian Angel in training for the child or goes to Hell as the Devil's newest succubus). It all depends on the writer(s). Nothing is solid.

Plus that 'lesson' from her death and impact is either lessened now for the two (Peter and MJ) with many life experiences now influencing them plus as you wrote it help shaped them. Past tense thus her death shaped them and even if she came back they were still and forever more shaped by that time impacted in their subconsciousness that even a return won't ruin their character development but might get them so worked up to ensure Gwen never dies again to extreme methods motivated by her death and what they felt. I can see MJ doing the 'Mom Arm' on Gwen when driving

While i see and understand your points, its where we'll just have to agree to disagree but also, we both agree that it would take alot of work for a writer to do all that with Gwen... and The real reason I think its less likely is because of the time issue. As time goes on, less people will assoiactie Gwen Stacy with Peter Parker in the main canon, thus less chance of it happening. Sure, you've had the movies but that's different. We had a decade run where the writer didn't even care about a legacy love interest for Peter... let alone Gwen. Not to mention that because different Gwen is being featured now, that makes it less likely to revisit.

The main Gwen Stacy would need someone like you running the book and that isn't so likely as time goes on.

[Frontier]

Gwen coming back needs a real (longer than a story arc) hook and plan. Is she Peter's new one true love (and if so, why her, and why are we doing one true loves again)? What's her role in the book otherwise? Can her manner of return undo Sins Past? If not, why are we even doing this?

I have a hard time seeing a writer making a convincing argument for Gwen as Peter's "one true love" at this point, not because Peter doesn't still feel strongly for Gwen (he does), but romantically he pretty much outgrew her.

616 Gwen should never return.

At the same time, adaptations that use her should stop killing her.

The only time they actually adapted her death was in one movie. Otherwise she's generally left alone.

I still want to see them do an animated version of her death though, since Spectacular was never able to get to that point.

[comicscollector]

No,i don´t think Gwen Stacy 616 should be resurected.
But Gwen Stacy was a great character so ever since i read the "return" of Gwen Stacy in the original Clone Saga (ASM#139-151) i think stories that feature her as a Clone or new stories set in the Past with her are cool to me because of the importance of the character in the Spider-Man continuity.

[Tuck]

The only time they actually adapted her death was in one movie. Otherwise she's generally left alone.

I still want to see them do an animated version of her death though, since Spectacular was never able to get to that point.

Ultimate killed her too. (Brought her back as a clone, but it still felt like it was done because that's what Gwen Stacy does, get murdered.)

And yeah, they were planning to do it in Spectacular too.

With TASM, whatever their plans were, once they saw that Garfield and Stone were the the only thing about the movie everyone liked, they should have changed course.

Her death is fetishized. (Even mentioned how unusual it is to find a living Gwen Stacy in the first issue of Ghost Spider.)

[Speed Force League Unlimited]

I couldn't agree with you more as neither has done anything that warrants the resurrections which spoiled their memorable exit stories.

If not for May, Peter wouldn't work for Horizon Labs after being blacklisted from photojournalism.

[Frontier]

Ultimate killed her too. (Brought her back as a clone, but it still felt like it was done because that's what Gwen Stacy does, get murdered.)

I guess if we're counting Ultimate as an adaption and not as an Elseworlds, but I was speaking more of other media adaptions.

And yeah, they were planning to do it in Spectacular too.

Yeah, I really wish we could've seen how they would've handled it.

With TASM, whatever their plans were, once they saw that Garfield and Stone were the the only thing about the movie everyone liked, they should have changed course.

Granted, Gwen's death was probably one of the most emotionally powerful moments in the film (and the entire ASM films as a whole).

Her death is fetishized. (Even mentioned how unusual it is to find a living Gwen Stacy in the first issue of Ghost Spider.)

I don't know if I'd say it's fetishized. I think the fact that it's brought up so much is probably more responsible for Gwen being remembered then for just being Gwen.

[Celgress]

If not for May, Peter wouldn't work for Horizon Labs after being blacklisted from photojournalism.

Ah, they could have found another way to get him there.

Edit - IMO about the only worthwhile thing Aunt May had done since her return post-Amazing 400 happened in the Conversation. Sadly, those in charge of Marvel retconned that story.

[AngelJD]

That one aspect of how many Gwen Stacys seem to die in a Multiverse that allows anything to be possible could in itself be a story arc and a mystery. I know in Spider-Gwen series the writer Lacour had at the end 617 Gwen studying the Multiverse and found how odd that pattern what should be a patternless almost infinite Multiverse and wanted to research it more to see if there was a cause of some reason. Seeing if one Gwen might of setoff a chain reaction of some kind or some force was doing this and why.

[Russ840]

No, never.